Does LSS Cut it Live

[Leroy the Massochist]

I agree Skoora; this is what creates my problem. On channel 2 i have the gain at about 10 oclock and the master at 2 to 3 oclock. I am benused at comments that the LSC has great sound at bedroom level. Inthe clean channel yes but in the dirty channel it overdrives too much and is near muddy at bedroom levels.

When you cranck the dirty channel it cleans up, becomes more focused, bright and exactly the sound I want. However it is so loud that I cannot seem to match the volume of chanel 1 on a clean setting. The master on channel 1 actually compresses the sound.

Comments about miking up are taken into account however the volume I am looking at is just so that it cuts through the drums and so that I can hear it. This is a really frustrating aspect as at above bedroom level but below drummer volume the clean sound is outstanding.

 

[GeoBull]

I've never understood why the LSS wasn't built with channel one being a non master. Simply volume. With 30 watts in class A with EL84's, it would be perfect. Natural crunch after a point. Then channel 2 can do the fizz, fuzz, ect.

I've read many complaints about headroom in this rig and a 30 watt amp with EL84's in class A is never gonna have enough clean headroom without a clean channel.

Hell, even the Vai Carvin 100 watt amp has a clean channel without a master. Hell, even a Peavey Classic 30 has a non master clean channel.

I mean, I know Mesa is not about clean, but it's the reason people buy a lot of other amps.

Best of luck

A technical questions about these comments. What would the difference be between a clean channel with no master and e.g. ch 1 on an LSS with the master at full?

 

[MONGO]

The answer. The LSC is the one but for the tone of the LSS if thats your thing two of them will do better than one at gigs. Cleaner headroom higher volume since you dont have to crank them up. Its not a bad idea just a little weight to carry but then again tone is worth any effort no ?

I have two LSS and two LSC one with 34's and one with 6l6's

 

[Murphy Slaw]

Jazzgear, a LSS is not pure class a either. Regardless of what is printed on the front of it.

Geobull, I don't technically know the difference, but there is one. A master volume amp starts distorting far sooner than a none master. Hell look at the headroom in a 22 watt Fender Deluxe Reverb with 6V6's.

I play a non master volume Mesa Blue Angel for most club gigs, and it has a lot of headroom for 38 watts, if you keep the mid control under 1/2, because the mid is designed to break up after 12:00 in a Blue Angel.

Like I said, I don't have a dog in this fight, I just like 4 EL84's with a non master channel that you can crank for "natural" clipping.

Best to ya.

 

[Newysurfer]

I tried a LSS Head and 2x12 cab for a week. At home it was great. When I played it live with the band - a not too loud acoustic rock with drums band - I had trouble hearing my Rickenbacker 12 cut through. There was just not enough clean head room. Les Paul through Ch2 was fine but still very round sounding and ,although plenty loud enough, just not that clear. I now have an Express 5:50 2x12 which gives me the cut required. More versatile than LSS - it can Rock as well as blues. Rickenbacker 12 cuts through the band really well.

Both are good amps but the Express suits me better.

How does the 550 Express do playing with a band? I will soon be playing in my first band. I am curious to see how the Express keeps up. Is the 50 watts enough? Do you have to mic the amp all the time? If so what's the best way to mic the amp? The band leader told me everything would be going through a sound board, so I know My amp will be amped regardless

SlingBlade - the 5:50 is plenty loud enough to cut thru any band. A 100w amp is not twice as loud you know - it's 3db louder. The 5:50 is a very loud 50w amp & more than enough for a small-med club un-cabbed. Add a 2x12 or 4x12 cab and the tone hardens up and is massive for med-large venue. Mic'ed to PA you could play an auditorium with a 5:50. The Edge uses 2 Vox AC30's live - that's only 60w total.

 

[Chris F]

Hey...don't forget that the Edge also usesa Fender Blues Jr too, that's another 15W :lol:

 

[goneloco]

Im sorry to tell you but you purchased a bedroom amp!
big names that use small amps have huge concert systems that ignite their volume. you need at least 50 watts for good clean headroom and at least 2 -12's to handle the wattage.

 

[Murphy Slaw]

Man, dont' tell my 38 watt 1;12 Blue Angel that, or it'll get mad at me for gigging 200/400 seat clubs EVERY FREAKIN' WEEKEND unmiked.

Every one knows, you don't want an Angel mad at you......

 

[Leroy the Massochist]

I will try the new Vox AC30. They can sound very much like the LSS, I can by a 5 watt epihone or a blues junior for practice and pocket a thousand bucks.

 

[Mr_You]

If no one has mentioned this already...

You might set the amp up how you like it and if you need more volume without sacrificing headroom (I assume its mic'ed) then get the sound guy to increase your amp level in your monitor to get the volume you're missing and the tone projected towards you instead of your legs (wedge monitor pointing at you). You'll also have a better representation of what the audience is hearing. This is how you get volume from low watt amps.

You can also remove rear casters to get an amp to tilt back a bit but not much.

 

[GeoBull]

I will try the new Vox AC30. They can sound very much like the LSS, I can by a 5 watt epihone or a blues junior for practice and pocket a thousand bucks.

I returned an AC 30 CC2x (blue alnicos) for the LSC and then bought the LSS as well. It was a tough call and in some ways I miss the Vox. it was LOUD but not necessarily at lot of clean headroom. It was also not as versatile, not made in US, not made by Mesa, and smelled way funky to boot . Seriously, it sounded great at what it did, it did break up more than e.g. LSC.

The LSS definitely low on clean headroom and probably not as loud as AC30. I'm happy with what I've got and glad I didn't stick with the Vox.

 

[F.Ace]

I tried many combos before choosing the LSS,Includind the AC 30,Lsc and many more.I truely found the holy grail on the first lick I played with the LSS.
I recently retube my LSS with some Electro-Harmonix tubes and I prefered them to Mesa stock tubes.Every reviews I've read about them are bad but I dont understand why,Russian tubes are less expensive and quite fine to me,it seems like my singlecoil pickups is less noisy than before,maybe my stock tubes were just too old too.
Plus my LSS is ok on volume at band pratice and clubs ,I use it with my 4x10 Marshall lead Mosfet cab and I like the result,my bandmate and audience too.


My band: http://www.myspace.com/n39tre

 

[speedy mcfeely]

Use an extension cab.

Or you can set both channels on 30w mode, plug the speaker into the optional 35w jack, and set the pre amp gain low, master high.

or use 35w as before noted, use hard bypass mode and control with volume and gain.

or mic,

in reality the sound guy wants you to be quieter on stage. he would rather mic you and have a quieter stage volume, so the house mix is cleaner and tighter. I use a mic'd setup. I have an extension speaker to use for more air movement. it was mentioned but the stock tubes in any mesa are junk. get some NOS, or nice new tubes. I like NOS 5751 preamp tubes instead of 12ax7. Swap out all of the tubes, new recto, preamp and power tubes. my set up is as follows 5751 in v1-4, 12at7 in v5, NOS 5y3, JJ high gain el84's. I get tons of clean headroom, but it's not a fender. It has more of a BADCAT mentality in design. it wants to have a little hair on the clean channel.

try out above, and retube. you will find the best tone that you have ever come across. the LSS is killer, you just have to earn it.

 

[goneloco]

Man, dont' tell my 38 watt 1;12 Blue Angel that, or it'll get mad at me for gigging 200/400 seat clubs EVERY FREAKIN' WEEKEND unmiked.

Every one knows, you don't want an Angel mad at you......

oh! let me guess everyboby is miked except for the blue angel.

 

[SabuJSE]

Speedy hit it right on the head - tons of options at your disposal. I did a full retube with JJ's, got an ext 1x12 cab, and a good mic setup takes care of everything else.

Man - it just *sucks* to have all these options!

 

[timmerel]

On channel one I never take the Master past 11, instead using the solo control as the main volume control for that channel rather than the output control. I just use the output control for the overall volume level on channel 2. In other words I treat it as a 2 master 2 output control amp.

It means I need to press both channel switch and solo buttons on the footswitch to change channels and balance volumes, but that way I get balance between clean and dirty, plus enough clean headroom to avoid any problems. Give it a shot and see if it helps.

And +1 on the retube, particularly the power tubes. NOS Tungsram seem to have both a great sound and better clean headroom than others I've tried. The Mesa tubes were horrible both clean and dirty in comparison. JJs weren't bad, but not as nice sounding to my ears.

 

[Strat N My Stuff]

I just bought a 3/4 back 1x12 cab and using it with the LSS, I don't need to mike it. That being said, other than the drummer, were not considered loud by any means. :x I keep pushing them though!

 

[Mick]

Jazzgear, a LSS is not pure class a either. Regardless of what is printed on the front of it.

Geobull, I don't technically know the difference, but there is one. A master volume amp starts distorting far sooner than a none master. Hell look at the headroom in a 22 watt Fender Deluxe Reverb with 6V6's.

I play a non master volume Mesa Blue Angel for most club gigs, and it has a lot of headroom for 38 watts, if you keep the mid control under 1/2, because the mid is designed to break up after 12:00 in a Blue Angel.

Like I said, I don't have a dog in this fight, I just like 4 EL84's with a non master channel that you can crank for "natural" clipping.

Best to ya.

Nuthin' personal Murph but when you make a statement regarding the class A status of the LSS you ought to back it up. I've only re-tubed and swapped speakers in my amps so I'm no tech but if you read Randall Smith's explanation on Mesa's site it's pretty obvious that he knows what Class A is. http://www.mesaboogie.com/US/Smith/founder_s_articles.htm

 

[Murphy Slaw]

Hey Mick. I really don't want to get into it. My Blue Angel says Pure Class A on it too, and the majority on this forum will argue the point. Do a search. But hey, I gig it every weekend unmiked, cranked, and love it to death. It is my favorite amp and I've been playing bars for many decades, and have owned a bunch.

I'm big into Mesa now.

Best of luck to ya'll.

 

[Mick]

No problem Murph. Like I said, I don't know tech and figured I'd toss out that link so you could check it out.

I love my LSS too! After an initial de-bug(pre amp tube took a dump 1st day I had it) I re-tubed it with NOS Teslas and dropped in a Celestion Gold. The only drawback as far as I can see is that now I'm hungry for another Mesa.....like a new LSC!! 8)