What can I do to make me like my Dual Recto?

[JPIndustrie]

Hey,

I've asked you guys for advice when it came to the amp purchases and have always got great responses, so I thought I'd ask again.

I'm having a little issue with my 3-channel Dual Recto. It doesen't sound that good anymore. It was my first real 100W tube amp, and it sounded amazing when I first got it.

Now playing it, I feel it doesent sound refined or tight. I know that is the beauty of the recto, but honestly I feel either its time for a change, either a new amp or something else. I'm playing it, and I just don't think it sounds 'good'.

I like the recto sound, and since I'm a gain freak - I'm afraid to try anything else that wouldn't give me the amount of gain the recto does. I've been getting back into Dream Theater alot recently, and remembered how great Petrucci's tone is. Now, I'm not expecting the same exact tone, but interested in getting a nice, clear, defined, heavy, saturated, gainy rhythm and lead tone from my amp.

Now, I come here to ask for advice. Should I take a look at another amp, or stick witht his one and pour some more money into it?

I was thinking a whole new set of tubes. I purchased some JJ E34L's from a member here, and that was a great start. I really prefer the 34's vs. the 6L6's, especially the upper-mid shift/"british" character of the tubes, but i can't help but wonder if maybe I can acheive a better tone with a whole new set of 12AX7's preamps.

I've also just got a digitech bad monkey, and I felt it just added more gain, but didn't change any dynamics of the amp. It literally felt like a Recto on '11', and being the gain freak I am, wouldn't turn it off once I turn it on. But it doesen;t solve my problem of the inherent tone.

Now, if I were to sell this amp and get something else, it sucks because it seems all Recto's have taken hits in value - right now I wouldn't get what I paid for it, and the amps I'd consider, I'd have to undoubtebly put cash on top of the amp.

I've tried the Stiletto, both the deuce and the ace, however vs. the Recto, I felt it wasn't as 'heavy'. I'm very interested in trying a Mark IV (If Petrucci uses it,...) but there aren't any around here in the NYC area for me to try.

Overall, I know this post seems all over the place. I really like the Recto tone, but I feel it sounds a little one-dimensional. Theres a couple of things swirling through my mind: I'm running a 2x12" recto cab, maybe another 2x12" or selling it for a 4x12"? I've tried an EQ in the efx loop, but couldn't get it to sound very well with the parallel mix pot.

Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Seems to be a common thing as of late....this is exactly what I have and still am going through.

Loved my recto for a year, then just could stand it. I wanted some more refined....tight, articulate.....the rectifier was sterile and muddy to me, no matter how I set it.

Finally gave in and order a new Mark IV....should be here in about another month

Also something to mention....I poured a BUNCH of money into my recto trying to get the tightness and articulation out of it....hundreds of dollars in tubes....some helped a little, but under it, all the things I hated about the rectifier were still there. If I had taken all that money, I would have put it towards the Mark IV and gotten it without adding a penny :wink:

Here is my new phylosophy, that I wish I would have gone with earlier....if the amp isn't doing it for you as it is, it's isn't the right amp for you. You should find and amp that is perfect stock, and then you can only tailor it to be better.

 

[abecon5]

ibanez4life, did you get any custom options on your new mkIV??

 

[abecon5]

JPIndustrie, you mentioned a bunch of times that you are a gain freak...which is all good, but I just hope you dont have TOO MUCH gain.
It will never sound tight with a ton of gain.

so how much gain are you using?

 

[Platypus]

Where are your settings?

 

[ToneAddictJon]

Definitely try a retube before selling it. I use the high gain e34L retube kit with the GZ34 rectifier option from eurotubes.com and it really gives me the tone and tightness out of my DR that I love. Mark IV's are amazing amps, but if you love the recto sound, you probably won't like it for what it is, they are completely different beasts and compliment each other amazingly. I've been running mine through my Thiele lately and think that makes it sound even better than the 2x12 recto cab.

Make sure when running anything through the loop that the signal is completely wet or the level is turned up to 10, set the send to a level so it's not overdriving the front of the fx (about 3 for my pedals) and then set the mix to 0 and slowly turn it up. Good luck

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

No custom options....it already came out to $2000 after tax for the medium head

But agreed...running your gain or bass too high is immediate mud on a Recto.

I still feel like a retube is just a waste of money...beating around the bush for something that the amp really isn't. I think Plat would agree with me on that as a fellow former recto abuser/retuber.

 

[abecon5]

I still feel like a retube is just a waste of money...beating around the bush for something that the amp really isn't. I think Plat would agree with me on that as a fellow former recto abuser/retuber

I'm a former Stiletto abuser/retuber :wink: so i totally agree with that statement. I love playing around with tubes to refine my tone...but thats the extent of it...you will not change the voicing of the amp with a retube.

 

[stompboxfreak72]

No custom options....it already came out to $2000 after tax for the medium head

But agreed...running your gain or bass too high is immediate mud on a Recto.

I still feel like a retube is just a waste of money...beating around the bush for something that the amp really isn't. I think Plat would agree with me on that as a fellow former recto abuser/retuber.

I agree up to a point. however, when did you last change your preamp tubes ? those little 12ax7 tubes will make your tone a flubby assed mess if you don't swap em out. I left mine in for 3 years when I first got my DR and man was the amp sounding awful ! I retube mine every 12 months no matter what.

 

[clutch71]

I think if you go with the 4x12 standard cab your just going to get a looser sound especially if you are used to a 2x12. IMO DR's tighten up as you crank it, so if you don't do that very often you might not be getting the full potential of your amp.

If you don't need to sell the Recto you might think of a two amp Rig. You can pick up a MarkIV used relatively cheap.

Ibanez4life - Are you going to a two rig or letting the DR go?

ToneAddiction any clips with the el34's?

Good luck.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Nope...selling the Recto as soon as I get the Mark IV.

As awesome as it would be, that would be an expensive venture. And in all honesty, at my level, though I LOVE music, one high end amp is more practical.

And I say all the tube statements from expereince. I swapped EVERYTHING....trying different tubes in the preamp, power amp, rectifiers....slight changes, but still the same recto :?

 

[stash49]

Six months after selling my Single Rec, I am now in the market to buy another-actually a Dual this time. There are certain sounds they make which I miss-i.e. that low-end thing. At times I really miss it. I am just going to use it for certain things-not for solos thats for sure. I don't think a MarkIV will get the recto sound...or will it?

 

[Platypus]

Six months after selling my Single Rec, I am now in the market to buy another-actually a Dual this time. There are certain sounds they make which I miss-i.e. that low-end thing. At times I really miss it. I am just going to use it for certain things-not for solos thats for sure. I don't think a MarkIV will get the recto sound...or will it?

No it will not. You can certainly scoop out the mids and add more low end via the GEQ but it doesn't sound the same.

 

[ToneAddictJon]

I can record some in a couple days and put them up here. BTW I can make my DR sound as smooth as my Mark IV, it just takes a lot of tweaking and the right guitar, but I can't make the Mark IV as heavy as the DR. For a super smooth lead tone I use

Channel 2 vintage
Bold power
Tube Rectifier (GZ34)
Loop Engaged (send 3, return 0)
Gain 7 (or lower depending on the guitar)
Volume 5
Presence 5
Highs 4-5
Mids 5
Lows 0
Master on 5 (will still sound decent on 3 but smooths out even more at higher volumes)

This sounds killer through both the 2x12 recto and the 1x12 thiele
This is with my Ibanez S7420 with Dimarzio Evo 7 in the bridge and PAF 7 in the neck. I don't know what setting you play in (band or not) but I play in a few bands so this is at band level with bass, drums and vox going so it might sound off by itself.

I also have a delay in the loop to fill it up some.

 

[mesanomad100]

ahhh you guys have not used a keeley modded TS9 Tubescreamer Baked mod with your clearly

I got mine this weekend and rekinddled my recto love
very smooth alot tighter and almost a new amp



Im keeping my recto now but Im still saving for my MKIV
this is gonna be the ultimate tone setup when I get the MKIV

 

[ToneAddictJon]

The Mark IV and DR are perfect for each other 8) I love running them together, but **** it's overkill for anything other than tonal bliss :twisted:

 

[stompboxfreak72]

ahhh you guys have not used a keeley modded TS9 Tubescreamer Baked mod

I have not tried the Keeley but I have the Analogman modded Maxon TS9 od pedal. I won't play my DR without it.

 

[mesanomad100]

The Mark IV and DR are perfect for each other 8) I love running them together, but **** it's overkill for anything other than tonal bliss :twisted:

hahaha thats it





thats my fav. saying...tonal bliss or sonic bliss

 

[mesanomad100]

ahhh you guys have not used a keeley modded TS9 Tubescreamer Baked mod

I have not tried the Keeley but I have the Analogman modded Maxon TS9 od pedal. I won't play my DR without it.

yeah same here,how much smoother and just overall better does these pedals make these amps!!!!

its unreal how little green boxes can change an amp

 

[Elpelotero]

Hey,

I've asked you guys for advice when it came to the amp purchases and have always got great responses, so I thought I'd ask again.

I'm having a little issue with my 3-channel Dual Recto. It doesen't sound that good anymore. It was my first real 100W tube amp, and it sounded amazing when I first got it.

Now playing it, I feel it doesent sound refined or tight. I know that is the beauty of the recto, but honestly I feel either its time for a change, either a new amp or something else. I'm playing it, and I just don't think it sounds 'good'.

I like the recto sound, and since I'm a gain freak - I'm afraid to try anything else that wouldn't give me the amount of gain the recto does. I've been getting back into Dream Theater alot recently, and remembered how great Petrucci's tone is. Now, I'm not expecting the same exact tone, but interested in getting a nice, clear, defined, heavy, saturated, gainy rhythm and lead tone from my amp.

Now, I come here to ask for advice. Should I take a look at another amp, or stick witht his one and pour some more money into it?

I was thinking a whole new set of tubes. I purchased some JJ E34L's from a member here, and that was a great start. I really prefer the 34's vs. the 6L6's, especially the upper-mid shift/"british" character of the tubes, but i can't help but wonder if maybe I can acheive a better tone with a whole new set of 12AX7's preamps.

I've also just got a digitech bad monkey, and I felt it just added more gain, but didn't change any dynamics of the amp. It literally felt like a Recto on '11', and being the gain freak I am, wouldn't turn it off once I turn it on. But it doesen;t solve my problem of the inherent tone.

Now, if I were to sell this amp and get something else, it sucks because it seems all Recto's have taken hits in value - right now I wouldn't get what I paid for it, and the amps I'd consider, I'd have to undoubtebly put cash on top of the amp.

I've tried the Stiletto, both the deuce and the ace, however vs. the Recto, I felt it wasn't as 'heavy'. I'm very interested in trying a Mark IV (If Petrucci uses it,...) but there aren't any around here in the NYC area for me to try.

Overall, I know this post seems all over the place. I really like the Recto tone, but I feel it sounds a little one-dimensional. Theres a couple of things swirling through my mind: I'm running a 2x12" recto cab, maybe another 2x12" or selling it for a 4x12"? I've tried an EQ in the efx loop, but couldn't get it to sound very well with the parallel mix pot.

Any ideas? Thanks.

listen to ibanez and platypus...They've been here a long time and have read all the posts. Not to mention that they have gone through everything with their amps.

The facts are simple: no amount of modding, pedals, eqing, or tubes will change the sound of the rectifier. It's still a rectifier. The circuit board is the same thing. The amp is wired to project certain frequencies you're not liking.

I've gone through all the rectos myself. I ended up selling the 3ch and keeping an old 1992 2channel. The tone is almost 180 degrees different. Everyone who's ever heard it hears the difference.

If you like Dream Theater, go out and invest in a Mark...be it a mark4, mark3, C+, or triaxis. You will instantly get the sound you want. If not, you are risking spending lots of money and time only to eventually come full circle and say, "those guys knew what they were saying."