Found a way to fix the harsh treble.

[scott7d]

First off, I am not affiliated with any brand/company I may praise. I tried these on a whim, and they work, so just wanted to share with you all in case you have the harsh tone problem.

Anyways......
Since I've owned tube amps, I've noticed how they always sound better when I am standing off to the side. Standing directly in front, it seemed very rough with no compression at all. I've messed with EQ settings and everything and couldn't get it fixed. It was the same story with my V. Great sound off to the side, and a focused beam of death in front. However this could be a speaker issue because all my cabs have had V30's, which can be very harsh. Especially when not broken in.

To make a long story short, I found these things called fizzy lifters on ebay. They were cheap, so if they didn't work it wouldn't be a big deal. Installed them and practiced last night..........wow. The tone was a lot smoother, without changing the voicing. Even standing in front of the amp, it sounded like that "off to the side" tone. It also didn't effect how much you cut through. If anything, I cut through better. Supposedly it mixes the highs in evenly with mids and lows so they aren't just shooting out of the center of the cone. Whatever it does, it works.

Again, I don't care whether this company makes money or not, but I do care about helping other musicians out. If you want a cheap alternative to fix that lazer beam of death, give these a try! I haven't tried mic'ing anything yet to see how it may effect positioning, but I'm guessing it shouldn't be a big deal.

One thing I was happy about, was finally being able to use "extreme" mode. Before, the focused brightness was a little too over the top.

 

[MusicManJP6]

I've used fizzy lifters off and on for a good year or so. I'll buy a cab, install one, then sell the cab, and have to buy another for the next cab. I've not installed one in my current cab. The EV doesn't seem to really need one. But, I think they work wonders for V30 type speakers.

 

[scott7d]

I was about to use my V30's as paper weights until I bought these things. What model EV do you have?

EDIT: Nevermind, saw your sig.

 

[MusicManJP6]

I was about to use my V30's as paper weights until I bought these things. What model EV do you have?

EDIT: Nevermind, saw your sig.

Yep, it's an original early '90s EVM-12L with Mesa Black Shadow label. It sounds killer! Zero speaker breakup and very little ear fatigue.

 

[lesterpaul]

I was about to use my V30's as paper weights until I bought these things. What model EV do you have?

EDIT: Nevermind, saw your sig.

Yep, it's an original early '90s EVM-12L with Mesa Black Shadow label. It sounds killer! Zero speaker breakup and very little ear fatigue.

amen..hard to beat the ev-love em!the delta pro 12 eminence (?_I think that is the correct model) is smokin' as well

 

[shogun]

*face palm*

what ever happened to dialing your tone in for with the speakers pointing at a relevant target.. how about... your ears?? or a mic ?? i know i'll get flamed for this, but i don't know how someone can own a mesa boogie amp, and not know the basis for dialing in a tone

 

[scott7d]

*face palm*

what ever happened to dialing your tone in for with the speakers pointing at a relevant target.. how about... your ears?? or a mic ?? i know i'll get flamed for this, but i don't know how someone can own a mesa boogie amp, and not know the basis for dialing in a tone

I'm not going to flame, just don't understand your attitude. I'm a fairly seasoned musician, and sometimes I have the harshness problem with amps, sometimes I don't. Also, I never said that the problem was 100% the BOOGIE amp itself. Could also be the speakers (which I doubt are really broken in yet). It is very possible I may take these out once the speakers settle. I use pretty much the same typical high gain/rock settings people here do, so I'm not doing anything too crazy to cause it myself. In fact, I am very light on treble and presence on all of my set-ups.

When I dial in tone, I play where I will be standing, and also where the audience will be hearing my amp. Sometimes, it is a little over the top for the crowd and these blockers tame things a bit without doing away with all the cut you still need for the tone to get through over other instruments. Even my buddies who listened to us at my last practice (most of them are semi-professionals and have been playing since before I was born) mentioned how it sounded better. And adjusting the mic with these was just as simple. Depending on the venue, we don't always mic guitars. I've owned 4 boogies in the last 10 years and loved them all. This and the Stiletto were the only ones I had this issue with.

Again, not going to flame. But assuming off the bat that I may not be too bright and not know how to dial in an amp, just because I am using these, didn't sit over to well with me. You can set your gear up however you want, and I will do the same. I will be happy to listen to any constructive criticism or advice you may have in the future. I've seen your posts and videos, and you are a far better and more experienced musician than I am. But whether I am a noob, or a 50 year veteran (which I am neither of) I at least demand the same amount of respect you would give while talking to a Labrador puppy.

 

[MusicManJP6]

*face palm*

what ever happened to dialing your tone in for with the speakers pointing at a relevant target.. how about... your ears?? or a mic ?? i know i'll get flamed for this, but i don't know how someone can own a mesa boogie amp, and not know the basis for dialing in a tone

I don't want this to turn into a big dispute and hijack the thread, but I do want to comment on your post. When you dial in an amp with the speaker aimed at your head it mostly appeases anyone that will be right in front of it, but as soon as you stand up in your normal playing spot (away from the amp, maybe to the side, or maybe in front, but it is still aimed at your legs at this point) the tone changes because most of the highs are shooting straight out of the speaker (the 'beam'). The fizzy lifters disperse this beam and help mix the trebles with the other frequencies more evenly - even off axis. This reduces the beam's harshness as well as makes the treble more audible off axis so you don't have to crank the highs to compensate for where you are standing (which will only increase the harshness of the beam right in front). Unless you play with your amp elevated or tilted to aim at your head all the time it doesn't make sense to dial in tones with the amp aimed at your face 99% of the time. We want the amp to sound good no matter where we are standing.

The bottom line is that you could have just suggested this technique rather than call someone ignorant...

 

[shogun]

Sorry, i'm just seeing this a lot lately.. And yes, i personally usually elevate or tilt the cabinet / amp.. If you're using the filter, I understand how you would dial the tone in different, but if you're not, its simply a mistake, in my opinion.. unless you have your amp sidewashing the stage, or even backwards.. The further back the crowd is, the further the sound spreads, am I right?

w/ filter, its understandable

w/o filter, its amateur.. at least, thats what ive been told from sound & studio engineers / what i always read and see in tutorials..

i won't take it personal if you guys rag me..
i understand my opinion is only an opinion..

i personally like the tone I get from an amp that reaches my ears before bouncing off a bunch of walls or objects, so i don't think the filter is for me..

 

[shogun]

*face palm*

what ever happened to dialing your tone in for with the speakers pointing at a relevant target.. how about... your ears?? or a mic ?? i know i'll get flamed for this, but i don't know how someone can own a mesa boogie amp, and not know the basis for dialing in a tone

I'm not going to flame, just don't understand your attitude. I'm a fairly seasoned musician, and sometimes I have the harshness problem with amps, sometimes I don't. Also, I never said that the problem was 100% the BOOGIE amp itself. Could also be the speakers (which I doubt are really broken in yet). It is very possible I may take these out once the speakers settle. I use pretty much the same typical high gain/rock settings people here do, so I'm not doing anything too crazy to cause it myself. In fact, I am very light on treble and presence on all of my set-ups.

When I dial in tone, I play where I will be standing, and also where the audience will be hearing my amp. Sometimes, it is a little over the top for the crowd and these blockers tame things a bit without doing away with all the cut you still need for the tone to get through over other instruments. Even my buddies who listened to us at my last practice (most of them are semi-professionals and have been playing since before I was born) mentioned how it sounded better. And adjusting the mic with these was just as simple. Depending on the venue, we don't always mic guitars. I've owned 4 boogies in the last 10 years and loved them all. This and the Stiletto were the only ones I had this issue with.

Again, not going to flame. But assuming off the bat that I may not be too bright and not know how to dial in an amp, just because I am using these, didn't sit over to well with me. You can set your gear up however you want, and I will do the same. I will be happy to listen to any constructive criticism or advice you may have in the future. I've seen your posts and videos, and you are a far better and more experienced musician than I am. But whether I am a noob, or a 50 year veteran (which I am neither of) I at least demand the same amount of respect you would give while talking to a Labrador puppy.

I shouldn't have assumed, you're right.. I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

 

[MusicManJP6]

I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

All forums are built on opinions. That's what makes them so great! This one is my favorite forum because there is very little flaming or 'riff raff'. We are all here to exchange info about these great amps and 'have fun'... 8) I wouldn't have 4000 posts if everyone wasn't cool on here and helpful...

 

[Anonymous]

I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

All forums are built on opinions. That's what makes them so great! This one is my favorite forum because there is very little flaming or 'riff raff'. We are all here to exchange info about these great amps and 'have fun'... 8) I wouldn't have 4000 posts if everyone wasn't cool on here and helpful...

+10000 and congrats on your 4000 post :wink: have a couple of beers to celebrate :mrgreen:

 

[scott7d]

Shogun, it's all good. Like I said, you are a far more seasoned musician than I am, and will gladly listen to you input. Another issue is, the "scene" I am playing in, isn't anything major. Just $400-$500 gigs for maybe 75-150 people at most. Usually we set up on a smaller stage with everything crammed in, and the stage pretty close to the crowd. Another thing (I think I may have mentioned it already) These blockers/filters do not make it seem like you threw a blanket over your cab. It doesn't muffle or darken tone. It pretty much does what it was made to do and give a nice blend.

What you said about the frequencies spreading is dead on. In big venues it has a chance to disperse and sound even. In the smaller clubs, these blockers help give that effect before it makes someone's ears and eyes bleed. I will give my rig a good, heavy dose of playing this spring and take them out to see if speaker break-in had anything to do with it. And if we get a larger venue this spring, I will also take them out to see what it sounds like before we play.

 

[Jacko123]

Hey that's pretty cool. Thanks for pointing those out. Never knew such a thing existed.

 

[dmcguitar]

mmjp6, 4000 posts in under 3 years.. man seems like you spend a lot of time here.. now imagine if your applied that time to playing guitar :wink: ahahahahahah (im guilty of hanging here alot myself)

 

[RectoStudioGuy]

Old school fix to an age old issue. They work great, and better than making your own.

 

[shogun]

I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

All forums are built on opinions. That's what makes them so great! This one is my favorite forum because there is very little flaming or 'riff raff'. We are all here to exchange info about these great amps and 'have fun'... 8) I wouldn't have 4000 posts if everyone wasn't cool on here and helpful...

i agree.. this is one of the best, if not the best forum i've joined / lurked 8)

i'll be sure to watch my words, so i don't stick out like an evil-doer!

 

[Jerrick]

Ive been interested about these for a while, so lately at practices, I walk in front of my amp and then backup from it. The drummer and bassist look at me like im crazy but they arent aware of what im trying to hear. And what I hear is very subtle. lol

My cabinet is a 412 with Jensens in it. I dont know the model of speaker, but when im in front of the amp it does get just a bit brighter, but not enough to be bad. I do prefer being on the side of my amp, but im gonna put this little mod on hold, cause the difference from my cabinet is too small.

 

[scott7d]

I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

All forums are built on opinions. That's what makes them so great! This one is my favorite forum because there is very little flaming or 'riff raff'. We are all here to exchange info about these great amps and 'have fun'... 8) I wouldn't have 4000 posts if everyone wasn't cool on here and helpful...

i agree.. this is one of the best, if not the best forum i've joined / lurked 8)

i'll be sure to watch my words, so i don't stick out like an evil-doer!

This is off topic, and I'll be sure to PM you anything else about it. But, I would be interested in your online lessons. I've been at a brick wall for some time with a few techniques and sure could use some help!

 

[Jacko123]

Congrats on the milestone, but more importantly thank you for being such an active dude with such good information to share.

I guess I just don't take offense on forums, after being on so many that are just a war of opinions..

All forums are built on opinions. That's what makes them so great! This one is my favorite forum because there is very little flaming or 'riff raff'. We are all here to exchange info about these great amps and 'have fun'... 8) I wouldn't have 4000 posts if everyone wasn't cool on here and helpful...

+10000 and congrats on your 4000 post :wink: have a couple of beers to celebrate :mrgreen: