Mesa Boogie: Boogie 4x10 cab with the JP2C

[bandit2013]

I got the Mesa 4x10 open back guitar cab a few days ago and had to explore this cabinet with what amps I had to use with it. Badlander, TC50, Mark V90, Mark VII and the JP2C. The amp that stood out on top with this 4x10 cabinet was the JP2C. The others had more of a blanket effect on the top end. It is there but not as apparent as it would be with any of the other 12inch speaker cabinets like the V212. Just to note the G10 creambacks (as it seems to be the case with the other 10 inch speakers) do not have the same spectrum as a 12 inch. (G10CB frequency range of 95Hz to 5500 Hz and the V30 frequency range is 70Hz to 5000 Hz). The notable difference with the 4x10 cabinet vs the V212 is the midrange content. The V212 has more of a scooped sound to it when comparing the 4x10 with the same amp. I did a side by side setup using the two badlander 100W amps which was interesting to hear what was different. This was before I completed the setup to run the two bads. Both the V212 and 4x10 are the same width. The difference is the depth at the bottom of the cabinet of the V212 as it is 14 inches, the 4x10 is your standard 10 inch deep straight cabinet. I did not feel like the stack was going to fall over with just the head on top of it.

Anyhow, the 4X10 cab was epic sounding with the JP2C on all channels. Some of this may be due to the power tubes I am using: STR415 Sylvania 6L6GC. I should load up the STR448 and see how that changes things.
All 3 channels were fun. The clean channel was much warmer than the V212 cabinet but it was not terrible by any means. It actually sounded good. The V212 gives the clean channel a more neutral tone which does sound better. Now for the grit and grind CH2 and CH3.

My first playthrough was without using any of the pull switches on the amp. Wow, this cabinet sounds deep and is quite responsive to playing. Lead solos seemed to sing with authority. I did not get that thinning out of the solo playing. I was impressed. I left the controls at noon for most of this first run. I was curious to find out what happens when I pull out the presence control. Now that sounded EPIC. I can even run the GEQ on the clean channel without remorse. I had the Mark VII on the V212 as that was as close as I could get with the JP2C. I did eventually swap the amps with the cabs. Sure the JP2C sounds great with the V212 and any other cab I have used with it. But there is some desire for that 4x10 and the JP2C that seemed to make the experience more enjoyable. The first dive bomb I did on the Floyd rose sounded amazing. Just the sound and tones I was hearing sounded much better than the V212 cabinet.

I did have two of these cabinets on order but had to cancel one of them as I got this one from a different resource. I did not need three but a second one as a full stack would be interesting. I should have that before the next weekend. Looking forward to hearing two of these cabinets pushed with the JP2C.

As for the Mark VII, it was just ok with the 4x10. I was not getting the same thrill from it as I did with the JP2C. The Mark VII on IIC+ or IV modes may sound close to the JP2C but it leans closer to the Badlander characteristic and sounds like a blanket effect. It is not bad sounding, just a bit different. What I was able to coax out of the 4x10 with the JP2C was unrivaled. I will have to compare it to the wide body open back 112 I have an EVM12L classic installed. I believe I tried the stack of the two cabinets (4x10 and EVM12L), that was interesting but not as much fun as the 4x10 by itself. I have some cream back G12H-75, 16 ohm in boxes. I should try those in the V212 cab for curiosity. If all goes well I will try to capture the 4x10 in a video. Need to work out how to mic this thing. I want to capture that in the room sound as that is one thing I struggle to obtain with just the SM57.

 

[bandit2013]

I did try the Mark V90 but that was short lived. Something with the amp gave out and I get this weird noise, not exactly a tube squealing issue, just this ramping up siren like sound that only gets louder. That is all it makes, cannot play the guitar through it now. Oh well, it could just be a preamp tube.

As for the Mark VII, I am getting used to it through the 4x10 cab. I sort of like it the more I play through it. The JP2C was the bomb though, much more fluid sounding. I still have lots of love for the V212 cabinet but this little speaker box is just different.

 

[bandit2013]

This was just nuts. All three amps grinding away. It seems the full stack of 410 you lose a bit since the JP2C changes tone a bit at 4 ohm loads. It is more noticeable with the 410 than say with two 412 cabs. I did not have to crank it up either. One a single amp comparison, they sounded ok but not all that loud. All three going at the same time was a sonic wall I though sounded really good. The 410 cab is just interesting but it will not replace the Vertical 212 or standard slant from 412 cabinet.

I bought them on a whim they would be awesome. They are but quite different voice than the 12 inch speaker will provide. Lead style just jumped out with detail and the power chords filled the room quite well. This was a bit much for me though but was fun. Not sure I will get my hearing back anytime soon.

 

[bandit2013]

Sure it looks really cool. I much prefer running just one of the 410 cabs vs both. However, as I said above it does jump out with the lead or solo. Mind you the wall of sound I was hearing that lead to the ringing ears was all three amps pumping air at the same time. I may just go back to the four v212 cabs, two BADS, one Mark VII and JP2C.

 

[sloanthebone]

That stack certainly looks cool.Do you have any plans to try the new 2x12 diagonal cab?

 

[bandit2013]

No, I have run out of room to get anything else. However, I bet that would sound great. I assume it will be as dark as the Horizontal 212 cab as it is 14 inches deep. Too bad it was not an inch wider. it is a bit on the narrow width side. 22.750" vs the vertical 212 at 23.625" I am sure you can stack the V212 on the diagonal cab without an issue. That would make for a bulky 412 cab set up. I thought the 4x10 experiment would be interesting, was not as I thought it would be, but still sounds good. Just different. I prefer the Vertical 212 cab most of all. However, the 4x10 will ram through the mix easily if you opt to use it for lead. Just not as heavy as the v212 for most other work. I can make use of it but for most use, the V212 is ideal or the 112 open back speaker I loaded with an EVM12L cab.

I should try the BAD with the EV but instead of the EL34, switch over to the STR445 tubes. Also, after doing this trick, the 112 cab sounded way too bright when used with the 410. Either way, the 112 cab is on the thin side as well as the 4x10 as both cabinets are only 11 inches deep, not as stable on carpet as it would be on a solid floor (wood, tile or concrete). The dog would knock it down with ease.

 

[sloanthebone]

Yeah I love the 2x12 verticals. Just ordered a hot white bronco one to go with my Mark VII. Now the 3 month wait begins. Think I may start trying speakers in my black 2x12 vertical.

 

[rarebitusa]

Yeah I love the 2x12 verticals. Just ordered a hot white bronco one to go with my Mark VII. Now the 3 month wait begins. Think I may start trying speakers in my black 2x12 vertical.

which speakers you looking at??

 

[sloanthebone]

which speakers you looking at??

I might try some scumbacks. That is a brand I have never tried. I also loved the Mesa Fillmore 75. Hard to find now since Mesa stopped making them but I have read there is a Celestion equivalent.

 

[rarebitusa]

FWIW... I paired a Scumback M-75 with a Mesa v30 in my Recto horizontal 2x12 really diggin that cab with the LSS and the Stiletto. It's good with the V:90 also, but I prefer an EVM with the Marks.

 

[bandit2013]

Swapping speakers in the current production Vertical 212 is a bit tricky. I stuffed a pair of EVM12L classic speaker thinking I can run that with the JP2C. The studs were long enough to get them mounted. Seemed to be way too dark with that setup running 4 ohms. I could have rewired it to 16 ohms, then mod another one with same speakers and run the pair on the 8 ohm taps (now that is tempting.)

I also tried a pair of the Celestion Creme Alnico 90W-16 ohm speakers, did not work all that well. Not sure if I tried the creambacks though as I have a set of those in 16 ohms.

It almost seems the cabinet was tuned for the V30 speaker. If that is possible based on cabinet resonance and speaker resonance. That is more over my head so I do not comment on that sort of thing.

 

[bandit2013]

The 10 inch speaker is something I have not experienced. I was looking at some of the alternatives made by Celestion. They have a 60W version of the V30, I believe they call it the G10 vintage and supposed to have the same voice coil of the V30 (probably the Chinese one). then the VT version, not sure which to choose from. I want to get closer to the V212 sound but doubt that will be possible. The cab is just a bit smaller than the V212. If I can get closer to that sound, doing a full stack would be great as it does not require a ladder to get to the amp to make changes to the controls.

The curious cat wants to spend more money to see what may work. I like the cab as is but want more from it.

 

[clyvediggins]

This was just nuts. All three amps grinding away. It seems the full stack of 410 you lose a bit since the JP2C changes tone a bit at 4 ohm loads. It is more noticeable with the 410 than say with two 412 cabs. I did not have to crank it up either. One a single amp comparison, they sounded ok but not all that loud. All three going at the same time was a sonic wall I though sounded really good. The 410 cab is just interesting but it will not replace the Vertical 212 or standard slant from 412 cabinet.

I bought them on a whim they would be awesome. They are but quite different voice than the 12 inch speaker will provide. Lead style just jumped out with detail and the power chords filled the room quite well. This was a bit much for me though but was fun. Not sure I will get my hearing back anytime soon.

View attachment 3168

Hey bandit,
Wondering if you have any experience with the Fillmore 50 head? How do you think the 4x10 cab would match up with it now that you’ve played it through your other amps. Currently playing a Fillmore 50 through a 1x12 23” and wanting to add or replace with 2x12 or 4x10. Someone had also suggested the 1x12 with
4x10 which sounds like a good combo. Any thoughts?

 

[bandit2013]

Funny, when I inquired about the cab at one retailer, they asked if I had a Filmore. Was not sure what was up with that. Ah, they only had the cab in the Filmore trim.

No experience with the Filmore except for 10 minutes of playing the Filmore 100W while I was in CA.

I tried using the widebody 112 cab (open back but I loaded an EV into it) with the Mark VII along with the 410. Make the 12 inch speaker brighter than I desired it to be.

I liked the characteristic with the JP2C but with the presence controls pulled out. You really have to get something bright but bold enough to make it work. I thought it was perfect for solo work but not for general use. The California Tweed sounded good through it too but that amp is super bright when used with other cabs except for the Jensen Blackbird.

the 410 may not be all to your liking. I was hoping it was more than it was but it did a good job with the JP2C. Was not a good match with the other amps. Have considered looking at replacing some of the speakers with something a bit different. Perhaps the G10 Vintage. I would probably mix two of those in one and two in the other. I bought two of them but did not need to do that. I do not mind the cab though. Not as full sounding as the Vertical 212 cab.

Sorry, not sure how the Filmore will fare with this cabinet. I would highly recommend finding one in a store to hear it in person before buying. I have no choice where I live, nobody sells Mesa that is less than 100 mile drive, and will the even have it available to try out is questionable. You do not always get answers by phone call. NC is terrible for music gear, not many places on the east side of the state to find quality gear.

 

[clyvediggins]

Thanks for the reply, always appreciate your input.

 

[bandit2013]

To be honest, I do not regret getting the two 410 cabinets. I will make use of them. I is a different sound. I was surprised how good the California Tweed sounded with just one cabinet.

Running two of them just added too much midrange. Perhaps it is an acquired adaptation sort of like drinking coffee for the first time and feel why would someone drink this stuff?

I see there is a Filmore appointed 410 cabinet. Same speakers and cabinet construction, just a different grill cloth. I would not say it is a terrible sound, just a major deviation from what I would consider to be the norm. Light low end too. Perhaps I need to break them in? If I end up pulling out the JP2C from my rig and get another Mark VII, then I will make use of the 410 cabs with that amp. I am more fixed on the V212 with my amps. Lets just say the JP2C with the presence control pulled out running on one of the 410 was rather interesting. The other amps just could not replicate that sound.

 

[clyvediggins]

Just joined a 10 piece (horns) funk/r&b band and I’ll be using the Fillmore for this. My initial thought was the 50 head and 1x12 would not cut it, guess I’ll find out really soon. Everything will be mic’d live so maybe what I have will be sufficient. I don’t have much experience playing live, plus I just kinda want to buy a bigger cab with Fillmore trim. Maybe the 2x12 would be better for this. I’m in the same boat, nowhere to play one, especially in a band setting.
Any suggestions welcomed!

 

[Doug Doppler]

Yo @bandit2013!

I shared this in a rigs post, but I'll do so here. I found this poor cab on CL for $140. LOVING it paired with both Fillmore cabs in this crazy Wet / Dry / Dry / Dry / Wet rig. This just •might• be geeky enough for you

Wet / Dry / Dry / Dry / Wet with 3 Cabinets...
I installed a pair of stereo jacks on the back of my Fillmore 2x12 cabs for what was initially supposed to be a Wet / Dry / Wet rig with two cabs. Last week I picked up the 4x10 cab for $140 on Craigslist. In addition to a pair of Jensen tens, someone had installed a pair of G12T75s in there, but did not cut the baffle board to do so, thankfully. Got a quad of Jensens in there now, initially for a Super Reverb vibe on clean tones. I liked what I heard when combining it with one of the Fillmore cabs and decided to finally build out the rig...

Fillmore 50 4Ω Speaker Out #1
> 4x10 Cab
Fillmore 50 4Ω Speaker Out #2
> Radial Cab-Link Parallel input
Cab-Link Speaker Out #1
> Right speaker in left Fillmore cab @8Ω
Cab-Link Speaker Out #2
> Cab Clone IR @8Ω
Cab Clone IR Speaker Out
> Left speaker in right Fillmore cab @8Ω
Cab Clone DI Out
> Universal Audio Starlight Delay
Starlight Out L
> Seymour Duncan PowerStage 170 #1
> Left speaker in left Fillmore cab
Starlight Out R
> Seymour Duncan PowerStage 170 #2
> Right speaker in right Fillmore cab

I'll be adding the Two-note C.A.B. M+ units to join the Cab Clone IR for direct out to my audio interface. I have a Radial Headbone head switcher that will make its way into the mix for studio stuff. I have a pair of RJM PBC 6/x units I'll use for front end and loop effects respectively as well as MIDI control. My 'new' live rig will be a W/D/W version of this rig using my Mark VII and a pair for Rectifier 4x12 cabs. LOVING the way setup this sounds. Since I'm using the Reverb on the amp, technically my dry paths are a mix, but that also acts as a kind of glue that pulls the whole thing together interestingly enough

 

[Doug Doppler]

Just joined a 10 piece (horns) funk/r&b band and I’ll be using the Fillmore for this. My initial thought was the 50 head and 1x12 would not cut it, guess I’ll find out really soon. Everything will be mic’d live so maybe what I have will be sufficient. I don’t have much experience playing live, plus I just kinda want to buy a bigger cab with Fillmore trim. Maybe the 2x12 would be better for this. I’m in the same boat, nowhere to play one, especially in a band setting.
Any suggestions welcomed!

Hey Clyve:

So, I did a gig not too long ago. Loved using a 1x12 Mini Recto slant and a 1x12 Recto cab in rehearsal. Once in the venue they disappeared. Lesson learned. Even with a mic, you gotta move some air - especially with a horns, which wait for it, move a LOT of air. Elevate your cabinet/s and be sure to stay on axis with them so you know that they really sound like. And my suggestion would be to find some jam tracks to vibe with at home and play at volume Hope that's a help

P.S. I'm playing the same venue this next month and will be bringing at least one of my Rectifier 4x12 cabs, maybe both!!!

 

[bandit2013]

Yo @bandit2013!

I shared this in a rigs post, but I'll do so here. I found this poor cab on CL for $140. LOVING it paired with both Fillmore cabs in this crazy Wet / Dry / Dry / Dry / Wet rig. This just •might• be geeky enough for youView attachment 3349


Wet / Dry / Dry / Dry / Wet with 3 Cabinets...
I installed a pair of stereo jacks on the back of my Fillmore 2x12 cabs for what was initially supposed to be a Wet / Dry / Wet rig with two cabs. Last week I picked up the 4x10 cab for $140 on Craigslist. In addition to a pair of Jensen tens, someone had installed a pair of G12T75s in there, but did not cut the baffle board to do so, thankfully. Got a quad of Jensens in there now, initially for a Super Reverb vibe on clean tones. I liked what I heard when combining it with one of the Fillmore cabs and decided to finally build out the rig...

Fillmore 50 4Ω Speaker Out #1
> 4x10 Cab
Fillmore 50 4Ω Speaker Out #2
> Radial Cab-Link Parallel input
Cab-Link Speaker Out #1
> Right speaker in left Fillmore cab @8Ω
Cab-Link Speaker Out #2
> Cab Clone IR @8Ω
Cab Clone IR Speaker Out
> Left speaker in right Fillmore cab @8Ω
Cab Clone DI Out
> Universal Audio Starlight Delay
Starlight Out L
> Seymour Duncan PowerStage 170 #1
> Left speaker in left Fillmore cab
Starlight Out R
> Seymour Duncan PowerStage 170 #2
> Right speaker in right Fillmore cab

I'll be adding the Two-note C.A.B. M+ units to join the Cab Clone IR for direct out to my audio interface. I have a Radial Headbone head switcher that will make its way into the mix for studio stuff. I have a pair of RJM PBC 6/x units I'll use for front end and loop effects respectively as well as MIDI control. My 'new' live rig will be a W/D/W version of this rig using my Mark VII and a pair for Rectifier 4x12 cabs. LOVING the way setup this sounds. Since I'm using the Reverb on the amp, technically my dry paths are a mix, but that also acts as a kind of glue that pulls the whole thing together interestingly enough

I saw this earlier. That 410 cab looks to have some issues there. Hint: it sounds better when the cab is making contact with the floor. Raising it up made it much brighter. Sound better by itself than it does with combining other cabs with it. Interesting sound no doubt. Was thinking a change in two of the 10's in each cab but have not decided if the G10 Vintage or something else would be ideal. I can just mod one cabinet and it it does not pan out, I can put the originals back in. Hopefully I do not damage the grill when doing such.