New Recto owner, got a few questions..

[Melvin1011]

Hi everyone, new Boogie owner here, just got a Single Rectifier Solo head. I'm still learning the amp and reading the manual to glean all I can to make it do what I want, but I think my cab (Marshall 1936 with T-75's) is not a good match, it seems the tone is too dark for my tastes. I thought about trying to bump the upper mids with an EQ in the loop, but the loop doesn't like my GE-7. I have a couple pairs of EL-34's, but they are running at like 40ma which I think is too hot, what's the plate voltage on the SR anyway? I could calculate the required bias current and find some tubes that draw close to that. What I'm trying to get is a tone that is fast and responsive to the pick attack but that also has decent sustain.
Any help is appreciated.
Thanks,
Phil

 

[tele_jas]

The boogie parallel loops are great for preserving the tone, but are terrible to use with anything but time based FX (such as delay & reverb). So an EQ wouldn't really do anything, but some have had luck but you have to forget everything you've known about setting an EQ in an amp's FX loop and start from scratch figuring it out.

Not sure about the voltage the tubes are supposed to run at, but boogies are generally set a little cool (from what I've read) and boogies have a "fixed" bias, which means it isn't adjustable, except from 6L6's to EL34's, unless you have your amp modded with a bias trim pot.

 

[Baba]

Also, I too, did not find that cab to be the best choice with these heads, I actually sold a Rectoverb because I didn't like the way it sounded with that cab, I should have sold the cab!

It seems the V30's are a good combination, I have the Boogie 2x12 recto cab, and an Avatar 4x12 with V30's, I like the way they both sound.

 

[redmax61]

I'd have to agree with Baba. You may consider trying a few different cabs to see if there's one out there that's more to your liking. A different speaker and cab combination will make all the difference in the world.

I would think that to be much more effective at acquiring the right tone than the use of an EQ.

 

[Melvin1011]

Do you think if I just replaced the speakers, say to V30's or C90's in this cab that it would make a huge difference, or is the cab itself a large part of it?

 

[Dale B.]

Hi everyone, new Boogie owner here, just got a Single Rectifier Solo head. I'm still learning the amp and reading the manual to glean all I can to make it do what I want, but I think my cab (Marshall 1936 with T-75's) is not a good match, it seems the tone is too dark for my tastes. I thought about trying to bump the upper mids with an EQ in the loop, but the loop doesn't like my GE-7. I have a couple pairs of EL-34's, but they are running at like 40ma which I think is too hot, what's the plate voltage on the SR anyway? I could calculate the required bias current and find some tubes that draw close to that. What I'm trying to get is a tone that is fast and responsive to the pick attack but that also has decent sustain.
Any help is appreciated.
Thanks,
Phil

If you're running EL34's that fall within the same specifications of the tubes that Mesa sells, the plate voltage is somewhere in the neighborhood between 445 and 455 while in the highest power setting. No one can really tell you where it's at without actually checking it out.

If you're running 6L6GC's that fall within those same specifications that I described above, the plate voltage will fall between 465 and 475 while in the highest power setting.

Here are ballpark figures that I've taken from several Dual Rectifiers and Triple Rectifiers:

Spongy/Tube - 350 to 375
Bold/Tube - 390 to 410
Spongy/Silicon Diode - 400 to 425
Bold/Silicon Diode - 445 to 475

Those are just ballpark figures that I've gotten from different Dual and Triple Rectifiers while using EL34's and 6L6GC's in the amp. The Single may actually look a bit different and I'm not familiar with all of it's power amp modes...that's if it has more than one.

Dale

 

[Melvin1011]

Dale,
Thanks for the info. The plate voltages you gave are pretty much spot on. I went ahead and measured them on my own amp and I got 463V on the plate with the 6L6's and 450V with the EL34's. My EL34's are pulling about 42ma. For 70% MPD at 450V based on 25W I get 38.9ma which means they are running a bit hot. Do you think it will be Ok to run it like this?

 

[Dale B.]

Dale,
Thanks for the info. The plate voltages you gave are pretty much spot on. I went ahead and measured them on my own amp and I got 463V on the plate with the 6L6's and 450V with the EL34's. My EL34's are pulling about 42ma. For 70% MPD at 450V based on 25W I get 38.9ma which means they are running a bit hot. Do you think it will be Ok to run it like this?

If they're drawing 42 mA per tube, you're just upward of 75% plate dissipation, which is still fine as far as the tubes are concerned.

Now, I'm not too sure if the Output Transformer is capable of dealing with that kind of strain over a very long period of time. When I say "very long", I'm speaking in terms of years instead of weeks or months.

You could also look at this from a 6L6GC's standpoint as well. If the plate voltage stayed in or around 465 while some 6L6GC's were being biased up, you would have to have a Cathode Current of 38 mA for 60% of the MPD and right above 45 mA for 70% MPD. So, your EL34's are right there in the middle of all of that.

I know a guy that claims that his OT went down after using JJ KT88's in his Dual or Triple Rectifier as per Eurotubes' specifications. I could see that happening because 75+ mA per tube is just mega strain. I've actually run those tubes in a Dual Rectifier for about a month and nothing bad happened, but I can't speak from personal experience on what the long-term negative effects will be. Again, I think 75+ mA per tube is just insane because the OT is seeing way too much current.

I think you would be fine with them running that hot. The power tubes will more than likely go before the amp will. Also, 84 mA from a global standpoint isn't a whole lot, but, again, I know nothing about the OT's specs.

You're just running hot EL34's. You're getting a cleaner tone out of the power section.

Dale

 

[Melvin1011]

Thanks Dale, looks like using my EL34's is definitely an option. Although at this point I'm not sure if I going to run them or the stock Mesa 6L6's for the time being. Part of the issue I'm having is that every Mesa amp I have played has a certain 'feel' to it that is different from every other amp I've had. It's hard to describe the only thing I can think of is that it feels like my strings are made of plastic and I can't feel the pick attack, it's as if there is a delayed reaction to the pick kind of like someone else is playing and I'm just listening. The actual tone is good, but the feel is bothering me. I thought getting the tubes biased up would help, but it didn't much. It may be that this is just the way these amps are and I'll have to learn to live with it. Or maybe it's the speakers, or just that I need to crank it really loud. Actually, as I type I now remember playing a Rectoverb 1x12 combo at GC that felt great.., come to think of it, the LoneStars I've played felt good too. Hmm..

 

[Dale B.]

Thanks Dale, looks like using my EL34's is definitely an option. Although at this point I'm not sure if I going to run them or the stock Mesa 6L6's for the time being. Part of the issue I'm having is that every Mesa amp I have played has a certain 'feel' to it that is different from every other amp I've had. It's hard to describe the only thing I can think of is that it feels like my strings are made of plastic and I can't feel the pick attack, it's as if there is a delayed reaction to the pick kind of like someone else is playing and I'm just listening. The actual tone is good, but the feel is bothering me. I thought getting the tubes biased up would help, but it didn't much. It may be that this is just the way these amps are and I'll have to learn to live with it. Or maybe it's the speakers, or just that I need to crank it really loud. Actually, as I type I now remember playing a Rectoverb 1x12 combo at GC that felt great.., come to think of it, the LoneStars I've played felt good too. Hmm..

Ok.... Are you running hotter tubes or did someone install a bias pot in your amp?

 

[Boogiebabies]

42ma should be fine. The tubes will drift a bit anyway and wander down to 39-40. 2ma is nominal and wont really runf your tubes much hotter. The only issue is, is 42 ma or 75% MPD what the circuit was designed for.
I find if you run Mesa's hotter than 60-70% they get mushy. At 50-60% they are in the right ara for great power and headroom.

 

[fdesalvo]

Melvin,

I love the feel that the Boogies give my strings! Sort of an elastic/springy feel. I love that. The TSL100 I was playing through made the strings feel very stiff and lifeless by contrast.

 

[Dale B.]

42ma should be fine. The tubes will drift a bit anyway and wander down to 39-40. 2ma is nominal and wont really runf your tubes much hotter. The only issue is, is 42 ma or 75% MPD what the circuit was designed for.
I find if you run Mesa's hotter than 60-70% they get mushy. At 50-60% they are in the right ara for great power and headroom.

That all depends on that type of power tubes you're running the power section. If you're running cooler tubes in the power section that are drawing upwards of 60 to 70%, they will become very mushy. If you're running Mesa spec tubes in them, which are biased up in that area, they can sound pretty good. If you're running really hot tubes in the power section, the power section will remain clean and it will be a bit more compressed. I've seen/heard all of that between 60 and 70%

I've stuck everything in a Recto just to see what it will do.

Dale

 

[Melvin1011]

Ok.... Are you running hotter tubes or did someone install a bias pot in your amp?

I'm assuming they are hotter tubes. When I put my EL34's in with the switch in the EL34 position I get about 42ma. The amp is stock.

 

[Melvin1011]

Melvin,

I love the feel that the Boogies give my strings! Sort of an elastic/springy feel. I love that. The TSL100 I was playing through made the strings feel very stiff and lifeless by contrast.

I like your description of the feel and the more I play my amp, the less it bothers me. It'll take time for me to get used to because I have to adjust how I pick. Right now it's tripping me up a little because I'm used to my JSX which I can only describe the feel of as you pick and the note begins instantly and you can feel the pick slice through the string. I like the tones I'm getting from the recto though, there are all kinds of treasures hidden in there.

 

[Dale B.]

Ok.... Are you running hotter tubes or did someone install a bias pot in your amp?

I'm assuming they are hotter tubes. When I put my EL34's in with the switch in the EL34 position I get about 42ma. The amp is stock.

They are hotter EL34's if you're getting those kind of readings.

The main difference that I've noticed between hotter EL34's, like you're running, and the stuff that falls within Mesa's specs is the power section is cleaner. I've got a sextet of SED EL34's that bias up to about 44 mA and I have another sextet that bias up to about 47 mA in a Mesa Dual or Triple Rectifier's Bold/Silicon Diode power amp setting.

Dale

 

[Melvin1011]

For the moment I've settled on the SED 6L6GC. They seem to smooth the tone out more than the stock Mesa tubes. They are close to Mesa spec, maybe even a tad cooler. I'm thinking about getting some hotter ones and see what that does.