NEW MEMBER NEEDS ADVICE

[Shadow.Se7en]

Hello Everyone!

I'm a new Mesa Boogie convert and must say I was a little let down with my Single Rec 50 solo Head. Considering everything I had read on the Recs, I was expecting to plug in and just get this mind blowing tone. Somehow that didn’t happen! I'm sure that this due my inexperience. I’m using a few pedals in the front, and still learning to work with the EFX loop. I’m using a Marshall JCM 900 Lead 1960A cab with the head. I have some half decent guitars and I've had all the pickups upgraded to Dimarzio or Seymour Duncan.
I play mostly metal and I’m looking for a good tone that will allow me to easily do squeals ala Zakk Wylde, same thing for leads, something that doesn’t sound too thin and can cut throught the mix live. I’m not sure if volume is a factor. I can’t play too loud before the whole rooms starts to rattle!!
So I was hoping to get some advice from the more experienced players. Any help or advice will be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks!!

 

[UnderJollyRoger]

Well, there's no denying you need some volume before these babys really sound good. You play at home or in your practice space ?

I can't comment on the cabinet, but speakers have a huge impact on the sound. A "halfway" decent guitar should do the trick.

What are your settings on the amp ?

 

[rocknroll9225]

Well, there's no denying you need some volume before these babys really sound good.

^this. wait until no one's home or until u go to a band practice or something so you can really crank it. i've gotten rectos to sound decent at low volumes, but not great. IMO, if you really want that saturated, compressed, pissed off, aggressive rhythm sound with great, smooth lead tones and pinched harmonics flying off the strings - sell the recto and get a Mark V.

it's also a very common practice to set the gain on a recto about as high as it'll go without "farting out", and then sticking an overdrive pedal in front of the amp (ibanez tubescreamer is the most popular) with the gain on pedal around 9:00, and the volume on the pedal fairly high. this will tighten up the sound and give it a little more thickness.

 

[b0nkersx]

What speakers are in your cab?

 

[Dave G.]

My two cents is: If your looking for the Zakk Wylde tone then its gotta be marshall all the way...


However if your looking for a really mean aggressive metal tone then you have the right amp for the job.. As mentioned you need to set the gain as high as you can without it getting muddy.....i find this to be about 1-2 o clock on the modern setting at low volumes( at higher vol you need less gain than that). Then stick a boost or overdrive in front of the amp. I use the Digitech bad monkey (gain off volume up full on pedal) ..its less than half the price of a Ts9 and imo is way better as you can control the bass and treble on it separately.....


You also need to spend ALOT of time getting to know how the EQ on the mesa stuff works. Its not like other amps. If you change one dial it can add various amounts of other frequencies to the tone. Spend a few days fiddling with the eq until you find a tone that suits you. But for the lead stuff id try the amp on vintage mode. it works alot better for leads. however the "best" recto sounds imo is modern mode turned up as loud as you can have it. The louder it gets the more aggressive yet smoother the tone gets. Once the rectos are turned up they become a wall of sound! I reckon if you spend some time getting to know the amp you will find it has more than all the sounds you need in it!

 

[plon]

When I got my Solo 50, I was also not impressed with the way it sounded. First thing, OVERSIZED RECTO CAB!!!! This made such a HUGE difference in the sound. Then, after alot of experimenting with power and pre amp tubes, ( I settled with Ruby 6L6 GCMSTR power tubes and Tung Sol in V-1 and the rest are Shuguang Silver Dragons) mine sounds freaking incredible without any boost and that's in vintage mode. In modern mode, it has that serious chug and killer harmonics. Also, I'm not a fan of EMG's, but I'll admit, I played a friends guitar with EMG's through my rig and it nailed what I believe you're looking for.

 

[fluff191]

Ditch the Marshall cab. Get ANY Mesa cab.

 

[Blaklynx]

Congrats on the amp. It's a good amp and can cover a lot of ground. New users expect an amp like this to work like a Marshall, a Peavey or whatever. I did until I started to understand that Rectos are an amp a world apart. They do not function like other amps..... Once you understand how the tone controls work (they're 'interactive' with each other - read the manual) and how the gain level required (hi or low gain) affects your tone, you'll get to realise how versatile the amp can be. Best advice I ever read here goes something like this: Use your ears and forget where the dials are set. Just close your eyes and adjust.

It's a long learning curve. One day you'll love it, the next you'll think WTF? It can take weeks to find what you want but one day it'll hit you like a ton of bricks and a lamp will light up above your head! If you're expecting super-duper smoothness out of it the way the amp is currently, you're in for a shock. These amps are great rhythm machines but lack a certain quality for smooth-sustained-liquid leads; the amp needs some help either with OD pedals, EQ pedals and/or tube swaps.

These amps are also unforgiving. If you're a sloppy player, you'll know about it. It does not cover your mistakes. The amp forces you to play better. And that's good. Frustrating but good; there's no hiding behind super-saturated gain levels.

Here's a number of links that I advise you to read and understand what the users are saying. Also, experiment with the amp. The more you play with it, the easier it'll be. You can't just jump in and expect Vai-like solo tones. The amp just wasn't designed to behave this way (IMO) but as mentioned, some help can (and will) give you some great solo tones.

Links:
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=52293
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=52136
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=19660
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=50335
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=49265
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=49301
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=48501
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=46244

Some links will cross-over into others but read anyway. Use search function once you understand what to look for. Have fun.

 

[Shadow.Se7en]

First off all let me say thanks to all you guys!! I really appreciate all the input! You guys ROCK!

I just got my head and haven’t had a chance to take it to our practice spot, so I’ve been messing with it here at home. My settings are the following:
Master: 11 o’clock, Presence: 12 o’clock, Bass: 12 o’clock, Mid: 1 o’clock, Treble: 12 o’clock, Gain: all the way! I have it on the modern setting. I think these might not be the best, but that’s where I had them when I checked! The tubes in it now are Mesa Boogie STR-440, that’s what I got off the tube.

I do run an MXR Wylde overdrive pedal in front of the amp with the settings set at, output: all the way, Tone: 12 o’clock and the gain set at 9 o’clock. I’m not necessarily trying to get a “Zakk Wylde” tone, what I’m after is the ability to pull of the pinch harmonics easily, and like Blaklynx described them, smooth-sustained-liquid leads!

As far as speakers, I checked and I have the GT-12 75’s in the cab. I’ll definitely have to look into getting a Mesa cab. Thank you very much for the links as well. I’m going through every single one them!

I don’t plan on giving up on this amp! I’m going to work with it until I can make it work for me!

I have another question, (it might be a stupid one). Can I use another amp through the EFX loop just to use the EFX?
Thanks again fellas!

S7 :twisted:

 

[ryjan]

First, too much gain man! Probably sounds like a sloshy muddy mess. I play Metallica on a Dual Recto with the gain at 1:00. Either you amp's broke or your ears are.
Second, you probably have the worst speaker to pair with a Recto. Try something with V30's or G12K100's. Night and day.

 

[BostonRedSox]

You have your gain set way too high. Unless you are soloing, you don't need the gain anywhere past 3:00. With enough volume to get heard in my band, I have the gain on my Roadster's channel 3/vintage set at 11:00-12:00. I like the 3-d nature of having big Recto rhythm gain sounds, but with the depth associated with lower gain settings. At higher gain settings, such as 1:00-2:00, I can get some more cut and sustain for octave licks, but the sound isn't as sweet to my ears. This is all with the volume (fx loop disengaged) between 1:00-2:00 (deafening volumes). Go easy with the gain and start low. Then raise to gain to taste. Understanding how to play with getting just enough gain is the key to a good sound.

Also, read you manual! You will understand better how to tweak your amp. The manual explains how the gain works, and how it works in conjunction with the rest of the amp. More gain, equals less control over the rest of your amp. The gain is first in the so-called tone string. This means that how you set the gain, will have an effect on the rest of the eq. Same thing applies with the treble knob, but to a lesser extent. Long and short of it -- read the manual!

Players who like Marshall (high gain) sounds always get tripped up playing Boogies, especially Rectos. Sure, you can get similar gainier sounds, but they hang in different areas of the "mix." Boogies are well known for their huge low ends, and this is another aspect of the Recto sound that trips up people playing Rectos. In the end, you may not actually be a Recto guy after all.

My best advice to people with Rectos is to not dial the amp to be something it isn't. There is a certain amount of experimentation that one can have with Rectos, but this is all within the limits of where the amp shines. Use the manual as a tool to further acclimate you to your new amp. Play it loud and often, and experiment with different guitars, pickup positions, etc. Listen to the amp, and how it sounds and reacts, without inserting any effects in the loop! Keep it simple and learn the Recto. You may, in the end, not like the natural character of the amp after all.

Also, invest in a Mesa cab at the very least. Their cabs are designed to accentuate and tighten the sound of their amps. Single Rectifier - Recto oversized cab, Stiletto cab, Roadster cab, etc. I'd stay away from any open backs in the Mesa lineup though. At least for now, while you are learning your Recto.

Good luck and enjoy. I hope your Recto brings you massive tone and inspiration to be creative.

 

[cheameup]

I'm a big believer with amps if you can't just turn every knob on the front to 12 o'clock , hit a chord and like the sound it might not be the amp for you . It won't be fine tuned to the best sound in the amp ,but it will be the sound of the amp.boosts, eq's , tweaking are all fine tuning. But if you don't love the basic tone of the amp it'll always be an uphill battle

Try it. 12 o'clock every knob including channel and master volumes. Yeah it'll be loud but it'll sound like a recto

 

[YellowJacket]

Is this a new or used head?

Stupid question: Are the tubes in good shape? I cannot even begin to imagine how thick a soup one can generate with the gain dimed and an overdrive pedal engaged!!!

 

[Blaklynx]

Man...... as others have said, that gain is W-A-Y too high. And with a pedal at max level?!?! Can you hear all the notes ring true when playing a chord? Sorry to say this but it must sound like a wall of noise....

I have my gain set at around 10~11 o'clock, a little drive from one or two pedals (I usually cascade two pedals), levels to suit and tone to taste. It's more than enough for most things. I may have the second pedal's gain higher to use for solos or may even use a third pedal after the first two pedals to push the amp a little harder for solos, depends on what I want to achieve. Bass is usually around 10oclock, treble around 9~10oclock, mid around 12~1oclock, presence around 8~8.5oclock and an EQ in the loop. These are my general settings that I start off with and sometimes I tweak a little from there. Mind you, this is all in Raw mode! With these settings I can roll back the guitar volume and get a good crunch tone, too, even with the pedals engaged.

Not sure about using another amp through the loop even if you only want to use the EFX side of the amp. Why not just get a proper EFX unit and place in the loop? FYI, you may want to look at modifying the loop from parallel to serial.... search post here for loop mods. More reading for you....... :wink:

 

[Shadow.Se7en]

Hello everyone,

After reading all the posts and going through the links that were posted, I took some notes and headed straight for my amp. After making some adjustments, I heard a big improvement, especially after turning the gain level down. Since no one was home at the time, I cranked it a bit too. Wow! Now I see why you guys love these amps. I was very content with the sounds I was achieving. I can only imagine the tones I’ll be capable of getting once I have a better understanding of my amp.

I’ll definitely have to look into getting a Mesa Boogie cab. I’ll have to add that to my X-Mas list!!
Like I said on my previous post, I’m not particularly looking to emulate anyone's tone. Just trying to get a tone that suits my playing. I used a Laney Pro Tube for a while before I switch over to the Line 6 HD147 I have now. Which I actually liked, but it was hit and misses at gigs. So I went for the MB I have now.
I’ve done a lot of reading regarding these amps on this forum and other places to the point that sometimes I felt a bit overwhelmed. From what I gathered, it seems some of the info is based on personal preference with a splash of personal opinion, but all of very helpful in establishing a solid foundation which to start on. If you have any more ideas or info please post them!
Thanks to everyone again! Glad to be part of the Mesa Boogie Family!

 

[Shadow.Se7en]

Hey everyone,

I forgot to mention, I did buy this head used. I checked the tubes and it has Mesa tubes, at least the big ones are. I think they say SRT (or STR) 440 on them. Would you guys suggest I change them out to new ones just to start off fresh?

 

[b0nkersx]

Hey everyone,

I forgot to mention, I did buy this head used. I checked the tubes and it has Mesa tubes, at least the big ones are. I think they say SRT (or STR) 440 on them. Would you guys suggest I change them out to new ones just to start off fresh?

If it's an older head then definitely. If it's on the newer side they're probably in pretty good shape.

 

[Shadow.Se7en]

The amp is in great shape, covering on it look almost new......Looks well taken care of. The only number on there that I find is 00636...not sure what that means.

 

[lailer75]

just keep workin it. it`ll come to you. what are you coming from amp wise (sorry if posted earlier)? it took me a while to discover i needed to improve my playing first before i was rewarded with mesa recto bliss!!

 

[Shadow.Se7en]

Well guys…….I’ve decided to sell my single rec solo head. I took fluff191’s advice and went out looking for a Mesa cab, and found one!! I was lucky enough to pick up a three channel dual rectifier from the same guy! Listening to the head and speaker cab together just did it for me. I really love this setup. I was really able to turn it up at this guy’s house and I was blown away. I’m looking forward to spending some quality time with it this weekend.
Thanks to everyone for the advice on the single rec! Any advice on the dual?? LOL! I know, I know, turn the gain down!!

I’ll be posting the single rec in the classified if anyone’s interested.

Thanks again! :twisted: