DC-5 Appreciation

[edward]

From what I can tell, the resistor simply alters the taper of the vol pot ...I do not think it would affect the entire range. If it helps you any, I recall that before I did the mod, the volume knob on the output master didn't affect the actual volume much (if any) once you turned past 6-7, yet was enormously touchy under 2.

Eliminating said resistor from the circuit changed the taper such that knob settings of 1-3 is far more usable, and the sweep more "linear" (don't take that literally); and unintended benefit is the tone at bedroom levels is certainly improved to my ears. But it did nothing to change the tone at regular playing levels that I can tell.

Thanks edward!
I wonder why Mesa put the resistor there in the first place. Are there any techs out there who can explain that? Until then I'm not really secure in cutting it off. I mean, it might make the pot more useable, but what if it has some kind of security function for power tube failure or whatever - You won't even notice until a certain point - but then it might be too late and the damage done too great...that's what I fear.

Don't worry, really. Electrically, all that resistor does is change the value of the pot ...that's it. Nothing esoteric or complex. And all you're doing is snipping it so it is out of the circuit ...you don't have to remove anything. If you really want to hear the difference, snip the end of the resistor, leave that one end exposed but not touching anything, and A/B it with and w/o the resistor (alligator clips on a short wire to connect for testing). My guess is you will immediately hear and appreciate the difference that you won't even bother.

In terms of "why" the factory did it? No clue. Unless they wanted to give the amp the initial impression that "whoa, this thing sure is loud for just 50 watts" when demoed on the showroom floor just to impress the would-be buyer? Who knows...

Oh, and thank Lankyleo for some great pics

Edward

 

[lockbody]

As much as I liked it before (with Svet winged Cs), what pushed me over the edge to adoration is a NOS 5751 in the v4 (rhythm channel) and a NOS 12AT7 in the v6, the PI. This really gave Ch1 some lovely "chime" but also smoothed out the highs (just more pleasing up top, less "edgy"). And also made Ch2 smoother up top as well. I still have more gain than I'll ever use, but it makes the sweep of the gain knob much more usable and musical, at least for my musical style. Enjoy! I know mine is a keeper!!

Edward

So I tried the Phillips at7 in the PI and my other Phillips ax7 in V4 and whoa mama!

So it's now:

JAN Phillips 12ax7
JJ Hi gain
Penta
JAN Phillips 12ax7
Chinese
JAN Phillips 12at7

I can see how a 5751 will really work good in V4 as with humbuckers it's still kind of hot, and with a Strat the top is a hair edgy as described. The dynamics are incredible, though. Play softly and it's just *** sweet as can be, but dig in and it gets really punchy.

And channel two? 80's metal starts at 4, 90's at 5-6, and anything after 7 is simply too much for my tastes and I like a LOT of gain to hide my sloppy playing.

What an amp.

 

[Setzer]

I just did the volume pot trick,on my DC5 the resistor was on the pot itself.

Wow what a difference,as mentioned previously at low volumes the amp is now FAR better,definate keeper.

Thanks so much for this tip.

 

[edward]

Glad you like it, Bob.

Not everyone does, but I think it's an "improvement" in that it delivers more of the tone *I* want from what is already a stunningly versatile and beautiful sounding amp. Ch1 is better and breakup is sweeter. Ch 2 still has way more gain than I'll ever need (or want), but what remains on the knob sounds better, less strident, and much more "musical"

Edward

 

[MJ Slaughter]

Hey mj,
I never played a DC10, but from those who have, the tone/girth is purportedly "bigger" ...prob by sheer nature of the larger trannies. I would not ignore a good DC10 in head config just because you don't think you "need" the wattage. Give it a try and let us know what you think.

Edward

Edward,

I got the DC-10 yesterday. The reasonable part of my brain lost the argument. Very clean late model head with newish tubes. The only problem was a noise in the clean channel that I suspected was the gain pot. I changed that out today and it's 100%. It is really a monster head in terms of tone, volume and size. I'm going to have to get another cabinet for it. The price was right at $840 for the head, footswitch, quality speaker cable and a Marshall 2x12 cab loaded with Celestion 12T's. The cabinet and speakers are not my thing so that will be sold making my net cash for the head to be around $600 - $650.

This thing sounds so pretty and chimey when clean but also brutal when cranked on channel 2. I already have a DC-5 combo that I may sell. I've been wanting a head so it would be easier to transport though it is 2 pieces.

Regarding the sensitive master volume issue: I find the DC-10 to be much more gradual than my DC-5. I even checked for a clipped resistor to see if someone beat me to it but it's still all original as far as I can see.

Can some of you DC users comment on what speakers you like with your amp, other than the C90 or V30? I don't care for V30's much but liked the C90 in the combo. I played the head with a cabinet loaded with Eminence Cannabis Rex which sounds great.

 

[cb101]

MJ Slaughter: I have two Bogner 212's, one with the Cannabis Rex's and the other with Celestion Classic Lead 80's. To me they sound great alone or when working together. I have a couple of other cabs with V30's and while they have that mid bump they sound pretty good with both the Lonestar and the DC-5. If I had to choose only one to use it would be the 212 with the Cannabis Rex's. I play and record mostly jazz and fusion with some classic rock thrown in.

 

[MJ Slaughter]

MJ Slaughter: I have two Bogner 212's, one with the Cannabis Rex's and the other with Celestion Classic Lead 80's. To me they sound great alone or when working together. I have a couple of other cabs with V30's and while they have that mid bump they sound pretty good with both the Lonestar and the DC-5. If I had to choose only one to use it would be the 212 with the Cannabis Rex's. I play and record mostly jazz and fusion with some classic rock thrown in.

Thanks cb101. Good to hear about the Cannabis Rex. I was also toying with the idea of the Classic Lead 80's, I think they're supposed to be close to the C90, but everytime I play through my Eminence C.R. it just plain sounds great. Unfortunatly it's a 1x12 and at only 50 watts I'm going to need a 2x12 so I need to buy another cab. I'd like to be able to use this future 2x12 cab with my Stiletto as well though both amps are very different from one another I'm not sure how that would workout.

 

[cb101]

The Classic Leads are a well balanced speaker. Almost like a monitor as they don't seem to color the sound very much. The CR, as you know, tends to be a little dark. Both fit my playing needs very well especially when used together.

 

[edward]

Ooooh, Congrats, MJ. Sounds like you really scored!!

Since you are a DC5 owner, I'd be interested in you A/B-ing them side by side ...particularly the clean channel (to keep it consistent, though, plug your combo's speaker into the head). I'd love to hear what your impressions of the diffs are.

Speakers ...are you thinking of a 212? If so, the MC90 (which I gather you like in your dc5 combo) along with an EVM12L is superb. I have both an EV-loaded Thiele cab as well as a same size 112 open-backed cab with an EVM. Both sound great sitting atop my combo, though the obvious nod goes to the thiele. But you running a 212 cab with an MC and an EVM will certainly sound huge together.

Edward

 

[MJ Slaughter]

Ooooh, Congrats, MJ. Sounds like you really scored!!

Since you are a DC5 owner, I'd be interested in you A/B-ing them side by side ...particularly the clean channel (to keep it consistent, though, plug your combo's speaker into the head). I'd love to hear what your impressions of the diffs are.

Speakers ...are you thinking of a 212? If so, the MC90 (which I gather you like in your dc5 combo) along with an EVM12L is superb. I have both an EV-loaded Thiele cab as well as a same size 112 open-backed cab with an EVM. Both sound great sitting atop my combo, though the obvious nod goes to the thiele. But you running a 212 cab with an MC and an EVM will certainly sound huge together.

Edward

That's a good idea. I'll A/B them tomorrow when no one is around. If I did it now I'd be getting really ugly looks from the wife. The only thing thats kept me from an EVM12L is the weight. Monsterous speakers.

I'll report in tomorrow.

 

[MJ Slaughter]

Edward,

I forgot that I had to take the channel 1 gain pot out of my DC-5 for the DC-10 to make sure that was what my trouble was. I've got a new one order but it won't be in until sometime next week. If your still interested I'll A/B it then and report back. I think that Monsta-tone has got both a DC-5 and DC-10 as well.

 

[edward]

Actually, I would still be interested. Yeah, monsta had both as well ...and I got his impressions (but don't want to bias you ).

But the reason I'd like to get yours is if you can A/B based on the same cabinet, that'd give me a better idea of their diffs. When you get the chance, post back. Thanks!!

Edward

 

[Nomad]

I too would be interested in what the differences and similarities are.

I dont think I have ever had the Pleasure of hearing a DC-10.

Me likey the EV12L and MC-90 Combination. FWIW I have an MC-90 for sale I got from Edward. Works perfect and is spottless. 8 ohms.

I dont need a two speaker combination and have settled on the EVM12L Classic Edward has my original EV. That is because the way I was trying to run my Mark III wouldnt work but then I went a different route and realised it would indeed work. If that make any sense.

At some point I want a DC-5 Combo LED's or not but a Clean one.


Did you try some Lubricated Contact Cleaner in the Pot before removing?

 

[MJ Slaughter]

Hello Nomad,

It wasn't that kind of noise that cleaning would have helped. Though hard to describe I've heard it before in a Nomad 100 head I had. Sometimes the pot can get so bad that by applying pressure to the shaft you can feel it move a little and the noise level changes.

If you're interested Nomad I'll let you know when my DC-5 will be ready for sale and I'll send you pictures. It is the latest model, very clean with the two buttom footswitch and amp cover I bought last year still in like new condition. It's got SED Winged C power tubes and some combination of different preamp tubes recomended by Doug at Doug's Tubes.

Of course I could change my mind on selling it if after I A/B the amps and I prefer the DC-5. One way or another one of the amps will have to go. Wish I could keep it all but something has to give.

 

[Nomad]

Hello Nomad,

It wasn't that kind of noise that cleaning would have helped. Though hard to describe I've heard it before in a Nomad 100 head I had. Sometimes the pot can get so bad that by applying pressure to the shaft you can feel it move a little and the noise level changes.

If you're interested Nomad I'll let you know when my DC-5 will be ready for sale and I'll send you pictures. It is the latest model, very clean with the two buttom footswitch and amp cover I bought last year still in like new condition. It's got SED Winged C power tubes and some combination of different preamp tubes recomended by Doug at Doug's Tubes.

Of course I could change my mind on selling it if after I A/B the amps and I prefer the DC-5. One way or another one of the amps will have to go. Wish I could keep it all but something has to give.

10-4 Keep me posted.

I have a list of different Mark models I want in my stable and while the DC-5 aint a Mark model it is eventually going into the collection.

So please keep me informed if you decide to sell it.

 

[ChrisCst22]

Just a heads up to check back to this thread Thursday. I should have my newly re-tolexed hot white DC-5 up and running, I'll get a bunch of pics up.

 

[Nomad]

Just a heads up to check back to this thread Thursday. I should have my newly re-tolexed hot white DC-5 up and running, I'll get a bunch of pics up.

Well lets see em.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I just re-tolexed mine in Wine Taurus. Looks really sweet.

I got the tubes from Doug's Tubes yesterday, installing them this morning, but it's 5 am, so I can't wake the kids up yet. :lol:


I've tried a few speakers in mine and I keep going back to the C-90. I really like what it does for the mids. They are smooth, and accentuated. Not harsh and in your face like the Vintage 30.

I have a 3/4 back 1x12 with an EVM that I got here from AJ that sits under it. :lol: Might have to recover that too!

I changed the grill cloth too. I used the tan wicker, but didn't soak it long enough or something, because it sort of looks like crap. Oh well, good thing I bought extra.


These are really great amps.

 

[MJ Slaughter]

Actually, I would still be interested. Yeah, monsta had both as well ...and I got his impressions (but don't want to bias you ).

But the reason I'd like to get yours is if you can A/B based on the same cabinet, that'd give me a better idea of their diffs. When you get the chance, post back. Thanks!!

Edward

Okay Edward, for what it's worth here is my opinion. I played each, head and combo, into the C90 mounted in the combo cab. There are different power and preamp tubes in the amps so there could be some differences there. Both amps sound great but the DC-10 head is definitely more girthy with more low end thump. I think you'd expect that out of any 100 vs 50 watt amp. I found myself just strumming clean chords listening to the pretty sounds. The 50 sounds a little more chimey but that's probably only because it doesn't have the same low end so I hear the upper frequencies a little more predominantly. I did my comparison with all controls set the same and there was plenty of room to shape the tone either way. I would be happy with either amp.

The only reason I bought the DC-10 head is because I wanted a head and couldn't find one in the DC-5. I actually communicated with someone on this board about buying their DC-5 head in excellent condition. He was about to sell but unfortunately came to his senses and just couldn’t part with it. I certainly don't need 100 watts but now that I have it I'm going to keep it. Apparently they're hard to come by and mine is in very good condition.

Bottom line is I can’t really compare the two amps too much tone wise because of the tubes being so different. One has all EH 12AX7’s and Winged C 6L6’s and the other Doug’s mix of various tube brands for preamp and Svetlana 6L6’s. I’m confident that you would enjoy either one.

 

[edward]

Hey MJ,

Thanks for that! I suppose tubes can create some of the difference, but that 100w tranny has got to have something to do with it.

I guess I'm not "missing" anything tonewise by not having the dc10, especially since I can get plenty of girth/tight bottom with the thiele cab sitting on top of my dc5 combo. I just needed to know that the grass isn't any greener over there.
Besides, if I want monstrous lows when clean, my MKIII can certainly fill that gap. What a blessing it is to have both these splendid tone machines!

Thanks for taking the trouble and doing the a/b comparo! Running your 10 through the 5's combo cab really makes for a truer comparison. Appreciate your time, bro!!

Edward