Any Mark III users (or others) NOT using graphic EQ?

[BMcNibbnles]

WHen I set out to get a Mark III, the main criteria was that it NEEDED to have the graphic EQ. From what I read, the EQ was the dominant force in how the tone was shaped on the amp. Well, I've been playing (and, recording) for over a week with the amp and.... I might be coming to the conclusion that I actually.... ::gasp:: like the amp ..... ::another gasp:: WITHOUT the graphic EQ on. I haven't decided yet and obviously the graphic EQ serves different purposes (maybe good for rhythms and not lead, etc.), but I was just wondering what all your thoughts are on the issue....

 

[>Photi G<]

I'd imagine that at high volumes, the sound evens out, but at the low volumes that I play at, I need the GEQ to add that extra bottom end to the sound, and scoop out the excessive midrange that drowns out the rest of the tone with it's nasally growl. The only time I won't use the GEQ is on Rhythm 1, since this channel is the most dynamic of the 3, and sounds full and well rounded at any volume. R2, I may or may not use it, it really depends on my mood. It's almost always on on the Lead channel though. Too much midrange, and thin bass when playing quietly.

 

[bartchamdoh]

I have three mark 3's and two are non eq, i have found it just gets you tweaking the amp better.

 

[Neptical]

It adds beef to the stock in a big way. I always keep my GEQ on just because I like the big rounded out sound coming through a 4x12. When playing with the GEQ off, in order to balance it out to where I'd like it to be, I'd have to really get that power section going to really get it to start thumpin' which could be quite loud before moving some air. The GEQ on gives me that boost I need before the volume goes up . On top of that you have the 'pull' knobs that give such a great additional amount of tonal variety...and I haven't even said anything about Simulclass yet.

~Nep~

 

[boogiemon]

Adjusting a tube amp is tricky really because settings that sound good at one volume level aren't so good at a different volume level. @ home for practicing i use the "pull deep" feature, but in a live setting indoors i turn it off. Up loud outside it's ok for it to be back on again. My MIII has no EQ but beyond being a convenient post-preamp tone adjustment (which the pull deep function is also) i see the EQ as just a footswitch-able effect.

 

[SonicProvocateur]

My producer likes my EQ disengaged from my loop on my non-GEQ for recording, but i'd never run it that way live. Ditto for my pull deep.

When the masters get finished it will really tell the tale. It's all about how the bass guitar and kick drum mix in and fight in with that "brick walled compression" garbage. He made me watch an awesome video about it that really made me think twice about how I use my EQ and why I sound so good in small venues and our practice space, but way midrange-overpowering at huge venues. I tested the pull deep and EQ disengage theory on some basic 4-track recordings during practice one day and MAN what a HUGE difference it made bringing out the kick drum and bass.

I suggest watching these "Loudness War" videos on YouTube. They are VERY informative for anyone in doing studio work.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gmex_4hreQ

 

[BMcNibbnles]

Yeah, I found that the EQ and pull deep didn't sound good recorded at all. Basically, the graphic EQ sounded really good live, but recorded, the amp "breathed" more with it off. I actually never have the pull deep on at all, either. The manual actually says that it's meant for single coil guitars that lose bottom end and I use a mahogany Ibanez with two humbuckers, so I don't need to compensate for anything like someone with single coils would.

 

[Podicle]

It depends on style, I guess. Most of the guys going for a metal tone love sucking the mids out, which has it's place, but isn't something I'm interested in. I have a 60w no eq, and it's perfect for blues/rock stuff that I play (with mainly single coil guitars). If I had an eq I'd probably use it as a mid boost for soloing.

If I'm playing on my own with the amp very low I occassionally chuck an EQ pedal in the loop to sweeten the sound, but I've found that the mids balance back out as the volume is cranked and also that mids are crucial for getting definition in a band situation.

If I was buying another Mark amp, I'd probably get one with an EQ just so I had it as a tonal option, but you certainly don't need it to get awesome tones out of these amps.

 

[fishyfishfish]

Short story version: I had do to a quick set up and play at an outdoor gig. I set my levels, tuned and had to play, and during the set I noticed that my amp didn't sound the same. Not bad just different, and really sat in the mix rather well (outdoor gig, hella loud). During the break I noticed I had the EQ switch set to off by mistake, presence at 3 and reverb set to 2. Normally these are off.
Moral of the story: As long as it sounds good, it is good.

 

[gonzo]

i recently had my Mark2b modded, with a different value on the bass control:

changed out caps on BASS control, took out .047 cap, put in .022.

made a pretty sweet difference.

i was never able to run my bass control above 1.2, without flab.

now i run it at around 2-2.5, and it has given me a smoother, still tight, but deeper tone with only the bass control, and i've put my GEQ back to flat, at 80hz and 240.

i still cut a bit at 750, but i also use my mid shift, and run my presence high, but cut at 6.6khz.....


but you're right, about the amp 'breathing' and acting correctly, without the GEQ in line.

i'm much closer to the tone i'm looking for out of the boogie, with the change in the bass control cap.

 

[gonzo]

and i know it's not exactly a mark3, but close enough for comparison.

the mod is easy. took my guy exactly 3 minutes to pull it off.....

 

[BMcNibbnles]

That's cool, Gonzo. I like to hear stories of people getting closer to the tone they want. I actually haven't had any issues with the Mark III getting flubby. But, I haven't used it for a band rehearsal or gig yet, so maybe it WILL be an issue in the near future.

 

[CoG]

I use pull deep but I rarely use the EQ anymore. It takes sooo much tweaking to find a happy middle ground between why-bother and too-much, and if I tweaked it to "yes, that's it... right... there!" then I'd change a string and have to redial the amp again.

I also have my presence relatively cranked (5 or 6.) It sounds bright if you stand right in front of it but in the mix it's great. My guitar and the mixer we record through are very dark, though.

 

[SonicProvocateur]

I use pull deep but I rarely use the EQ anymore. It takes sooo much tweaking to find a happy middle ground between why-bother and too-much, and if I tweaked it to "yes, that's it... right... there!" then I'd change a string and have to redial the amp again.

I also have my presence relatively cranked (5 or 6.) It sounds bright if you stand right in front of it but in the mix it's great. My guitar and the mixer we record through are very dark, though.

Really promising CoG - Your Citizens of Gravity stuff is raw as hell. You use a JCM800 along with your mark, right? I'm going to be using a 5150 block letter along with my Mark. I think the 5150 is going to be my "dark" amp on the record.

 

[CoG]

Thanks! Crap, I gotta put up some more MP3s, we have new ones. Yeah, we record everything 100 per cent live as a left-right off a 1970s analog board so it's a real in-your-face vibe.

I really like the JCM800 but the rest of the band isn't so sure! I think it's just that the JCM is so unbelieveably responsive and dynamic, it's fun to play. There's no compression at all unless you crank the living crap out of it and then there's just enough to help. But yeah, not much of a range of tones...

Of all Marks, the III is the one where you have the least to gain by mixing with a Marshall anyway!

 

[SonicProvocateur]

Lol...I meant raw in a good way! We're going digital on this album. Our first EP was a pro-tools recorded thing, but it had no vocals (vocalist quit, so pfft :evil: ) and it sounded ok. The lower volume left to be desired, but the lower mastering compression left for good overhead for punch since I was using ENGL at the time. That JCM800/MKIII sound you have is **** crushing. I'm thinking the 5150/MKIII sound will definitely bring the thumpthump...I just have to watch the low mids so it doesn't lose definition and speaker compression. That 5150 loves to grind my cabs to death.

It's all in the EQ! That overcompressed, brick wall bullshit (as cool as it may sound sometimes) gets really grainy at high volumes, and leaves no room for REAL hit-you-in-the chest thump of the kick drum/snare, bass tones, or a 2nd/3rd order harmonic lead that the mark series can notoriously produce.

I love Through The Eyes of the Dead...killer headbanging music...but waaaaay too overcompressed. I've actually been listening to stuff like The Beatles and anything recorded at Abbey Road or Fame Studios (right here in Muscle Shoals Alabama) to better hear the natural compression and overhead.

 

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