Thinking behind the rectifiers...

[martinluckhurst]

Hi, sorry if this has been covered before, just wandering what Mesa Boogie's initial intentions were when designing the Rectifiers. What were they looking for that was different to what they had before or what was on the market at the time? Were they looking for more gain, or more bass etc.?
1st post.
ML

 

[ytse_jam]

Hi martin, this is taken from Mesa's website:

Since the early 70's the Boogie™ Mark Series amplifiers have been famous for their gobs of overdrive and liquid sustain, making them the choice for a solo voice. Combining this thick gain with our on board 5 Band Graphic EQ produced lethal crunch as well and these trademark sounds propelled players and MESA into the spotlight for 20 years.

Still, we yearned for more in our mosh. We envisioned a menacing sound with the creamy voice of a Boogie, yet with huge low end that could track faster and stay tight even under the most extreme settings. In the early dawn of the gotee and tattoo era we longed to create another classic…a statement of the times, like the mighty little Boogie of the 70's. Our quest ended in the Dual & Triple Rectifier® Solo Heads and the rest is history. Ten years later, the patented Dual Rectifier® Series amplifiers continue to astonish us with their success.

 

[Boogiebabies]

It was a total rip off of the SLO 100 with some preamp tweaks, negative feedback tweaks and a few other odds and ends. The similarities in architechture/topology are frighteningly close.

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Track faster and stay tight in the most extreme conditions^^?

I think they're a little off there :lol:

 

[domct203]

Track faster and stay tight in the most extreme conditions^^?

I think they're a little off there :lol:

I dunno, my Roadster tracks pretty good with MODERATE setting of the bass EQ. Especially when the gain is around 1:30 ish, pushed with a clean boost. I wonder if a high gain amp with this voicing and bass response could really get much tighter. Any other "tight" amp I played could not even approach the bass punch of the Recto's.

I'll take the bass response for my style of playing. That's why I ended back with a Recto.

Dom

 

[Guitarzan]

It was a total rip off of the SLO 100 with some preamp tweaks, negative feedback tweaks and a few other odds and ends. The similarities in architechture/topology are frighteningly close.

I've heard this from several others as well.

 

[Platypus]

It was a total rip off of the SLO 100 with some preamp tweaks, negative feedback tweaks and a few other odds and ends. The similarities in architechture/topology are frighteningly close.

I've heard this from several others as well.

I've read this too but I thought I read in an interview with Randall that he used the Bassman as the basis for the rectifier, can you dispell the myth Ed?

 

[kramerxxx]

I have never seen the similarities between a Recto and a SLO. The SLO is high-mid voiced more like a Marshall where the Recto stuff is Low-Mid voiced, i.e., darker. I tend to run my bass settings lower, mids and treble a little higher, push the front with a clean boost or run an EQ pedal through the loop for more tonal options.

I have never played a Soldano and Recto side by side but I've played them and if RS was trying to copy the SLO, he missed. FWIW I played the Soldano Avenger and while Soldano SAYS it has the SLO lead circuit, it sounded nothing like an SLO to me. It was a nice amp, not a SLO though.

I have heard that Peavey tried to copy the SLO with the 5150 and I don't hear that either. Hello? What am I missing here?

Don't get me wrong I'm not selling my Recto but I don't think any of these 3 amps sounds like the other. Could just be me.

 

[Guitarzan]

I have never seen the similarities between a Recto and a SLO. The SLO is high-mid voiced more like a Marshall where the Recto stuff is Low-Mid voiced, i.e., darker. I tend to run my bass settings lower, mids and treble a little higher, push the front with a clean boost or run an EQ pedal through the loop for more tonal options.

I have never played a Soldano and Recto side by side but I've played them and if RS was trying to copy the SLO, he missed. FWIW I played the Soldano Avenger and while Soldano SAYS it has the SLO lead circuit, it sounded nothing like an SLO to me. It was a nice amp, not a SLO though.

I have heard that Peavey tried to copy the SLO with the 5150 and I don't hear that either. Hello? What am I missing here?

Don't get me wrong I'm not selling my Recto but I don't think any of these 3 amps sounds like the other. Could just be me.

What BB is saying is the physical component layout and ideas which make up the electronics of the amp rather than the sound that is coming out.

 

[ytse_jam]

I know it can be a paradox, but... could it be that at the beginning Mesa's intention was to build an amp with a more vintage feeling compared to the Mark series (which dominated the high gain scene in the '80s)? I'm thinking about the re-introduction of tube rectification (which we find in older Marshalls)... we all know in the end Mesa ended up building an even more aggressive amp than the Marks, but was it really their aim at first?

 

[Guitarzan]

Track faster and stay tight in the most extreme conditions^^?

I think they're a little off there :lol:

Any other "tight" amp I played could not even approach the bass punch of the Recto's.

Beg to differ with my Mk III green. The deep pull (engage) adds an insane amount of bass to my amp. Even with a 2x12 and the bass set low aroun 2, it's crazy.

I think (probly wrongly but who cares) that the recto amps were custom designed for a select few wife-beater bands like Korn, Tool, Gojira and Limp Bizkit to name a few. Endorsed by aliens and Condy Rice, of course. TGIF.

Very Wrong but don't forget Monica Lewinsky.

 

[Boogiebabies]

Yes, The SLO does not have 67 LDR's. The slope resistor for the tone stack is different, the negative feedback loop is different, but basically the components and preamp are nearly identical. Mesa and Peavey just voiced it the way they wanted to. Neither use DeYoung transformers or Phillips Poly's and metal film resistors for the entire amp either. IMO, Soldano has been taking a swipe at Mesa and Peavey with the SLO Depth Mod and the Avenger. Depth controls are just limiting negative feedback. The DR modern mode has no NFB where the Soldano's and Peavey's use a pot with a cap in paralell to contol the amount of bass boost or resonance. Another issue is that the SLO has 6 fliter caps in the power supply and Mesa sprang for just 2. And everyone complains about the muddy low end. I wonder why. :twisted:

 

[barneyc4]

boogiebabies,
please fill out this thread ---> http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?t=12507



thanks

 

[siggy14]

You are way off there, the recto was around before these bands even started using them. Actually the first Korn album was done with Marshalls and I am pretty sure so was the first limp bizkit album. Korn was born in 1993 and limp bizkit was born in 1994. So unless Randall Smith had ESP i doubt highly he created for them.

Actually one of the first known bands to use a recto was not even a downtuned wall of sound band. And that band would be candlebox who had great tone as well. Soundgarden also used a recto who did not sound anything like a downtuned band.

If you dont max out the gain, leave it around 1 to 2 oclock then the recto is pretty **** tight, with a boost in front it is tighter then a straight guys a$$ at a gay pride parade!

I have seen many bands from 1995 till present that use recto's that are far from nu-metal and they all sounded great with great tone.

Track faster and stay tight in the most extreme conditions^^?

I think they're a little off there :lol:

Any other "tight" amp I played could not even approach the bass punch of the Recto's.

Beg to differ with my Mk III green. The deep pull (engage) adds an insane amount of bass to my amp. Even with a 2x12 and the bass set low aroun 2, it's crazy.

I think (probly wrongly but who cares) that the recto amps were custom designed for a select few wife-beater bands like Korn, Tool, Gojira and Limp Bizkit to name a few. Endorsed by aliens and Condy Rice, of course. TGIF.

 

[mesanomad100]

If you dont max out the gain, leave it around 1 to 2 oclock then the recto is pretty **** tight, with a boost in front it is tighter then a straight guys a$$ at a gay pride parade!

haha,this humored me a bit!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[jvk]

Although there are differences between the SLO and Recto, Mesa didn't change the SLO enough to make the Recto it's own amp, as there are more similarities than differences between the two.

When people say the Recto is a clone of the Slo, it is the SLO's lead preamp they are talking of, they are the same. They don't sound 100% identical but they are identical circuit-wise, except very small changes like a 20pF cap before the 2nd gain stage, and bigger changes like the feedback and presence control.

The power supplies are similar, but the voltages are not. This changes alot of the sonic characteristics. (Recto = 460v, SLO 500v)

The tone controls (tone stacks) are like apples and oranges.

Randall Smith still owese Mike Soldano rim jobs for the rest of his existence...

For an exact copy of the SLO, check out the The Huges & Kettner Triamp!!!! (in lead 2)

JK

 

[BENNY]

Yes, The SLO does not have 67 LDR's. The slope resistor for the tone stack is different, the negative feedback loop is different, but basically the components and preamp are nearly identical. Mesa and Peavey just voiced it the way they wanted to. Neither use DeYoung transformers or Phillips Poly's and metal film resistors for the entire amp either. IMO, Soldano has been taking a swipe at Mesa and Peavey with the SLO Depth Mod and the Avenger. Depth controls are just limiting negative feedback. The DR modern mode has no NFB where the Soldano's and Peavey's use a pot with a cap in paralell to contol the amount of bass boost or resonance. Another issue is that the SLO has 6 fliter caps in the power supply and Mesa sprang for just 2. And everyone complains about the muddy low end. I wonder why. :twisted:

so BB what are you saying ? i get the 6 is better than 2.

ha ha ! we all love boogie, but lets face it i know i buy them cause they aren't 3 G's

 

[BENNY]

For an exact copy of the SLO, check out the The Huges & Kettner Triamp!!!! (in lead 2)

JK

H & K TRI-AMP.....LOVE IT. 3 G'S

 

[Boogiebabies]

Yes, The SLO does not have 67 LDR's. The slope resistor for the tone stack is different, the negative feedback loop is different, but basically the components and preamp are nearly identical. Mesa and Peavey just voiced it the way they wanted to. Neither use DeYoung transformers or Phillips Poly's and metal film resistors for the entire amp either. IMO, Soldano has been taking a swipe at Mesa and Peavey with the SLO Depth Mod and the Avenger. Depth controls are just limiting negative feedback. The DR modern mode has no NFB where the Soldano's and Peavey's use a pot with a cap in paralell to contol the amount of bass boost or resonance. Another issue is that the SLO has 6 fliter caps in the power supply and Mesa sprang for just 2. And everyone complains about the muddy low end. I wonder why. :twisted:

so BB what are you saying ? i get the 6 is better than 2.

ha ha ! we all love boogie, but lets face it i know i buy them cause they aren't 3 G's

I bought my 93 for 2K with a matching 4X12.
You just have to find the desperate sellers.

 

[Boogiebabies]

Although there are differences between the SLO and Recto, Mesa didn't change the SLO enough to make the Recto it's own amp, as there are more similarities than differences between the two.

When people say the Recto is a clone of the Slo, it is the SLO's lead preamp they are talking of, they are the same. They don't sound 100% identical but they are identical circuit-wise, except very small changes like a 20pF cap before the 2nd gain stage, and bigger changes like the feedback and presence control.

The power supplies are similar, but the voltages are not. This changes alot of the sonic characteristics. (Recto = 460v, SLO 500v)

The tone controls (tone stacks) are like apples and oranges.

Randall Smith still owese Mike Soldano rim jobs for the rest of his existence...

For an exact copy of the SLO, check out the The Huges & Kettner Triamp!!!! (in lead 2)

JK

John,

You are a madman.

Randall knew he would not have to supply rim jobs because Mike did not patent the design.
Basically, everone and thier brother can steal from the SLO design. It's often imitated, but never duplicated. Soldano cannot even duplicate it in there other amps.


Ed