New Mark IV-Depressed So Far

[Bshizzle]

I picked up a used Mark IV Shortbody combo for $1200. It doesn't sound bad at all, but I am missing the amazing sounds everyone is always talking about. I know that the amp isn't a plug and play type of thing and that it takes tinkering, but I've dialed it into to a hand-full of settings I found online including a JP setting. It just sounds flabby and thin. I DO think that it needs new tubes. I don't know how old the tubes are but it still has 4 6l6's and one of them is different than the other three, but they are all Mesa tubes.
I am REALLY hoping that it just badly needs new tubes. I think I am also going to try the two 6L6 and two EL34 combo. But I am almost wanting to resell and with the money get something like this:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zdRYSryat5s

Can the Mark IV get sounds like that?

I just really want to get some clarity on whether or not I am hearing what the amp can really do or not. Thanks guys.

 

[adrenaline junkie]

Do you have a cabinet you can plug it into? It'll sound a lot better with some more speakers IMHO. Tubes can make a big difference, but mostly preamp tubes, try swapping out V1-V3 with some decent tubes.

 

[Bshizzle]

No I don't have a cabinet to plug into ATM, but I've also been fiddling with the idea of buying a 1x12 extension for it or building a headshell for it and buying a 2x12. For the tubes, I read that Power tubes make the most difference in sound and that preamp tubes last much longer?

 

[adrenaline junkie]

Also, Keep tweaking. A wee little movement on one slider can make your tone go suck to fantastic.

 

[adrenaline junkie]

No I think the preamp tube make a bigger difference in sound. When power tubes go bad, it'll sound pretty bad, but cheap shitty preamp tubes make it sound as bad or worse.

 

[Bshizzle]

Ok I think I'm gonna see what tubes are in the preamp and then if they are cheap I'll order some quality ones.

 

[mrd]

Replace all the tubes man. You bought it used.. god knows how much play time is on it.

You said one of the power tubes is different than the other 3? That's a bad sign. Power tubes need to be run in matched pairs. In the MKIV, the outermost two tubes are considered one pair, and the innermost two pair are the other pair. Go get all new tubes and I bet it will sound 100% better.

 

[Bshizzle]

Ya, I'm just wanting to be sure because the blasted thing has 9 tubes and I want to make sure that they need replaced before shelling out that money. But it seems I must do it so what can ya do, right?

 

[Bshizzle]

When I change all the tubes, should I just turn the amp off and change them or no? I read in the manual to make sure the amp is on standby, does this mean the amp should be on when changing them?

 

[mrd]

That means you CAN have it on if you want. You can actually do it fully powered up too if you're quick about it.

But don't. Just turn everything off, unplug it from the wall, especially if this is your first time doing it. When you take tubes in and out, hold them by the base and wiggle them slowly out of the socket. Don't pull or push them in or out if they don't want to go. Never, ever force a tube into a socket, you'll wreck and socket and the tube. Be gentle and have patience. Also, wait til the tubes warm down a bit, they can get super hot if you've been playing for a bit.

 

[sbalderrama]

If you are looking for that fuzzy/hairy kind of distortion sound in that Diablo sound clip, the Mark IV may not be what you want in any case. The Mark IV can sound pretty heavy ( better with more speakers) but the sound is more articulate. The Recto is more similar to the Genz El Diablo. Make sure you also try scooping out the sound with the graphic EQ. Someone else mentioned another trick for maxing the "gaininess" of the mark IV, by putting all the EQ sliders to the bottom and the raising the volume on the masters/output control. It seems weird to do, but I tried it and it actually worked.

 

[chris_EIT]

Ok a couple of steps I'd take would be 1. Replace the tubes, all of them
2. Play through a cab with v30's freaking great sound through a full 4 x12!
3. Lead Gain Pulled 8ish, Treble 7, Mids 5, Bass 2, Lead Drive 7.3 pulled, Prescence 3 pushed, then G-EQ to your liking

 

[ytse_jam]

+1 for additional cab. Good luck solving your tone problems, I think your Mark IV should sound way better then the Genz Benz in the video

 

[Shep]

yeah dude you really need new tube's and a 4x12 before you can get a huge metal sound.. Just wait and see..

 

[psychodave]

Also, Keep tweaking. A wee little movement on one slider can make your tone go suck to fantastic.

I keep telling my wife this same thing as well. Move the slider and suck :lol: :lol: ...sorry, I couldnt resist 8)

 

[guitardude05]

i know exactly how you fell about the mark iv sucking. i have the combo too and i know that that's the problem.

listen to this if you wanna hear some good mark iv tone:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_XK0Z6PlIiU&feature=related

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Get a closed back cab for it.

Swap the tubes.

To be honest, if you want a scooped, messy, tone like the Diablo, the Mark IV really isn't for you. The Mark IV gets AMAZING metal tones, but they're much clearer and in your face IMO.

 

[Bshizzle]

Ok thanks guys, it is comforting to know that what I'm hearing isn't what the Mark IV can do. I just ordered the tubes, I got 4 Sovtek 6L6 and 5 Tung Sol 12ax7. I'm seriously considering building a 2x12 cab and a headshell and not running it as a combo anymore. If I can manage to build something quality then I will use it.

as for the open/closed back option, if i put the combo up against a wall would that make it sound more like a closed back?

 

[mule#1]

It can not be stressed enough that learning the IV takes a lot of time. The cascading gain stages and the way they work are crucial to getting a good sound. Dont forget that your guitars pickups are a big part of the sound your looking for also. Try a sample setting from your manual use your EQ. Take the wheels off of your combo so it sits on the floor and have it sit with the back near a wall or corner. This will get you more of a compressed sound like a closed cabinet gives you. I had the same problem when I wasn't using a cab for practice. And try class A, triode and harminics settings. Lamb of God had their IV's pictured in Guitar World not to long ago and you could see their settings.

 

[HalfDeaf]

When I first got the mkiv, I was a little disappointed too. But after several months of trying different tubes and settings, I have to say that I am now totally stoked on it.

One piece of advice - you'll probably need to set the preamp gain a bit lower than you'd think with those 5 new production Tung-Sols. I've used several of those in my amps (currently using one in the lead spot on my mkiv) and they are very high-gain and can get a little "ice-picky". When I had a Tung Sol in V1, I ran the R1 gain around 3, R2 around 7, and LD around 7. Much higher and it seems to overload the power stage and tone quality goes way down.

Also, make sure you have a balanced tube in your V5 inverter socket. If you didn't specifically order one, look at the gain values (sometimes) listed on the boxes and pick one where the two numbers are the closest.