Getting a Cab to Match my upcoming Dual Recto!

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Ok guys! So after alot of reseach and time debating, I am going to purchase a Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier. My only dilemna now....what cab to pair it with.....

Now, I'd love a Recto traditional cab, but I can't spend $900 on a cab after I'm already spending $1700 for the head, so I'm looking for some good alternatives. I'm looking for a big, heavy, yet defined and articulate bass, which is why I was planning on a traditional over the oversized in the first place.

So, do you guys have any recommendations for a cab to pair with my Dual recto....I've been recommended many cabs.....here is what I've thought....

1. Carvin Legacy 4x12: Well built cab, has V30's like the recto ($600 new/450 used)

2. Carvin V3 4x12 (has Celestion G12T75s.....are they any good? I've heard mixed reviews....$550 new.....400 used)

3. Avatar Cab with assortment of speakers: This is where I think I could really have some fun with some good speakers....I've heard very very good things about the Eminence swamp thangs and governor....would a mix of them be a good idea? I can always get V30s with them too.....What combos do you suggest?($450 new/used?)

4. Vadar cabs have been recommended to me....I don't think I'm going to go with them.....

So, what do you guys think? Do I go for something that is similar to the recto cab? How are the G12T75 celestions?

What do you suggest with avatar?

All your help is appreciated!!

 

[no soul]

if you want a tight articulate low end,

Id rank em like this

VHT Fat Bottom
Genz Benz G-Flex
Bogner Uber 4x12
Marshall 1960

the VHT has I believe P50e speakers
dont recall what the G-flex speakers are called
the Bogner Uber has v30s mixed with g12t75s, which is an amazing combo. Still has the midrange punch of mesa cabs, but is tighter.
the Marshall has all g12t75s, which are just tighter than v30s period.

If you are looking at used cabs, and dont want to break the bank, this is also where Marshall cabs win. There are so many used ones floating arround, its not hard to get your hands on one.
If you really want the Mesa cab though, and can wait, just check your local Craigslist a lot, I see them pop up here and there for not too much.

 

[jbird]

I'd go with Avatar, and I'd be curious about the X-patterned V30's and GT 75's! :idea:

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

One downside to avatar is that I have to get a straight cab....I like the projection of the slant cabs.....

Is the pattern of speakers worth not having the angle?

I've read (on these forums) that the marshall 1960A cabinets give the recto a thin fuzzy tone....

From the Carvins, would you recommend the Legacy or V3 cab to complement the recto?

 

[Platypus]

Are you opposed to the smaller size of a 2x12?

You can get a mesa 2x12 for 500 or so, probably even less used. It will a ton of volume.. the bass and mids are pretty good.. I say this cab has kind of a thumpy loose bass sound but since retubing my amp and working on muting techniques I can def get a nice tight bass out of it. It may be worth thinking about simply for the cheaper price and ease of movement back and forth.. a 4x12 cab is going to be pretty daunting to move yourself all the time.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

I'll have help with moving....with the casters and everything, I think I can handle it. I'm getting a dual recto, and to tell you the truth, I just simply want a 4x12 for it.....I love the fullness it puts out....

So, any suggestions between the cabs I've mentioned?

 

[jbird]

I recommend not compromising on gear! It always costs more in the long run! With that said, I again would advise on mating the amp with a Mesa cab! They're engineered for eachother!

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Alright....I'll definitely consider it.....anything else worth looking into though?

 

[Melvin1011]

Alright....I'll definitely consider it.....anything else worth looking into though?

How about Earcandy cabs? http://www.earcandycabs.com
You can customize them and they cost about the same as the Mesa 2x12. You can get almost any speaker combination you want in them and they are supposedly as full sounding as most 4x12's.

 

[CaughtLikeFire]

my vote goes to Avatar 4x12 with V30s and G12H30s in an X.

The G12H30s are great speakers - nice warm low-end and they don't have the big mid-scoop that the GT-75s have. The GT-75s always sounded a little bit sterile to me too. Great if you want a modern metal sound using hot pickups with a lot of compression though.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

The only thing about the avatars is that they are straight cabs....I really like the projection of a slant.....and I think I'm going to go with a 4x12, so ear candy, although they seem very nice, are out for now.

Later though, I'm definitely going to also add a 2x12, so then I will look into it.

Now, If I go with a used Mesa cab, and I want a full and strong, yet controlled and defined bass, would the traditional be the only way to go? Basically, my question, is the over-sized cab always cursed with the flabby bass....

I know this is the cab that Tremonti uses (mainly the tone I want), but he also has alot more gear and control over his tone....with my logic, I think that a traditional would be the best way to go while still acheiving close to the tone....agree or disagree with me?

 

[CaughtLikeFire]

The Recto Standard is controllable but for "controlled and defined bass" the Traditional will make life MUCH easier for you. You could try some sound dampening materials inside the Standard cab for example. Maybe work from the amp itself and add a 8 or 10 band EQ. Its doable but is it really worth it in the end?

I was just in the same situation that you are (bought a Recto Traditional new last week) so let me ask you this . . . are you SURE you can't afford a new Trad cab? Hold a balance on your card for a few more months, sell one or two pieces of old gear you don't use much . . .


the reason I ask is because almost all of the used cabs in nice condition are Recto Standards and they run $600 to $700. Instrument Exchange.com (has gear from Guitar Centers and private sellers from all over the US) had two Traditionals in 2 weeks ago but they all had $100 shipping fees. A lot of nice gear goes for the minimum bid b/c its not as popular as ebay 8) but the ones from a few weeks ago would have been $700 minimum when you add shipping. If you can find a great deal locally, jump on it! But you have to be really patient b/c you're going to have trouble 1) finding a Traditional and 2) finding one close by so you don't have to pay $100 shipping. Its also kinda risky to ship - you know a huge 120+ lb package is not going to be treated gently.

just my $0.2

The only thing about the avatars is that they are straight cabs....I really like the projection of a slant.....and I think I'm going to go with a 4x12, so ear candy, although they seem very nice, are out for now.

Later though, I'm definitely going to also add a 2x12, so then I will look into it.

Now, If I go with a used Mesa cab, and I want a full and strong, yet controlled and defined bass, would the traditional be the only way to go? Basically, my question, is the over-sized cab always cursed with the flabby bass....

I know this is the cab that Tremonti uses (mainly the tone I want), but he also has alot more gear and control over his tone....with my logic, I think that a traditional would be the best way to go while still acheiving close to the tone....agree or disagree with me?

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Well, to tell you the truth, I can afford a new traditional recto cab....it's towards the very ends of my budget, a little more than I'd like to spend, but if you guys really think it is worth the extra money, I will go for it.

There is a traditional on ebay that I may be able to for $650 from Cali.....I live in AZ.....should I go for it, or spend the extra $300+ for a new one....

 

[no soul]

I've read (on these forums) that the marshall 1960A cabinets give the recto a thin fuzzy tone....

From the Carvins, would you recommend the Legacy or V3 cab to complement the recto?

thats purebullshit.

Also, Marshall cabs are built better than the Carvin ones, so if you dont like the way the 1960 sounds, the V3 is going to be even wors for you.
The legacy cab is good, but it doesent sound like a Mesa cab.

Let me give you my "cab resume" if you will

at one point the cabs in my studio went like this
1 Mesa Oversize 4x12
1 Mesa Trad 4x12
1 Mesa 2x12 verticle
1 Mesa 2x12 horizontal
1 Marshall 1960a 300w
1 Marshall 1960a, circa 1975
1 Carvin Legacy
and a few more that really arent even worth talking about

amps included various Rectos, 5150s, vintage fender, a Triaxis rig, a BlueVoodoo etc etc

My point being Im willing to bet my bottom dollar Ive got a lot more experience with this sutff than most folks who play these things at the store for 30 minutes and then come home to harmony central and write a 50 page thesis on it!

I used to play only metal and hardcore, pretty fast and precussive stuff, so flubby bass is a BIG no no. With that in mind, I could never get ANY of the Mesa cabs to ever sound as tight as the Marshalls.

Matter of fact, Ive noticed more and more metal bands are using this combo.

Now, if I was going for more of a vintage groove, or just something NOT rock at all, then Id pick the Mesa cab ANY day of the week. Also, if I was primarily a soloist/lead guitarist, Id also pick the Mesa cab.

But it really depends on your application.
Im just saying before you pull the trigger, try as many different cabs as possible, dont take our word for it.

This is so subjective.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Alright, thanks no soul. That's exactly what I need to hear....at this point, stuff like that (the subjective views) is all I have and influences my views alot....but your post really really helped....

I'm looking for a good hard rock tone....mainly, ala Mark Tremonti.....now thinking on it again, I think I may just spend the little extra money and get a Mesa cab.....but which one?

He uses an oversized.....can it get a good none flabby tone without all the extra gear that he adds to pin-point his tone? Or should I get a traditional for safety? This cab has to last me quite some time, so I want it to be perfect for me....I should get to try them soon, but my store is currently out of mesa cabs.....

What would you guys here say? I've also been told Bogner cabs are the way to go for this much money....

 

[no soul]

I'm looking for a good hard rock tone....mainly, ala Mark Tremonti.....now thinking on it again, I think I may just spend the little extra money and get a Mesa cab.....but which one?



What would you guys here say? I've also been told Bogner cabs are the way to go for this much money....

In the case of Tremonti (or ANYBODY else for that matter)
you have to consider a few things.

First of all, when people try to cop a tone from a famous guitarist, their point of reference is usually in a recording. This can be very deadly.
For one, in most cases you dont know exactly what was used in the recording. A musician may have certain preferences/endorsements for gear, but once they step into a studio with a producer who likes DIFFERENT gear, that may not matter.

Now even if we ASSUME that in this Case, Tremonti still records with his "advertised rig," that still leaves out the whole process of recording!
There are a million and one things that happen in the recording process that will color your tone in a way your rig alone just CANNOT do. I can rant on this forever, but I think you get the idea.

On the flipside to that, lets say you are using a LIVE tone for reference. Well that still doesent take into account the fact that he is running through a PA system, which (much like a recording) is being mixed by a tech!

Im not saying your tonequest is in vain, but I am saying just be aware of what you are going after.

With that in mind, Im not THAT familiar with Creed or Alterbridge, but I do have a general idea of their tone. Id actually say the oversized cab would probably be fine for you, assuming your style is also similar to Tremonti. But be warned, if you change your mind the next day and decide you want to play Slayer, you are FUCKED :lol:

As far as the Bogner cabs go, they are awsome cabs, and very versatile. The thing is, for roughly half the price of a Bogner uberkab, you could buy a used Marshall 1960, and then swap in 2 V30s in an Xpattern, and GUESS WHAT! You have the same thing as the Bogner!


Still though, I say go out and try all these things for yourslef before you pull the trigger.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

That's exactly why I've been considering the traditional cab actually....I love the Tremonti tone, but I by no means need to replicated in 100% (which nearly impossible anways), so I think the traditional would be the best way to compromise the best of both worlds.

I'll have a tighter bass, but when needed, I think I'll be able to get pretty close to the tremonti tone with the traditional also.

I'll be sure to try a marshall out when I'm at the store too!

Anyone else?

 

[CaughtLikeFire]

That's exactly why I've been considering the traditional cab actually....I love the Tremonti tone, but I by no means need to replicated in 100% (which nearly impossible anways), so I think the traditional would be the best way to compromise the best of both worlds.

I'll have a tighter bass, but when needed, I think I'll be able to get pretty close to the tremonti tone with the traditional also.

I'll be sure to try a marshall out when I'm at the store too!

Anyone else?

I know you want some other folks to chime in, but one more thing:

Were you concerned that only the Standard could get enough bass to match Tremonti's sound? Cause the Traditional is not lacking in bass by any means - I still have to take it easy with the bass knob when I'm using SED 6L6s on my 50W Recto.

No Soul's idea of buying a used 1960A cab (the basic cheaper one with the GT-75's, not the 1960AV with the V30s) then buying a pair of V30s from Avatar, etc. sounds like a really good idea too . . . yeah a great idea actually 8) Just take off the Marshall logo :wink:

just thought of this too in terms of getting a tight sound for fast riffs and palm muting - you'll raise the frequency of the bass focus and "tighten up the bass" by using EL 34 tubes instead of the stock 6L6. Something like the Groove Tubes 34L (the 30W modified JJ tubes) or the new JJ KT-77 (I have a pair of those on the way actually and I'll post a review up soon) would help out. Speakers are a big deal but your amp, guitar (specifically pickups) matter a lot too when you're talking about how tight the bass is.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Alright....I just called my store up and it looks like the only cab I'll get to try from them is a standard.....he's gonna call me back in and hour or two.

Anyone else have something to share in the meantime.

 

[no soul]

Just take off the Marshall logo :wink:

just thought of this too in terms of getting a tight sound for fast riffs and palm muting - you'll raise the frequency of the bass focus and "tighten up the bass" by using EL 34 tubes instead of the stock 6L6. Something like the Groove Tubes 34L (the 30W modified JJ tubes) or the new JJ KT-77 (I have a pair of those on the way actually and I'll post a review up soon) would help out. Speakers are a big deal but your amp, guitar (specifically pickups) matter a lot too when you're talking about how tight the bass is.

Hey, those cabs arent worth half as MUCH without the Marshall logo! Thats where they got all their tone!
Actually, I was thinking of cutting one of mine up, so that it says "Mesa" just in the Marshall font.

And as far as the tubes go, Mike Soldano (of Soldano amps) made a great statement about that.. I just cant find it at the momment!
In effect he spoke about how people always asked him about which tube will give off what sound etc etc etc and his response was to just change your speakers instead!

Changing tubes in fine tuning, now selecting your is deciding half your tone!