mk V manual-C+ content!

[JohnDNJ]

Doug West speaks the truth about the C+ w/o EQ. A lot of Boogie enthusiasts who I know and who have had different versions of the C+, some 60 Watt, some w/eq, some without eq, etc., and who have compared them side by side, will tell you that the C+ w/o EQ has the better tone.

I've owned many C+ amps over the years and still own a couple. I've sold every one of them except a 60 Watter w/o EQ (the best I've ever heard) and a Simulclass w/o EQ that is also a killer amp.

Just the $.02 of someone who has owned 25 different Boogies since the '70's and someone who now owns a Mark V (which IMO doesn't nail the lead tone of the C+, regardless of what Doug West has to say now when he is motivated to sell the Mark V).

I'm going to have to agree with you. I've owned 2 IIC+ amps over the past 10 years. 1 was a 60 watt non-simulclass EQ loaded head. The other was the same but a NON-EQ loaded head. FWIW, i liked the EQ loaded head better.

But, yes, something's missing with the Mark V. I'm not sure what but i am tweaking, tweaking, tweaking, and more tweaking. Know what i did on my IIC+?...i was playing. There's something up with the EQ sliders on the new MArk V, I'm not sure what but a lot of people have complained about it and i feel there is something to it.

A lot of Boogie haters say that Mark series amps are boxy, thin, cardboardy sounding, and with the Mark V i can't argue with them. All the usual settings i always used on MArk II, III, and IV's just don't work right with the V. I'm not sure if maybe even my ears have changed, or if the Mark V is really that different from previous Mark amps.

I notice when i get something decent with the preset knob and switch to the sliders the tone is really muffled, boxy, and just wierd sounding. Where's that ALIVE sounding feel that the IIC+ had, you know that sound and feel where the tone is just jumping out of the speaker. I'm not hearing it here.


And I'm not suprised to see Boogie trash IIC+ owners calling them snobs and whatnot. 20 year old amps really don't really help Boogie sell amps right now do they? They can say all they want, but for those of us that really know the truth, we can spot marketing Bullshit when we see it.

Well said.

 

[lesterpaul]

A lot of Boogie haters say that Mark series amps are boxy, thin, cardboardy sounding, and with the Mark V i can't argue with them. All the usual settings i always used on MArk II, III, and IV's just don't work right with the V. I'm not sure if maybe even my ears have changed, or if the Mark V is really that different from previous Mark amps.

.

..I have been a/b'ing mine-the Vis brighter( preamp tubes,possibly??)..if you use the "usual" mark settings, you can get lost-I can get them **** close(one thing I like doing on chan 3 is running the channel master high..3-4 oclock)the preset is ok to me if used sparingly..but when I match them, my geq is a good bit different from my C+..my 6600 is a tab below center, for ex.) it has less gain on C+ mode,but preamp tubes are a possibility here as well-the tone stack is different..once I get the 2 amps matched without eq,I then dial in my C+ and go from there-difference in gain, brightness-the eq's end up being different for sure
-Thiele cabs might help my bottom as well-I can make it sound "boxy and thin", but there is more under the hood...pentode adds different character, but to my ears, the volume has to be pumping in order to here it..

 

[danyeo1]

A lot of Boogie haters say that Mark series amps are boxy, thin, cardboardy sounding, and with the Mark V i can't argue with them. All the usual settings i always used on MArk II, III, and IV's just don't work right with the V. I'm not sure if maybe even my ears have changed, or if the Mark V is really that different from previous Mark amps.

.

..I have been a/b'ing mine-the Vis brighter( preamp tubes,possibly??)..if you use the "usual" mark settings, you can get lost-I can get them **** close(one thing I like doing on chan 3 is running the channel master high..3-4 oclock)the preset is ok to me if used sparingly..but when I match them, my geq is a good bit different from my C+..my 6600 is a tab below center, for ex.) it has less gain on C+ mode,but preamp tubes are a possibility here as well-the tone stack is different..once I get the 2 amps matched without eq,I then dial in my C+ and go from there-difference in gain, brightness-the eq's end up being different for sure
-Thiele cabs might help my bottom as well-I can make it sound "boxy and thin", but there is more under the hood...pentode adds different character, but to my ears, the volume has to be pumping in order to here it..

I'm not giving up just yet. But i did play with a drummer last week, loud, and i couldn't use channel 3. Channel 2 on crunch sounded a lot better than anything on channel 3. The bottom end wasn't there, and the focus of the tone felt really narrow. Channel 2 filled the whole room with sound like channel 3 didn't, it was wierd and i was very suprised. I use to play out a lot with my IIC+ and on my old basketweave MArshall loaded with greenbacks and the tone was Godly and didn't require much tweaking.

If the Mark V needs to be turned up to wake it up I'll be suprised since every other Mark series amp i owned sounded great even at really low volumes.

 

[lesterpaul]

just talking about running chan 3 master higher, not overall output-seemed to give more girth-what cab/speakers you use now?

 

[xrisj]

I found the manual interesting about the non-eq C+s. I felt the snob comments were uncalled for as well. I just don't get kicking loyal product enthusiasts in the nuts for any reason. That said, I'll still buy my amps because I like the way they sound.

 

[JohnDNJ]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
Sorry but the guys at MESA are insane with those comments in the V manual. It's not even CLOSE.
Forget the tone....the FEEL of the amp is remarkable unlike the V witch feels like a dead box.
The real deal feels ALIVE and organic unlike the V which just doesn't.

I'm really thinking about making the guy an offer on it. Even without the EQ (has simul-class though)
it is a monster of an amp.

 

[danyeo1]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
Sorry but the guys at MESA are insane with those comments in the V manual. It's not even CLOSE.
Forget the tone....the FEEL of the amp is remarkable unlike the V witch feels like a dead box.
The real deal feels ALIVE and organic unlike the V which just doesn't.

I'm really thinking about making the guy an offer on it. Even without the EQ (has simul-class though)
it is a monster of an amp.

The last IIC+ i owned was a Non-EQ version. Regardless of what they say in the Mark V manual, i still liked my 60 watt with EQ better. But they both sounded real good. They had that real alive feel that i don't hear yet from the V.

Now, I'm not trashing the V, i think it sounds pretty good on it's own. And the Mark V isn't a IIC+ reissue, it's just a mode of a IIC+. Well, that's how I'd describe it. Although, the Mark V manual really pats itself on the back saying that the V IS a IIC+. Well, to my ears it isn't.

 

[JohnDNJ]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
Sorry but the guys at MESA are insane with those comments in the V manual. It's not even CLOSE.
Forget the tone....the FEEL of the amp is remarkable unlike the V witch feels like a dead box.
The real deal feels ALIVE and organic unlike the V which just doesn't.

I'm really thinking about making the guy an offer on it. Even without the EQ (has simul-class though)
it is a monster of an amp.

The last IIC+ i owned was a Non-EQ version. Regardless of what they say in the Mark V manual, i still liked my 60 watt with EQ better. But they both sounded real good. They had that real alive feel that i don't hear yet from the V.

Now, I'm not trashing the V, i think it sounds pretty good on it's own. And the Mark V isn't a IIC+ reissue, it's just a mode of a IIC+. Well, that's how I'd describe it. Although, the Mark V manual really pats itself on the back saying that the V IS a IIC+. Well, to my ears it isn't.

Do you still think i'm crazy when I said the V wasn't that hot? From what I'm reading now from others it seems
I wasn't too far off base. There will always be fanboys and you can never convince them otherwise..
but a real IV or a real C+ smoke their counterparts in the V..just like they do the Triaxis.

 

[danyeo1]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
Sorry but the guys at MESA are insane with those comments in the V manual. It's not even CLOSE.
Forget the tone....the FEEL of the amp is remarkable unlike the V witch feels like a dead box.
The real deal feels ALIVE and organic unlike the V which just doesn't.

I'm really thinking about making the guy an offer on it. Even without the EQ (has simul-class though)
it is a monster of an amp.

The last IIC+ i owned was a Non-EQ version. Regardless of what they say in the Mark V manual, i still liked my 60 watt with EQ better. But they both sounded real good. They had that real alive feel that i don't hear yet from the V.

Now, I'm not trashing the V, i think it sounds pretty good on it's own. And the Mark V isn't a IIC+ reissue, it's just a mode of a IIC+. Well, that's how I'd describe it. Although, the Mark V manual really pats itself on the back saying that the V IS a IIC+. Well, to my ears it isn't.

Do you still think i'm crazy when I said the V wasn't that hot? .

It's not a bad amp, but it does not capture the tones Boogie claims it does.

 

[JohnDNJ]

I agree with you 100%..Which if you go back and read my very first post I said "it doesn't nail
any of them". Close, but no cigar...just like my old triaxis.

For an all around amp it's a great deal. Personally I got tired of having an all around amp.

 

[danyeo1]

I agree with you 100%..Which if you go back and read my very first post I said "it doesn't nail
any of them". Close, but no cigar...just like my old triaxis.

For an all around amp it's a great deal. Personally I got tired of having an all around amp.

Well i guess there's some crow to be eaten. :lol:

 

[JohnDNJ]

I agree with you 100%..Which if you go back and read my very first post I said "it doesn't nail
any of them". Close, but no cigar...just like my old triaxis.

For an all around amp it's a great deal. Personally I got tired of having an all around amp.

Well i guess there's some crow to be eaten. :lol:

Nah dude. :lol:

Link some of your c+ and IV clips if you still got them online. I really wanna hear them.
You can pm them if you prefer not to post them.

 

[lesterpaul]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
.

I betcha those dusty, archaic old *** bottles have a little to do with it!!check out the vintage tube market... when I bought my C+ Coli, I thought it sounded good until a fellow forumite's loaded C+ with old bottles taught me a thing or two about a bright amp--we were able to design a better,warmer, more full bodied flavor with different tubes(more of a beer analogy than a wine analogy..not cork sniffin' here,just pop toppin' )
Lesterpaul/ FAN MAN

 

[JohnDNJ]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
.

I betcha those dusty, archaic old *** bottles have a little to do with it!!check out the vintage tube market... when I bought my C+ Coli, I thought it sounded good until a fellow forumite's loaded C+ with old bottles taught me a thing or two about a bright amp--we were able to design a better,warmer, more full bodied flavor with different tubes(more of a beer analogy than a wine analogy..not cork sniffin' here,just pop toppin' )
Lesterpaul/ FAN MAN

You're probably right. It's also a bit noisy and hissy but as long as you dont stop playing you dont hear it haha.
Seriously though, I've personally never heard anything like this thing. It's like you dont even have to try to get
harmonics out, they are just THERE when you need\want them. And the distortion is just so....complex...I don't
even know how to describe it.

 

[lesterpaul]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
.

I betcha those dusty, archaic old *** bottles have a little to do with it!!check out the vintage tube market... when I bought my C+ Coli, I thought it sounded good until a fellow forumite's loaded C+ with old bottles taught me a thing or two about a bright amp--we were able to design a better,warmer, more full bodied flavor with different tubes(more of a beer analogy than a wine analogy..not cork sniffin' here,just pop toppin' )
Lesterpaul/ FAN MAN

You're probably right. It's also a bit noisy and hissy but as long as you dont stop playing you dont hear it haha.
Seriously though, I've personally never heard anything like this thing. It's like you dont even have to try to get
harmonics out, they are just THERE when you need\want them. And the distortion is just so....complex...I don't
even know how to describe it.

yessir..you've been bitten-might as well take the plunge!

 

[Elpelotero]

There is a non eq c+ at my local shop right now, 14000ish serial number which puts
it near the end of production I think.. I've been playing it and tweaking it for a few weeks
here and there when i get the chance. It's hands down one of the sickest amps I've ever touched.
The harmonics and overtones just fly out of the thing and that's with like 15-20 year old tubes.
.

I betcha those dusty, archaic old *** bottles have a little to do with it!!check out the vintage tube market... when I bought my C+ Coli, I thought it sounded good until a fellow forumite's loaded C+ with old bottles taught me a thing or two about a bright amp--we were able to design a better,warmer, more full bodied flavor with different tubes(more of a beer analogy than a wine analogy..not cork sniffin' here,just pop toppin' )
Lesterpaul/ FAN MAN

You're probably right. It's also a bit noisy and hissy but as long as you dont stop playing you dont hear it haha.
Seriously though, I've personally never heard anything like this thing. It's like you dont even have to try to get
harmonics out, they are just THERE when you need\want them. And the distortion is just so....complex...I don't
even know how to describe it.

You've been bitten....Get a graphic EQ pedal from around the store and plug it in the back. I guarantee you'll walk out with the amp and pedal.

 

[JohnDNJ]

I'm gonna bring my MXR 10 band there later and try it

 

[danyeo1]

I'm gonna bring my MXR 10 band there later and try it

That's what i used on my last IIC+. I'm sure you'll like it a lot better than the IIC+ mode on the V.

 

[JohnDNJ]

Local music store...you dont even wanna know...



Put it this way, if you saw what this guy gets in from a few local collectors your jaw will drop.


How about the number 2 Marshall head ever built for instance.

 

[av8or3]

Local music store...you dont even wanna know...



Put it this way, if you saw what this guy gets in from a few local collectors your jaw will drop.


How about the number 2 Marshall head ever built for instance.

That's good company to be in! But I think the 2c+ can hold it's own when it's time to get down :twisted: