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Made in China!
- Thread starter Monsta-Tone
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JOEY B.
Well-known member
Here is my take on it. If you are an American company that produces a non-essential good and choose to outsource your labor, you are cutting your own throat, slowly. If enough of the greedy corporate *******s choose to operate their business this way, they will slowly eliminate their customer base. That is, when you put enough Americans out of work or into low paying jobs, nobody will have the extra money to spend on your product. They will be struggling to pay for food, housing, etc....
And the ultra poor Chinese laborers damn sure won't be able to afford it. :evil:
Peace out
And the ultra poor Chinese laborers damn sure won't be able to afford it. :evil:
Peace out
JOEY B. said:
I'm thinking that it has pretty much happened with me! I will do without a "Non-essential good" before I have more crap in my house!
I would like to know where all of the money is going in China. Surely some corrupt official and the factory owners are getting rich in a society that is against this.
I read a report last year that said there were more new millionaires in India than there were in America for the 2 year in a row. We are making the rest of the world rich by farming our manufacturing and customer service out, while we are getting poorer and poorer here in America. Only to turn around a borrow it back from them!
On the lighter side, the new Vonage commercial says, "Call India. Call all of India."
I say, dial any toll free number and call India! :lol:
Personally, I refuse to shop at Wal-Mart. I feel that creating a demand for cheap Chinese goods reduces the demand for pricier American goods, which reduces the demand for the American workforce to make said goods. Put Americans out of work, they have to shop at Wal-Mart to get by. The more people shop at Wal-Mart, the more American companies have to outsource or shut down. It's a snowball effect.
SteveO said:
We try to only go to Wal-Mart for the stuff that we can't get anywhere else in town. Unfortunately, that's a lot of stuff because we live in such a small place.
I did find a bad ass Kershaw pocket knife that was made in America though! My wife's stocking stuffer, and yeah, she's a redneck! Buy her a knife, some ammo, a gun, or a power drill and it's garanteed happiness. :lol: We are a funny couple, the metal head and the redneck! :lol:No political comments below, just a short take on made in this china post.
My problem with free trade is just that. Free trade. When they speak about capping it, NO WAY, yet why not.
For the most part I believe the U.S.A. needs to stop exporting our money to import cheap disposable
items that are bleeding us dry of jobs and probably security. It is sad that you can send all the plywood, speakers,
tubes, ect over to china and have 10,000 half stacks of amps made, shipped back to retailers, and sold for less than
$700:00 bucks. I am not speaking of quality, yet they have four 65 watt eminece speakers, 5/8 ply plywood,
5 chinese ax7s and 2 russian el-34s, two channels,and a half power switch. A year warranty. It is just this example that gives you insight into what is going on.
The U.S fights for workers rights and human rights. Yet, there is no problem having people do your work in china?
Something to ponder:
China has payed afganistan a sum of money to mine copper ore in areas of Afganistan, there are military forces
protecting these Chinese workers while they are mining the ore to ship back to China for proccessing. Yet, China does
not, at least to my knowledge, have any Chinese forces protecting their miners, less any serving in Afganistan. I would guess it would be mainly U.S with some coalition forces protecting them. Why and how can this be allowed on anyones watch?
/no cheer
My problem with free trade is just that. Free trade. When they speak about capping it, NO WAY, yet why not.
For the most part I believe the U.S.A. needs to stop exporting our money to import cheap disposable
items that are bleeding us dry of jobs and probably security. It is sad that you can send all the plywood, speakers,
tubes, ect over to china and have 10,000 half stacks of amps made, shipped back to retailers, and sold for less than
$700:00 bucks. I am not speaking of quality, yet they have four 65 watt eminece speakers, 5/8 ply plywood,
5 chinese ax7s and 2 russian el-34s, two channels,and a half power switch. A year warranty. It is just this example that gives you insight into what is going on.
The U.S fights for workers rights and human rights. Yet, there is no problem having people do your work in china?
Something to ponder:
China has payed afganistan a sum of money to mine copper ore in areas of Afganistan, there are military forces
protecting these Chinese workers while they are mining the ore to ship back to China for proccessing. Yet, China does
not, at least to my knowledge, have any Chinese forces protecting their miners, less any serving in Afganistan. I would guess it would be mainly U.S with some coalition forces protecting them. Why and how can this be allowed on anyones watch?
/no cheer
I think that's just a drop in the bucket!
We have the EPA, Unions, Affirmative Action, & butt loads of taxes.
It's cheaper to send the stuff overseas and then buy it back or have it shipped back and sold under American names because they don't pay their people much, they don't care about emissions, they don't have to pay the same taxes.
I don't mind buying import stuff most of the time, but when unemployment is over 10% (the level that it was during the Depression) how can anyone afford to buy anything.
If we don't start taking back at least some of the manufacturing then what will we do?
The only jobs left will be in maintenance. We will become the Wall-E's of the world when we used to be the inovative force.
I really think that there needs to be a change in the way we tax our corporations. They should have to pay the same exact taxes when they import, as when they build it here. Or....perhaps tax breaks for goods made in the U.S.
Also, the average McDonalds employee makes way more than they did when I was a kid. In the 80's they made around $3.50. Now, they make almost $8 to start! I fully understand the Minimum Wage laws, but there has to be a limit. If you want a good paying job, get an education and get out there and make a living.
Between taxes, entitlement, laziness, complacency, greed, we have really launched the life boats and then set the boat on fire. Now what do we do? :lol: It's time to start pissing on the fire!!!!! :lol:
We have the EPA, Unions, Affirmative Action, & butt loads of taxes.
It's cheaper to send the stuff overseas and then buy it back or have it shipped back and sold under American names because they don't pay their people much, they don't care about emissions, they don't have to pay the same taxes.
I don't mind buying import stuff most of the time, but when unemployment is over 10% (the level that it was during the Depression) how can anyone afford to buy anything.
If we don't start taking back at least some of the manufacturing then what will we do?
The only jobs left will be in maintenance. We will become the Wall-E's of the world when we used to be the inovative force.
I really think that there needs to be a change in the way we tax our corporations. They should have to pay the same exact taxes when they import, as when they build it here. Or....perhaps tax breaks for goods made in the U.S.
Also, the average McDonalds employee makes way more than they did when I was a kid. In the 80's they made around $3.50. Now, they make almost $8 to start! I fully understand the Minimum Wage laws, but there has to be a limit. If you want a good paying job, get an education and get out there and make a living.
Between taxes, entitlement, laziness, complacency, greed, we have really launched the life boats and then set the boat on fire. Now what do we do? :lol: It's time to start pissing on the fire!!!!! :lol:
I know copper has gone down some, but if you remember about three years ago I thought it turned gold.
I might have found some of the reason for this copper price rise. We are running out and another country is getting
plenty of it.
I might have found some of the reason for this copper price rise. We are running out and another country is getting
plenty of it.
There are huge copper mines all around where I live.
I know for a fact that they won't run out for hundreds of years.
But.....There are a number of reasons why they closed down & layed every one off.
1. Employee greed. I would say that 7 out of 10 people who work there and have access to any building materials, electrical materials, tools, etc. have basically stolen everything that they can. When I worked there, they lost a D-9 (really large bull dozer)!
2. Corporate greed. The company that owned it when I worked there basically tried everything they could to get rid of the unions. The Electricians made more in 1989 than they did in 2000 because when Phelps Dodge bought the place they lowered the wages of every IBEW member, but they gave the guys that were not union members and worked in different mines or sections of the mines/smelters/mills/etc. a raise.
3. Union greed. The IBEW refused to negotiate, and the company refused to negotiate. Pretty much a Mexican Standoff at that point.
4. Employee stupidity. The IBEW gave up and pulled their representatives out. The members of the IBEW that remained actually ended up having the Steel Worker's Union negotiate for them, which only made matters worse.
So, in the end, I would have closed it if I owned it too! Copper was still a tiny bit over $2 a pound, but nowhere near the $4/pound that it was in 2006.
A lot (not all) of the employees were extremely inconsiderate of their employer. I think that if you work for a company, you should take into consideration the taxes, health care, worker's comp, etc. that a company has to pay for each employee.
My wife and I started our own Electrical Contracting business 3 1/2 years ago. Since then, we have basicall destroyed our credit trying to keep it afloat and pay wages in these times.
We have been through 61 electricians and electrical helpers in this time. I would hire 4 or 5 back and the rest can go to hell.
We have lost almost $10,000 worth of tools.
We have paid almost 1 million in wages.
We have paid butt loads of taxes, insurance, etc.
We have treated every employee with dignity and respect and always paid a little over the going wage for their experience level.
We have been screwed by most of them. I have had people quit and never let us know, but demand checks later. 1 guy quit and then showed up 2 weeks later to steal some materials. He's lucky I stopped him before he took the stuff or I would have taken it out of his ass.
We have had drug deals going down on our jobsites. People getting injured because they are high, an actual case of the D.T.'s in our parking lot, etc.
I basically have decided to only hire part time guys when I need them and stay small. I think I will be much happier that way.
So, in the end, I will no longer be providing jobs for anyone because I can no longer support employees who do not care whether I stay in business.
What a conundrum we are in as a country and a world!
I'm gonna go play my guitar and forget about the stress. 1 more work day (Saturday) and I'm off for a week to go shoot Bambie and freeze my ass off in the woods!
I know for a fact that they won't run out for hundreds of years.
But.....There are a number of reasons why they closed down & layed every one off.
1. Employee greed. I would say that 7 out of 10 people who work there and have access to any building materials, electrical materials, tools, etc. have basically stolen everything that they can. When I worked there, they lost a D-9 (really large bull dozer)!
2. Corporate greed. The company that owned it when I worked there basically tried everything they could to get rid of the unions. The Electricians made more in 1989 than they did in 2000 because when Phelps Dodge bought the place they lowered the wages of every IBEW member, but they gave the guys that were not union members and worked in different mines or sections of the mines/smelters/mills/etc. a raise.
3. Union greed. The IBEW refused to negotiate, and the company refused to negotiate. Pretty much a Mexican Standoff at that point.
4. Employee stupidity. The IBEW gave up and pulled their representatives out. The members of the IBEW that remained actually ended up having the Steel Worker's Union negotiate for them, which only made matters worse.
So, in the end, I would have closed it if I owned it too! Copper was still a tiny bit over $2 a pound, but nowhere near the $4/pound that it was in 2006.
A lot (not all) of the employees were extremely inconsiderate of their employer. I think that if you work for a company, you should take into consideration the taxes, health care, worker's comp, etc. that a company has to pay for each employee.
My wife and I started our own Electrical Contracting business 3 1/2 years ago. Since then, we have basicall destroyed our credit trying to keep it afloat and pay wages in these times.
We have been through 61 electricians and electrical helpers in this time. I would hire 4 or 5 back and the rest can go to hell.
We have lost almost $10,000 worth of tools.
We have paid almost 1 million in wages.
We have paid butt loads of taxes, insurance, etc.
We have treated every employee with dignity and respect and always paid a little over the going wage for their experience level.
We have been screwed by most of them. I have had people quit and never let us know, but demand checks later. 1 guy quit and then showed up 2 weeks later to steal some materials. He's lucky I stopped him before he took the stuff or I would have taken it out of his ass.
We have had drug deals going down on our jobsites. People getting injured because they are high, an actual case of the D.T.'s in our parking lot, etc.
I basically have decided to only hire part time guys when I need them and stay small. I think I will be much happier that way.
So, in the end, I will no longer be providing jobs for anyone because I can no longer support employees who do not care whether I stay in business.
What a conundrum we are in as a country and a world!
I'm gonna go play my guitar and forget about the stress. 1 more work day (Saturday) and I'm off for a week to go shoot Bambie and freeze my ass off in the woods!
Just for the hell of it, take a walk through Wallmart, Target, Kmart, whatever large retailer you have in your area, and look to see if you can find anything made in USA.
These stores are overseas emporiums, full of crap made by a child for .25 cents a week in China,Korea, where ever..... but not here.
Why the recession?
Most Americans have gone the route of buying disposable products because they are cheaper. They fill their houses with ****, and throw it away two months later, then by more crap....from China. There are less jobs here because we make less things here year after year. If every one just bought USA made goods, we would have to start making stuff here. There would be more jobs. You would be working overtime to keep up with demand. Then you would spend your hard earned American dollar on an American made product, supporting your fellow Americans. The economy would be booming. Our economy is slow, we all know that. But did you ever stop and think about the ecomony in China? Guess what they are spending money on. Rockets.
China has the largest Military ever assembled by humans on planet earth.
Is that what is must take, another world war for us to wake up. Are we even up to the task?
ENFORCE A TARRIFF ON NON USA MADE GOODS. BUY AMERICAN.
Just trying to keep it light, it's Christmas :wink:
These stores are overseas emporiums, full of crap made by a child for .25 cents a week in China,Korea, where ever..... but not here.
Why the recession?
Most Americans have gone the route of buying disposable products because they are cheaper. They fill their houses with ****, and throw it away two months later, then by more crap....from China. There are less jobs here because we make less things here year after year. If every one just bought USA made goods, we would have to start making stuff here. There would be more jobs. You would be working overtime to keep up with demand. Then you would spend your hard earned American dollar on an American made product, supporting your fellow Americans. The economy would be booming. Our economy is slow, we all know that. But did you ever stop and think about the ecomony in China? Guess what they are spending money on. Rockets.
China has the largest Military ever assembled by humans on planet earth.
Is that what is must take, another world war for us to wake up. Are we even up to the task?
ENFORCE A TARRIFF ON NON USA MADE GOODS. BUY AMERICAN.
Just trying to keep it light, it's Christmas :wink:
gplex said:
:lol: You should have seen the woman's face in Wal-Mart when I bought that pocket knife! :lol:
I looked at a few Gerbers. Most of them were cheaply built and felt like they were made out of air.
I looked them over and it does not say where they are made on the knives. I had to look at the boxes. They were made in Taiwan.
I asked the lady if she had any American made knives. She didn't even know!
My 5 year old son was with me, helping me shop for my wife. He looked at me and said "We need an American made knife, huh dad?" Man I could just hug that kid!
I started looking at the Kershaws because I have one and it is still sharp a year later.
The boxes even have the American Flag right on them! They want you to know that for another $5, you can get a higher quality American made product.
The lady at the counter just couldn't understand why I didn't want to even look at the knives until I knew where they were made.
I think that the worst part of all of this is that there is no new musical revolution!
Seems like most other turbulent times create some really great music.
As for China's army, that scares the hell out of me. They just bought Hummer too. Does that mean that our soldiers will be riding around in a war zone somewhere in a Chinese vehicle?
I've also been wondering what happens to the money (other than millitary spending). Are the Chinese people even getting anything? China is making hundreds of billions in profits. Does the government get it or do the factories get it? Is their government even trying to make the country better or increase the standard of living for the people? Or, are they just making bombs and tanks and guns and bullets??????
It is funny to notice if you have a theory some label you as a conspiracy theorist. It just makes it sound like
you are anti anything good. On that thought, lead seems to be a pain to get rid of. Yet, for how many years
has china unloaded toys and paint loaded with it on us. We buy it, it gets recalled, some return it, yet it is still
disposed of here.
In some ways the copper issue raises more and more concerns for me. How many new house's water systems
are built using P.E.X. ? If copper continues to rise it seems pex is cheap and durable. They have potable and non
potable versions. I hope they are labeled correctly, well even if they are now they might need to be replaced
when we find out neither versions are safe for potable water. Then more companies get the replace the Pex lawsuit
summons and, well take it from there.
I really wish there were ways to solve some of the issues that are raised.
Look at how the bands and the people had concerts around the whitehouse to protest the Vietnam war.
If you were to try to do that now you would be swept away before the scaffolding was even one tier high.
you are anti anything good. On that thought, lead seems to be a pain to get rid of. Yet, for how many years
has china unloaded toys and paint loaded with it on us. We buy it, it gets recalled, some return it, yet it is still
disposed of here.
In some ways the copper issue raises more and more concerns for me. How many new house's water systems
are built using P.E.X. ? If copper continues to rise it seems pex is cheap and durable. They have potable and non
potable versions. I hope they are labeled correctly, well even if they are now they might need to be replaced
when we find out neither versions are safe for potable water. Then more companies get the replace the Pex lawsuit
summons and, well take it from there.
I really wish there were ways to solve some of the issues that are raised.
Look at how the bands and the people had concerts around the whitehouse to protest the Vietnam war.
If you were to try to do that now you would be swept away before the scaffolding was even one tier high.
Turumbar82
Well-known member
You know I'm going to have to disagree with most of you knocking asian products. Japan and South Korea are some of the most highly technological countries in the world, of course they are probably because of us helping to rebuild them.
I know there are some hard working people here on the board but I think a lot of American workers aren't as quality as they used to be and a lot expect to be paid nice hourly wages and work nice shifts and have their benefits and their vacation days and sick days without putting much effort into their jobs. Where I work, some people just sit around and don't do anything and they get paid the same amount I do. They don't get in trouble. They don't get fired. I try because I care but it doesn't pay off. It might pay off later when I need a reference but that's it. Like Monsta-Tone said, there is way too much entitlement in the US. Unfortunately the reason US made goods cost so much is because US workers expect to be paid a lot to keep up with the cost of living. Raising minimum wage over and over again doesn't fix the problem because the prices of the products just go up. It's the gap between how much we make and how much it costs to live that just stays the same.
I'm definitely not surprised that Monsta-Tone only wants to hire a handful of those 61 workers. Good hard workers are becoming rare. Lots of people don't want to work hard anymore. There is no glory or respect in it like there was. The American dream used to be that if you work hard and are persistent you can be anything you want to be and have whatever life you want. Now it's the American dream to get an easy job that you can sit back and do nothing and get paid great so you can buy whatever you want.
Personally I don't care where it's made. I care about price and reliability. If I can't afford it I can't buy it. If it's not reliable I won't buy it even if it is American.
I know there are some hard working people here on the board but I think a lot of American workers aren't as quality as they used to be and a lot expect to be paid nice hourly wages and work nice shifts and have their benefits and their vacation days and sick days without putting much effort into their jobs. Where I work, some people just sit around and don't do anything and they get paid the same amount I do. They don't get in trouble. They don't get fired. I try because I care but it doesn't pay off. It might pay off later when I need a reference but that's it. Like Monsta-Tone said, there is way too much entitlement in the US. Unfortunately the reason US made goods cost so much is because US workers expect to be paid a lot to keep up with the cost of living. Raising minimum wage over and over again doesn't fix the problem because the prices of the products just go up. It's the gap between how much we make and how much it costs to live that just stays the same.
I'm definitely not surprised that Monsta-Tone only wants to hire a handful of those 61 workers. Good hard workers are becoming rare. Lots of people don't want to work hard anymore. There is no glory or respect in it like there was. The American dream used to be that if you work hard and are persistent you can be anything you want to be and have whatever life you want. Now it's the American dream to get an easy job that you can sit back and do nothing and get paid great so you can buy whatever you want.
Personally I don't care where it's made. I care about price and reliability. If I can't afford it I can't buy it. If it's not reliable I won't buy it even if it is American.
I definitely hear what you're saying.
It really gets to me though that things are the way they are. I guess that being raised by my Grandfather, who suffered through the depression and WW2 really paid off. He only had one way of doing things. He would do them the best he could and wouldn't take any less than what he knew was right.
That was 1/2 of my point. It seems like a lot of Americans are complacent and simply don't give a damn about trying to better themselves. Government handouts are just making it worse! My brother and his family have been on welfare for over 10 years. His wife works, but he hasn't had a steady job, ever. He hasn't even had a job in over 10 years.
As for Japan and South Korea, I whole-heartedly agree that they make some fine products.
I just hate the fact that I can find less than 100 items in my town that are made in the US still. Most of those are power tools!
And....I hate seeing 'Made in China' on everything! It just bothers me.
We spend all of our money on Chinese goods, only to turn around and borrow it back from them because our GDP is crap. It just seems like a downward spiral to me.
It really gets to me though that things are the way they are. I guess that being raised by my Grandfather, who suffered through the depression and WW2 really paid off. He only had one way of doing things. He would do them the best he could and wouldn't take any less than what he knew was right.
That was 1/2 of my point. It seems like a lot of Americans are complacent and simply don't give a damn about trying to better themselves. Government handouts are just making it worse! My brother and his family have been on welfare for over 10 years. His wife works, but he hasn't had a steady job, ever. He hasn't even had a job in over 10 years.
As for Japan and South Korea, I whole-heartedly agree that they make some fine products.
I just hate the fact that I can find less than 100 items in my town that are made in the US still. Most of those are power tools!
And....I hate seeing 'Made in China' on everything! It just bothers me.
We spend all of our money on Chinese goods, only to turn around and borrow it back from them because our GDP is crap. It just seems like a downward spiral to me.
Turumbar82
Well-known member
Unfortunately even American products are being made with less quality more and more. My dad works for a somewhat well known tool company. He's been with the company for 37 years and he says that the quality of tools they make today are much less than they did 30 years ago. It seems like very few companies make products that last.
My principle in high school used to have a a theory that china was slowly taking us over in an indirect way. He said eventually we would become dependent. lol who knows.
I agree about the downward spiral. It seems very bleak that things will change.
My principle in high school used to have a a theory that china was slowly taking us over in an indirect way. He said eventually we would become dependent. lol who knows.
I agree about the downward spiral. It seems very bleak that things will change.
I definitely agree about the quality issue. I have some Klien tools left over from my apprenticeship 20 years ago. They are far superior to the Klien tools that I buy today!
:lol: I used to feel that way about the Japanese when I lived in Hawaii! Most of the major resorts were Arab or Japanese owned. Japan owns a great deal of property there too. I always thought that this was a direct result of not being able to take command. They simply purchased it instead!
The next 20 years will definitely be interesting!
:lol: I used to feel that way about the Japanese when I lived in Hawaii! Most of the major resorts were Arab or Japanese owned. Japan owns a great deal of property there too. I always thought that this was a direct result of not being able to take command. They simply purchased it instead!
The next 20 years will definitely be interesting!
I don't think so. "Hummer" isn't the same thing as the military uses. And, from what I understand, not even the H1's were. The real ones are HMMWV or "Humvee" and were made by AMC, not GM. China just bought the right to make big SUV'sMonsta-Tone said:
yep.Turumbar82 said:
That is good to know.
I was thinking about it last night. If you were to look around your house, not at everything, but at the things you use the most. How many of them say "China" on them?
I bet the average is around 80% - 95%.
We have 3 small kids, so it's more like 95% for us. Try finding any toy made in the US! I do have 3 trunks full of mint condition original GI Joe toys though! I bet this China thing just makes their value keep going up and up. :lol:
Then, I was thinking about what the oddest item in my house (or yard) would be that is made in China.
Paper......reams of printer paper! With the Hewlett Packard name on it.
And.....my BBQ grill, which weighs over 300 pounds! We bought the biggest, baddest grill we could get for under $1,200. It has an American name on it. I thought it was made in America. This fall, I was changing the tank and had to get inside the bottom to clean it out. There is a little sticker up high, where nobody would ever notice that says, "Made in China. Hecho E Chine!" It's gotten so bad that they even write it in spanish now too!
rocksalt7
Well-known member
Monsta brings up MANY valid points....
Some of the prolems we are facing just aren't going to go away anytime soon, sadly. The "cheapening" of things starts at the product design stage and goes downhill from there. I'm a design engineer and my best parts and machines have been made here in the US. I have personally inspected parts and assemblies from USA and overseas, and the American quality wins hands down!!! Often, it's not even very close, but the "bean counters want us to "work with" the overseas manufacturers to get the costs down. We can't win this doing it that way!!
On the parts we had made overseas, it took 4 -5 first article prototypes to get a good part, another couple of tries to get the pilot run done, and then when the "hard" tooling is brought online, the parts just f^%# SUCK because they aren't the same! Then you have shipping, and duties on top of that. But the worst cost in all of this is TIME!! It takes too much time and effort to go to China or India or ???
The parts made here took much less time but cost 3X as much sometimes. Shipping is usually easier, and when you have an issue....pick up the phone!! It's that easy. On offshore products, you have to go thruogh layer upon layer of BS and then you have to have a translator.!! :evil: HOW IS THIS HELPING!!
OK I'll get off my soapbox now....If I could, I'd move out to New Mexico w/ MT and design some cool machinery he could build for us all to enjoy!!! :mrgreen:
Some of the prolems we are facing just aren't going to go away anytime soon, sadly. The "cheapening" of things starts at the product design stage and goes downhill from there. I'm a design engineer and my best parts and machines have been made here in the US. I have personally inspected parts and assemblies from USA and overseas, and the American quality wins hands down!!! Often, it's not even very close, but the "bean counters want us to "work with" the overseas manufacturers to get the costs down. We can't win this doing it that way!!
On the parts we had made overseas, it took 4 -5 first article prototypes to get a good part, another couple of tries to get the pilot run done, and then when the "hard" tooling is brought online, the parts just f^%# SUCK because they aren't the same! Then you have shipping, and duties on top of that. But the worst cost in all of this is TIME!! It takes too much time and effort to go to China or India or ???
The parts made here took much less time but cost 3X as much sometimes. Shipping is usually easier, and when you have an issue....pick up the phone!! It's that easy. On offshore products, you have to go thruogh layer upon layer of BS and then you have to have a translator.!! :evil: HOW IS THIS HELPING!!
OK I'll get off my soapbox now....If I could, I'd move out to New Mexico w/ MT and design some cool machinery he could build for us all to enjoy!!! :mrgreen:
:lol: "Don't worry! My dad's a TV Repairman. He's got an awesome set of tools!" :lol:
Kiff is pretty damn handy too, and he's just 145 miles away!
