will I regret getting a LSS instead of a LSC?

[masque]

OK guys, I have been eyeing a lonestar for a year or better now. and I have always figured that when I got ready it would be a classic head. however, I've got the opportunity to purchase a lonestar special head that is less than 4 months old for $1200. That seems like a pretty good deal and I am real close to pulling the trigger on it. BUT.....those of you with a little more insight on the sounds of each of these amps may be able to help me.......do you feel that these amps are comparing apples to apples or does the difference between the 6l6 and el84 power sections make it more of an apples to oranges comparison?

I just dont want to get the special and a couple of months later really be thinking I should have waited for the classic......any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[pine]

I haven't played an LSS, so please take this with a grain of salt, but it seems to me that with the use of Yellowjackets you can use EL84s in the tube sockets of an LSC, (which might get you close to the sound of an LSS) and also play the LSC with 6L6s, EL34s, 6V6s, EL84s, and some combinations of tube types as well. I don't know if you have that many options with an LSS power section. On the other hand if the LSS delivers the sound that you are sure will be all you need, go that way.

 

[MusicManJP6]

I have heard both amps, and thought the LSS did not hold a candle to the LSC. If I were to buy a Lonestar (which I would love to do some day) it would definitely be a LSC. The LSS just had a brighter, harsher, muddier sound IMO. Of course I played one at a GC so who knows what shape the tubes were in or what settings on the back were flipped. I played it for literally 2 minutes before turning it off. The LSC is smooth, deep, full-bodied, and glorious! There is more distortion than you would imagine in the lead channel too. Run it through a 4x12 and it sounds killer! It falls just short of high gain, but with a pedal it could be a menace. I was impressed to say the least and it gave me instant GAS pains...

 

[Mork]

Well funnily enough I bought a LSS combo and a couple of months later I've bought a LSC head and sold the Special!

I loved the sound of the special, I love the sound of the classic, and yes they do sound different to me and I'm still not sure which I prefer but I'm glad I bought the classic- especially the head as opposed to a combo. What I didn't like about the special was how the dynamic changed between different volume settings (not using it mic'd through the PA) whereas the classic just sounds the same whatever volume. The special got a bit too lively the louder it got. I like my cleans...erm..clean though. I also think the drive channel is a bit clearer on the classic.

I was going to use both for a while then decide which I liked best, but in the end I was happy enough with the classic to decide on selling the special.

Oh and in the UK we would have to pay more than twice what that special would cost you!

 

[Old BF Shred]

One lesson I've learned is: Get what you really want. Unless the price difference will "break the bank", get what makes you happy even if it costs more.

Don't be swayed by price alone.......

You'll forget about the money soon enough, but you'll always remember you made the "right choice"!

 

[babow2]

I owned a LSC and played a LSC for a while. There is a big difference in sound, especially clean tones. The LSS has far less clean headroom. If you really like clean cleans, the LSC has that in spades, with tones of headroom and gorgeous clean tones. The LSS starts to dirt up and break up pretty quickly. I just couldn't get a clear clean tone at stage or rehearsal volume with the LSS. the LSS is a little dirtier and grittier by nature of the tubes. If I remember correctly (and i might not be), the LSC combo 1x12 actually is in a 2x12 size cabinet and therefore there is more cabinet room for the 12", while the LSS combo is in a smaller cabinet, which could affect things.

So, like others here, the LSC seems to be preferred. I loved the tones on the LSC and just couldn't get happy with the LSS.

I wouldn't buy the LSS unless that is the exact tone/style you want. A few hundred dollars will get forgotten, or lost if you decide to flip the amp in a couple months. The market is soft, shop around and play them both and decide which sound suits your playing and ears. Then be patient and opportunistic in getting the right amp at a good price.

Good luck. These are great choices to have!
Brent

 

[masque]

thanks guys, i appreciate the input.....i dont mind my cleans breaking up a little early....i kind of like the ability to control the dynamics.....play soft, get clean....play hard, get a little dirt. i'm used the power section of a mesa 20/20 which is el84's and have really gotten used to that tone....so i think that is one of the reasons the LSS appeals to me.

anyway, i went ahead and pulled the trigger on the LSS head and should have it in a day or two. I'll report back after i've had it for a few days. i figure i cant go wrong.....it's just another Mesa....right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MusicManJP6]

Cool. Listen to your gut! I hope you love it...

 

[Telemaster]

Depends on how you plan to use the amp and under what circumstances. I tried all the LS series amps before I bought and went with a LSC 2 x 12, then added a 2 x 12 ext cab.
If you plan to use it to play live and aren't going to be mic'd or DI'd then you might be better off going with the LSC just for the extra watts and projection.

 

[av8or3]

I have both amps and love them both for different reasons. The Special is PURE Class A operation and runs/sounds like a high quality amp of that type. Class A type amps are not very effecient and usually are not very powerful ( the Special is 30/35 watts)
However, the tone available within that 30/35 watts (and the 15 watt and 5 watt single ended modes) is really awesome (read
Special!)
It provides plenty of clean headroom and lead drive for me at most of the smaller clubs I gig. It also is a lot easier to haul than my 2x12 Lonestar (weighs less and is smaller) so I will always grab it unless I'm playing outside or at a large venue. I also have a 2x12 Lonestal extension cab that I have never taken out of the house. Not sorry I bought it, just haven't needed it.
The Lonestar has tons more clean headroom for several big reasons, one it's Class AB operation which makes it more effecient and allows the amp to produce more power (by design). It's also got 100 watts! So it can be set up so it's a long way to the top.
The Special is loud when it's cranked up, the Lonestar is really LOUD when cranked.
The tubes in the Special (EL-84'S) are a different beast than the 6L6's in the Lonestar,and just putting them (EL84's) in a Lonestar using Yellow Jackets will not yield the same results as they would in the Special. The class of operation is different and the Class A operation is what the Special is all about, the EL84's just work especially well in that situation and that's why they are used. You can't make a Lonestar sound like a Special, they are different animals entirely.
The big 6L6 bottles are best known for producing lots of clean power and by nature are "stiffer" that the EL84's and will not break up as early,and when they do, it's a different, harsher power clip. Better to drive the pre-amp to clip and amplify that with
the 6L6's.
The answer is to own one of each when you can, I love them both. My first Mesa amp was a Lonestar Special, at the time I also owned a Twin Reverb. After playing the Special for a while I went down and demo'd the Lonestar. I immediately ordered a new Lonestar in the same color as the Special (I like the color, O.K.),I also ordered the extension cab at the same time.
I swapped the Twin on the Lonestar. When my new Lonestar came in, I sold my Special to a friend for $1300. In about two weeks I realized what a mistake selling the Special was. I ordered another one and had to wait for 3 months to get it, and then had to pay $1800 for it to boot!
I always learn things the hard way.........

I am not an audio pro so the above is just my opinion/understanding of the difference's in the two amps. But I have tried to give you as much insight as I could. Hope you find it helpful,or at least interesting.

See 'ya, Jim

 

[masque]

update: i've had the amp for a couple of days now. it's a wonderful amp.....BUT, i'm afraid I am taking it back. it's not because i dont like it.

here's why, i have a triaxis and 20/20 power amp. The 20/20 has el84's in the power section. And although i knew the LSS had el84's i thought the preamp section would be different enough it would be like getting a new toy. However, after playing it extensively and doing some A/B tests I feel I am essentially buying the same thing only with less options. I am not one of these guys that runs my triaixis "wide open"....I like classic rock tones and I use alot of the lead 1 channels or lead 2 channels with lower gain settings that to my ears sound very similar to what I was hearing from the LSS. So, as many of you suggested.....I should have held out and waited until I find a lonestar classic head that has the 6l6 power section. The LSS is a great amp but I need to divert money to exactly what I wanted to begin with.

now, with that said, I will tell you that LSS at the 5 setting was unbelievable and I got such buttery tones out of it on channel 2 with the drive engaged it wasn't even funny. I almost kept the amp for that setting alone....unbelievable stuff. but in the end I must do what I got to do......so wish me luck on search for a lonestar classic head!!!!!!!

 

[ja22y]

I have both amps and love them both for different reasons. The Special is PURE Class A operation and runs/sounds like a high quality amp of that type.
See 'ya, Jim

I though that it's only class A in the 5W mode and A/B in other modes.

 

[dodger916]

I have both amps and love them both for different reasons. The Special is PURE Class A operation and runs/sounds like a high quality amp of that type.
See 'ya, Jim

I though that it's only class A in the 5W mode and A/B in other modes.

I'm pretty sure the Special is Class A all the time, with EL84s. 5 and 15 watt modes use the tube rectifier, with 30 watts running the diode rectifier.

 

[JAZZGEAR]

The tubes in the Special (EL-84'S) are a different beast than the 6L6's in the Lonestar,and just putting them (EL84's) in a Lonestar using Yellow Jackets will not yield the same results as they would in the Special. The class of operation is different and the Class A operation is what the Special is all about, the EL84's just work especially well in that situation and that's why they are used. You can't make a Lonestar sound like a Special, they are different animals entirely.

See 'ya, Jim

Those statements are not entirely true. First off, I've owned both amps many times over. And for a while both at the same time. Secondly, the Yellow Jackets convert the power section to pure Class A operation (check the specs at THD). Third, the only difference in the electronics of the two Lonestars is the power section. The pre-amps are exactly the same. Lastly, with the latest LSC that has a 10 watt single ended Class A section, when using EL84s via Yellow Jackets you get eerily close to the LSS. The only thing that keeps them from being exacty the same ...transformers for 6L6/EL34s vs EL84s.

But I think its a close enough sound (I've tried them) to go with the LSC and use Yellow Jackets in the outer sockets. Trust me you will not miss the power...and you'll have both LSS and LSC tones in one amp.

 

[coppa]

I think the special is cathode biased while the classic is fixed bias the term "class A" is very confusin

 

[av8or3]

This will completely explain Class "A" as compared to Class "AB"
enjoy, Jim

http://www.mesaboogie.com/US/Smith/ClassA.htm