Changed the tubes on my '90 Mark IV...

[JPIndustrie]

I just received my full retube kit from Bob at Eurotubes. Got the 6L6/E34L combo with the high gain preamp.

Put it in today at practice and all I could say is 'wow'. The traditional Mark tightness, dynamics and feel seemed to be magnified two fold, and the E34L/6L6 combo definitely adds that upper-mid shift a la Marshall/Stiletto, but still retains that FAT Mesa mark 6L6 low end. Amazing.

With this setup, I don't think there's a tone I 'can not' achieve.

Thanks Mesa for making such a great amp. I was never this impressed with my Dual Recto, F-50, nor my ROV combo, and certainly not with any other manufacturer.

 

[ToneAddictJon]

I have the same tube set in mine, really lets everything shine I think. The mark IV's are just an amazing amp, as well as the entire mark series.

 

[visualrocker69]

Interesting. Most people dislike JJ's for Mark IV's.

 

[6L6C]

I used the 6L6/EL34 combination for years but went back to all 6L6’s again the only difference this time I’m using SED’s as opposed to Mesa tubes what a difference OOOOOOOOOO

I going to also pick up a quad of SED’s using the 6L6/EL34 combination, cause the bottom line I want both worlds!

 

[rockhound76s]

I ordered the exact same JJ set a few months ago. I love the power section with the 6L6/E34L, but I find the preamp tubes make the tone too dark through my setup--especially at stage volume where it seems like there is a blanket over the amp.

I ended up swapping the preamp tubes back to the original Mesas and have been happy ever since. YMMV, of course...

 

[Restless Rocks]

"Blanket over my amp" is my own descrition of JJ 12AX7's. Most of us agree there are many great sounding choices of tubes but I also prefer Mesa tubes over JJ's anytime. A more "gainy" sound is not necessarily a better tone IMO.

 

[Aart]

I'm using JJ's mixed with EH in the preamp and JJ powertubes.

Sounds fatter and takes some of the brightness from the EH's.

 

[OverDriven]

The Mark IV has enough gain. JJ's are crap IMO.

 

[MusicManJP6]

FWIW, I'm using GTs. I bought them originally for my XXX, but soon after decided to get the MKIV and swapped the GTs from the Peavey to the Mark, and vice versa. The original tubes in the Mesa were of unknown age. Once I kill the GTs I'll invest in some other tubes. I'm still trying to see what the overall consensus for what tubes to go with next is. Sounds like Mesa preamp tubes are the way to go, so the power tubes are the only unknown still... I DO know that I don't like the 6L6/EL34 combination. If I wanted a Marshall sound, I would have bought a Marshall!

I'll keep checking back on this thread to see what others recommend/use for their power section...

 

[Silverwulf]

"Blanket over my amp" is my own descrition of JJ 12AX7's. Most of us agree there are many great sounding choices of tubes but I also prefer Mesa tubes over JJ's anytime. A more "gainy" sound is not necessarily a better tone IMO.

Simple solution...turn down the gain on your amp. A high gain tube doesn't dictate how much gain is in your tone: you do. Just like buying a Ferrari doesn't automatically mean you're driving 3 times the speed limit every time you put it in drive. The tube has tonal characteristics...it's the player who controls the tone.

High gain JJ's do offer more gain than standard tubes of the nature, but what people also tend to miss is the extra clarity, tightness, and definition they also get from them. You can't make a tube articulate better or become tighter by messing around with the amp, but you can control how bright your sound is and how much gain you use.

I've used high gain JJ's in all of my amps for quite a while now. I've never heard a bad thing about the sound of any of my amps, from JJ lovers and haters alike.

 

[Restless Rocks]

Tightness definition and clarity are the exact reasons I don't like JJ tubes. Also I probably use a lot less gain on my amp settings than many who are after the modern metal types sounds. I play in a cover band and need my amp to "do it all". This topic has been covered dozens of times in previous threads and again the answer is: ask three people what are their favorite tubes and for what reasons and you'll get 15 answers. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion and especially the persuit of their own sound. I for one don't need anyone's approval when it comes to the sound of my Boogie amps. Tone is in the ear of the player and the listener. I encourage everyone to boldly go to your own tone nirvana and be unafraid to experiment with tubes and become your own expert.

 

[Silverwulf]

I'm glad you don't need anyones approval when it comes to your tone. It would be pretty sad here if anyone did... 8)

And you said it...there's no right or wrong answer when it comes to tubes. If it makes you happy and you find the tone you like, use whatever suits you best. I think everyone should try different tubes and experiment.

But, in my opinion, I like JJ's best for what I do. I play modern metal, use JJ's in a Recto, and never run the gain past 12 o'clock. I don't have the "blanket over the amp" syndrome by any means.

 

[Restless Rocks]

Thanks Silverwolf; I know lot's of players who like the JJ's in a Recto because they seem to add some beef to the sound and maybe tame the upper harmonic emphasis inherent to that design. Us Mark players (well at least some of us) find that the "Fendery" "Glassy" "Sparkley" character of the Mark design is somewhat dampened by the JJ's. I'm just so glad that we have enough choices available now that you can get virtually whatever sound trips your trigger. Let's talk about NOS telefunkens, mullards, sylvanias, rca's, ge's, amperex, etc. I'm sorry but it just irks me that so many people have to worry about how somebody else get's their sound that they can't just turn on their amp and turn some knobs and use their pick and their ears and get happy.

 

[Silverwulf]

I'm sorry but it just irks me that so many people have to worry about how somebody else get's their sound that they can't just turn on their amp and turn some knobs and use their pick and their ears and get happy.

Bingo! That's what I've been saying for years...too many people try to find good tone with their eyes instead of their ears. There's probably a lot of various tubes (and amps out there for that matter) that people would really enjoy if they'd just experiment a little with an open mind (and ears).

 

[ToneAddictJon]

I'm sorry but it just irks me that so many people have to worry about how somebody else get's their sound that they can't just turn on their amp and turn some knobs and use their pick and their ears and get happy.

Bingo! That's what I've been saying for years...too many people try to find good tone with their eyes instead of their ears. There's probably a lot of various tubes (and amps out there for that matter) that people would really enjoy if they'd just experiment a little with an open mind (and ears).

I think there's some really good points here, but for some people that may be new to tube amps, or looking to experiment they want to know what has worked for others so that they have a starting point. Tubes are like guitar picks, strings, or pickups, there are so many of them out there, some people get put off by trying to figure it out from scratch and would rather take what has worked and go from there. I know I've spent a lot of money and time getting MY tones, and if other people dig it and want to know what I'm using I have no problems lending my experience, and at almost every gig I play, at least one of the other guitarists come up to me and ask me what my amp is, guitar is, and what tubes, strings, picks, pickups and effects that I use.

 

[Restless Rocks]

I'm sorry but it just irks me that so many people have to worry about how somebody else get's their sound that they can't just turn on their amp and turn some knobs and use their pick and their ears and get happy.

Bingo! That's what I've been saying for years...too many people try to find good tone with their eyes instead of their ears. There's probably a lot of various tubes (and amps out there for that matter) that people would really enjoy if they'd just experiment a little with an open mind (and ears).

I think there's some really good points here, but for some people that may be new to tube amps, or looking to experiment they want to know what has worked for others so that they have a starting point. Tubes are like guitar picks, strings, or pickups, there are so many of them out there, some people get put off by trying to figure it out from scratch and would rather take what has worked and go from there.

You're so right man; sometimes it's almost like too many choices are a bad thing. Every time we open this "Pandora's Box" about tubes (and then along comes the bias issues associated with using non mesa spec tubes) I reach the same conclusion: Mesa designed their amps with certain tonal cababilities and go to a good bit of trouble to find and spec tubes that will always reliably operate in the parameters and tonal expectations of those designs. Of course there are other tubes that will sound better or worse depending on who's making the judgement. My advice to a novice mesa owner is this: Try and find the best sounds you possibly can with your stock mesa tubes and learn the basics of "The great tube experience". Especially learning how all the tone controls of the amp work and interact. Play-turn-listen. The differences in many tubes brands are subtle and many times can be emulated simply by small adjustments of your gain, treble, mid and bass controls and particularly the presence control. Your speaker choices (the part of your whole system that actually moves the air your ears hear) are critcal as well.
I have a whole box full of tubes I've bought and tried and for certain there are some that are far superior (albeit a lot more expensive) but in the amp I always take out to the gig I always find myself using Mesa tubes for these reasons. Reliability: they are consistant and I've never had one fail (knock on wood) Sound: when my bass player and drummer get fired up I must admit that I can't discern the difference between a telephunken or a sovtec in V1 when I'm at the mercy of the sound man and his idea tone along with a bunch of cymbals right between me and 700 watts of bass. I can change them out without benching and biasing and all that and expect the sound to always be the same. At the end of the night I still truly feel that your tone mostly comes from you.