Lonestar Classic tubes advice

[lonestarpaul]

Hi all! :wink:
I'm thinking about changing my Lonestar Classic head tubes in order to achieve a better sound for my tastes and needs.
First of all, I use my amp mostly as a 50w (both channels) mono-channel base for effects and in particular CH1 with a "breakup clean" setting that I push with the 3 overdrives I run in my pedalboard (Fulltone Fat-Boost 3, Xotic AC Booster, Fulltone OCD v3). Sometimes I use CH2 with the same purpose but a little higher gain, just like a "dirtier" CH1 version, but honestly not that often: CH1 for my tastes is a better start to build on with pedals than CH2.

That said, talking about power tubes, I'm pretty much sure about my choice: Svetlana 6L6GC (Winged C) MESA Select. I heard a lot of good things about these tubes...what d'you think?

Anyway, the choice become harder in the preamp section. These are some tubes I'm currently checking:

V1 - RFT ECC83 or Mullard ECC83 (shield logo, "BVA" mark)
V2 - RFT ECC83 or Mullard ECC83 (shield logo, "BVA" mark)
V3 - Philips-JAN 12ax7WA or Telefunken ECC83 or Sylvania 12ax7WA or G.E.-JAN 12ax7WA
V4 - Mullard 12AT7WA (a.k.a. CV4024, ECC81, M8162)
V5 - Mullard 12AT7WA (a.k.a. CV4024, ECC81, M8162)


What d'you guys think about that? My aim is to improve the overall tone fatness with a great natural breakup on cleans, headroom and dynamic, mostly for CH1 but also on CH2 to make it more usable both as a dirtier CH1 clone and also as a different-flavored and thick "hard rock" crunch (I'd say mid-gain, since it cannot be pushed into high-gain territory), with the "Drive" engaged. If I use it like that now, I get a pretty noisy amount of "fizzy" sound on the higher frequencies as I turn up the Drive knob, so I'd like to make it a little more "compact" and thick.

Thanks a lot for help!

 

[handyandy]

Hi Paul, Are you in the UK?
I got a set of the harma cryo's for the pre-amp and Im quite happy with them.
Check them out here,
http://www.watfordvalves.com/products.asp?id=26&man=180
I got the standard kit and the discription is pretty close to the results I got but still got a little doubt in my head that maybe I should of gone for the classic kit.
Hope this helps :?

 

[lonestarpaul]

Hi Paul, Are you in the UK?
I got a set of the harma cryo's for the pre-amp and Im quite happy with them.
Check them out here,
http://www.watfordvalves.com/products.asp?id=26&man=180
I got the standard kit and the discription is pretty close to the results I got but still got a little doubt in my head that maybe I should of gone for the classic kit.
Hope this helps :?

Hi man, no I'm from Italy.
I was wondering about those WatfordValves kits...how does it work?
I also checked Eurotubes kits, but I'm not a big fan of JJs, so I'd prefer something else.

Thanks for help! :wink:

 

[handyandy]

Before I bought my valves I phoned Watford Valves, spoke to Derek, he was really very helpfull!
I told him what I wanted and that I didnt want to make the amp darker or muddier so he said the standard kit would suit me best.
Not sure if this is what your asking but this guy is like Yoda when it comes to valves so it could be worth making a phone call.
The Harma's have really helped my Ch.2 making it clearer and less harsh but still with all the gain I need on tap, Im still running the standard Mesa output valves.
Good luck on your choice man!

 

[lonestarpaul]

Before I bought my valves I phoned Watford Valves, spoke to Derek, he was really very helpfull!
I told him what I wanted and that I didnt want to make the amp darker or muddier so he said the standard kit would suit me best.
Not sure if this is what your asking but this guy is like Yoda when it comes to valves so it could be worth making a phone call.
The Harma's have really helped my Ch.2 making it clearer and less harsh but still with all the gain I need on tap, Im still running the standard Mesa output valves.
Good luck on your choice man!

...thanks man, I'll check out Watfordvalves for sure.
What is your doubt about your standard kit compared to classic?

I'm looking for an improvement in CH1 fatness and headroom and I'd be even happier if I could make my CH2 a little less harsh on the top end and muddy on the mid-low freq, to be used as a dirtier CH1 or as a higher gain sound. Right now, when I need to push on the gain side, I prefer a lot more my Fulltone OCD v3 on the 1st channel instead of the Lonestar CH2 with Drive engaged...it seems to my ears like there's a sort of a "blanket" of fizzy high frequencies when I turn up Gain and Drive.
Also, on CH1 I don't really need "jazzy" cleans since I like to use it with a breakup clean setting, something that can be almost-clean or crunchy depending on how I pick my strings. Of course I like headroom and clarity (I'd say something like a "Fenderish" character) but I've to find a compromise because I like a compact and thick sound when I push the amp with overdrives: in my opinion, if the sound is too open and clear (like a Fender for example), is breathtaking on cleans but it tends to be too "grainy" when you add gain, while I like a fat, thick and compact tone on that side with dynamic and great freq response (not too harsh or muddy and stuff like that).

 

[lonestarpaul]

...apart from Watford valves (and Eurotube), d'you guys have some other advices for a LSC retube?
What d'you think about the ones I posted in the 1st message?

 

[handyandy]

Hi Paul, I just had a doubt in my head incase the classic kit was even sweeter sounding, dont get me wrong Im very happy with the standard kit.
The classic kit is ment to have more upper mids, hence the "mullard" tone, the lonestar already has loads of mids so thats why I went classic.

 

[lonestarpaul]

Hi Paul, I just had a doubt in my head incase the classic kit was even sweeter sounding, dont get me wrong Im very happy with the standard kit.
The classic kit is ment to have more upper mids, hence the "mullard" tone, the lonestar already has loads of mids so thats why I went classic.

Thanks for your reply Andy! :wink:
I was wondering, how d'you find these Harma tubes? I mean, I've never heard of them before checking Watfordvalves; besides I've always been a little skeptical about these all-in-one kits: they're a great ready replacement for sure, but to me it feels like being in a restaurant without the chance to order nothing but the only dish they have on the menu! lol :mrgreen:

I'm sure there's some research behind this, but I got doubts about a ready-made kit especially with a less-know brand like that...what d'you think about this kind of concern? Don't know if it makes any sense, but I'm just trying to figure it out the best I can. Thanks for help! :wink:

 

[handyandy]

Like I said they helped my channel 2, Ive still got a lot of low end if I want it but it seems less muffled if you know what I mean.
I dont hear such a big difference with channel 1 but if anything its very slightly sweeter.
I had a Laney before I got the Mesa and I spent a lot of time and money chopping and changing the tubes in it, sure I got some real nice tones but I didnt really go down that road again with the Mesa, I found it to be very trail and error, and some of those expensive valves dont always sound better than cheaper ones. Its just what you like yourself really.
I really like old style vintage tones and the harma's were just a simple way of changing my tone slightly with pleasing results I can recommend them!
Have you ever thought about changing pick-ups or speakers? These are a great way of moulding your tone also! Ive been playing with pick-ups recently and settled on a Bare Knuckle Mule in the bridge and a Duncan Alnico II Pro in the neck, very nice!
Theres loads of knowlage about valves on here thats just what I think, would like to hear some more thoughts from some other people on here also!
Hope I have helped in some way anyway (or made your choice more complicated) haha! Good luck man!

 

[lonestarpaul]

Like I said they helped my channel 2, Ive still got a lot of low end if I want it but it seems less muffled if you know what I mean.
I dont hear such a big difference with channel 1 but if anything its very slightly sweeter.
I had a Laney before I got the Mesa and I spent a lot of time and money chopping and changing the tubes in it, sure I got some real nice tones but I didnt really go down that road again with the Mesa, I found it to be very trail and error, and some of those expensive valves dont always sound better than cheaper ones. Its just what you like yourself really.

...yeah, got it...besides it's pretty funny since I used a Laney before Lonestar too!!! lol :mrgreen:

I really like old style vintage tones and the harma's were just a simple way of changing my tone slightly with pleasing results I can recommend them!

I'm more into modern-sounding tones, but that's not really a big deal considering that I use my LSC mostly as a 1 ch amp for my pedalboard.

Have you ever thought about changing pick-ups or speakers? These are a great way of moulding your tone also! Ive been playing with pick-ups recently and settled on a Bare Knuckle Mule in the bridge and a Duncan Alnico II Pro in the neck, very nice!

Yeah, absoultely...actually, I already did some pickup upgrades. Now I use a Gibson SG Standard with a Duncan Jazz on the neck and a Duncan Distortion on the bridge...love them!!! Bareknuckle pickups??? Wow, they're stunning!!! :wink:
Talking about speakers, I really cannot complain with V30s...for now they seem to work great as all-around speakers able to handle clean/crunchy and also higher-gain tones. Of course I'll try other cabs/speakers if I'll get the chance :wink:

Theres loads of knowlage about valves on here thats just what I think, would like to hear some more thoughts from some other people on here also!
Hope I have helped in some way anyway (or made your choice more complicated) haha! Good luck man!

Sure man, you did it and I thank you for that! :wink:
Maybe in my case, considering that I'm not looking for the "perfect" vintage tone and also that I use my LSC mostly as I one-channel amp to run my pedalboard, I don't have to look too far...I just want to be sure to buy the best I can for my needs, that's all :wink:

 

[lonestarpaul]

Anyone tried this Lonestar tube set by Captain Bob's Electronic Emporium?

 

[Musical123]

Lonestar Paul,

What did you end up getting? and how does it sound?

I am also in the market for some pre-amp tubes and am interested in hearing about your experience.

 

[lonestarpaul]

Lonestar Paul,

What did you end up getting? and how does it sound?

I am also in the market for some pre-amp tubes and am interested in hearing about your experience.

...nothing yet, I'm still searching.
Right now I think I'll keep things simple picking one of those Watfordvalves kits for Lonestar; I don't like JJs so I won't go for Eurotubes, but if you do that would be another great choice. I'm pretty sure that there are a lot of good options out there in the used and NOS market too, but there are a lot of brands and models with a lot of difference considering the year of production, factory etc. ...pretty hard to figure it out for non-expert like me :shock:

 

[FunkyMonkey]

I have to agree with the earlier post on Watford Valves - excellent advice and service. I literally last week bought and installed a set of the Cryo Classic Harma valves and it tightened up the bottom end of my LSC 10/50/100 a lot. The amp always sounded good with a pedal in the front, but my Xotic BB sounds even better now.

I've only had one rehearsal with it, and was impressed - more definition. I usually have Drive and Gain around 2:30-3:00 on Ch2 and was hating the fact that I couldn't use the neck pickup even with the bass down on 1.

Next gig is on Feb 20th - so will report back after then!

D

 

[lonestarpaul]

I have to agree with the earlier post on Watford Valves - excellent advice and service. I literally last week bought and installed a set of the Cryo Classic Harma valves and it tightened up the bottom end of my LSC 10/50/100 a lot. The amp always sounded good with a pedal in the front, but my Xotic BB sounds even better now.

I've only had one rehearsal with it, and was impressed - more definition. I usually have Drive and Gain around 2:30-3:00 on Ch2 and was hating the fact that I couldn't use the neck pickup even with the bass down on 1.

Next gig is on Feb 20th - so will report back after then!

D

...thanks man, I'd really like to know how Harma tubes sound in comparison with the stock Mesa and also with the "classic" ones like Mullard, Philips, etc. ...hope to hear from you soon :wink:

 

[FunkyMonkey]

Hi,

Well the gig was last night - small venue, playing in 50w mode, with diode rectification. Amp performed really, well and the mud has definitely got better. Clean channel was not really affected by the change of valves to my ear, but that is a good thing Ch2 was smooth and singing even at low volumes, and if anything I actually wound off the gain a little, and certainly cut the mids back slightly. It is really difficult to give the kind of descriptions that others do when commenting on valves, as this is my first toe in the water of experimenting in this area.

I am really pleased though and am looking forward to pushing it a little harder in a couple of weeks when we play a larger venue.

It was good to hear the BB pre-amp at the front end of the amp. The Classic valve in V1 that comes with the kit I bought from Watford valves definitely performs better than the stock Mesa (not that performed badly to my ears, the Harma was just better!)


D

 

[lonestarpaul]

...sounds great man! :wink:
Think I'll go for them when it's time to retube my amp.

Thanks for sharing and feel free to write more if you like...guess this thread can be really useful for all the LS folks out there! :wink: