LSC with THD Yellow Jackets-- OMG WOW!!!

[rustyvandewege]

I finally got my THD Yellow Jackets installed. Put 2 on the outside and left my 6L6's in the middle. OMG!!!!!!!!! It tightened up my bass response on my clean channel immediately without any control changes. It also did what I have read from other users, it produced a "jangle" or glassiness to my cleans that just stood out-more of a "sparkle". My overdrive channel I tried at 50watts (using just the EL84 YJ's) WITHOUT the drive engaged first- my overdrive chording had way more definition and feel, it "came alive". I then engaged the drive and WHOA--- what tone and response!!! My leads just stood out. There is a reduction in power/volume but with the LSC, it is still more than loud enough. I have only had time to play it a little and these are my initial observations. Will have more time tonight----I am installing an ElectroVoice EVM-12L. Says it's the "Greatest guitar speaker in the world!" We will see. I will post the results

 

[Charles Reeder]

It is a great sound!

If you have not already done so...check out the thread..."6V6's in a Lonestar classic, is it possible?"

It is currently on page #2. started by 'Dr Rob'.

In the thread I discuss my experience using a pair of 6V6's and a pair of Yellow Jackets with EL84's. It is sort of like the 'simul-class' mode in the Blue Angel. It gets a superb crispness allied to a bubbling shimmer and jangle, all at the same time. That's just my crude attempt o describe the sound...it really defies easy description. If you like the 6L6's with the YJ's...then somewhere down the line...you need to try the combination of 6V6's and Yellow Jackets...I feel pretty sure you'll like it!

Regards: Charles

 

[plan-x]

Charles, do you run that 6V6/yj combo. Why is that better than a 6l6/yj combo.

 

[Charles Reeder]

Hello again 'plan-x'!

I run all the different combinations; depending on where I'm playing. I seldom get the opportunity to run my Lone Star with 4 6L6s...it is a mighty beast! This usually only happens at outdoor 'festivals' and even then I prefer 2 6L6s and 2 YJ EL84s, if that will 'cut it'.

So I'm usually running 6L6s and Yellow Jacket EL84s or I'm running 6V6s with the Yellow Jacket EL84s.

Volume is usually the deciding factor; much more so than my tone preferences...as all of these combinations sound fantastic...but if I were to decide purely on tone then my choice would probably almost always be the 6V6 and YJ-EL84 combination.

I am going to digress for a moment.
Running all Yellow Jackets with EL84s (4 of them) in the LSC...or running all 6V6s (4 of them) is also an option...but it is by far the 'least interesting' choice... so far as tone goes (IMHO)
Either 4 YJ EL84s, or 4 6V6s, or the mixed combination of 2 6V6s and 2 YJ EL84s will all yield about the same approximate wattage (35-40?) and apparent volume. You can also 'tweak' the overdrive characteristics and volume somewhat as well... by using different grades of EL84s in the mix.

What really makes the 6V6 and YJ combo work especially well (I suspect) is that both pairs are putting out about the same amount of power and volume; but since they have different tone characteristics; the effect of their interaction is 'complex' and quite 'dazzling' (at least to my ears) and it is well balanced as well because of the similar output of the 2 tube types.

The Mesa Blue Angel featured this mix (labeled 'simul-class'); but with 4-EL84s and only 2-6V6s; and so the EL84s overwhelmed the 6V6s. The Blue Angel pdf Manual is still available for downloading on Mesa's website...and it is worth reading as they explain it pretty well.

So, I think the main reason I prefer the 6v6 and YJ EL84 combo over the 6L6 and YJ EL84 combo is not because I necessarily like the tone of the 6V6s better than 6L6s; but because the 6V6s and El84s are relative equals and the 'interplay' of their different tones is more readily apparent because of their equality in volume.

Again... I do find using either all 6V6s or all EL84s far less interesting tonally than either the 6L6 and EL84 combo or the 6V6 and EL84 combo. It all comes down to individual preference in the long run...but I would strongly recommend that anyone 'audition' the 6V6 YJ EL84 combination if they can. Any of these combinations are more than adequate in volume for most places I play...and I get tons of compliments on my tone when using the 6V6 and YJ EL84 setup.

As usual I find it difficult to 'cut to the chase' and give a quick and simple answer!...but I feel that people deserve to know why a decision is made so that they can weigh the same factors as I do.

But...short answer...my favorite is 6V6s and YJs with EL84s!

Sincerely hope that this helps! Charles

 

[plan-x]

Thanks again for the reply. I'm going to look into that. Where do you guys get your yj? And tubes, what brand and dealer?

 

[Charles Reeder]

Hey:

Ever seeking a 'bargain'...I picked up all my YJ's on eBay (without tubes). After trying them out and finding them useful I ended up buying 4-pairs! Excessive perhaps, but I wanted to have spares on hand (just as I do with tubes). I thought I might have some to fail...but none have yet.

As for EL84s....as of now I've only used JJs...and Bob at Euro-tubes seems to be the guy to consult for setting people up with whole sets of tubes. Since he only sells JJ; who should know them better than him...?

But...I actually bought my JJ brand EL84s from the Tube Depot in Memphis. They were able to supply me with 3-different 'hardness' grades...had the best price (at least at that time)...and offered $3.95 FedEx 3-day shipping.

I purchased both my JJ and EH 6V6s from Tube Depot as well. (It was convenient as I ordered my EL84s at the same time) Their 20-21 sets seem to work well in my LSC...but I can't help but wonder if Bob at Euro-Tubes might not be able to offer the 'perfect' match for the LSC; since he seems to go to great pains in his matching efforts.

Other people may have others to recommend.

Regards: Charles

 

[rustyvandewege]

Charles,
Thank you for the input. It is awesome that there are other "Tone Junkies" like me out there.
I got my YJ's from Tonetronix.com Everyone else was back ordered.
A friend of mine, (we started out on guitar together 30 yrs ago) was there when I fired mine up the first time. He immediately went and ordered a pair for his 4x10 Fender Deluxe. Will let you know how that turns out.

 

[Charles Reeder]

Charles,
Thank you for the input. It is awesome that there are other "Tone Junkies" like me out there.
I got my YJ's from Tonetronix.com Everyone else was back ordered.
A friend of mine, (we started out on guitar together 30 yrs ago) was there when I fired mine up the first time. He immediately went and ordered a pair for his 4x10 Fender Deluxe. Will let you know how that turns out.

Hey Rusty...?

Yes, the YJs are great little devices for opening up 'tone possibilities' on lots of amps.

I checked out the 'Tonetronix' site that you used. It seems they stock a much more comprehensive line of the THD Yellow jackets than many other suppliers. As a matter of fact it could be daunting to those not familiar with the YJs. I would advise anyone who hasn't used them (YJs) before to be sure to 'ask questions' of the supplier or 'THD' before ordering to make sure you get the 'right set'.

Please do keep everyone informed of how the YJs work in your friend's amp. BTW; from my past experience using them in different amps...if your friend finds that his amp's sound is just 'too saturated' or 'distorts too soon' with the YJs; have him try a 12AT7 in the phase inverter position...usually cleans things up pretty well.

Keep on 'toning'! Charles

 

[Silverwulf]

Just wanted to add that I've also ordered from the Tube Depot and had great service. I ordered at 3 PM online (matched quad of 5881's for a Mesa) on a weekday and then had my tubes at 12 Noon 2 days later for $3.95 shipping.

 

[Charles Reeder]

After my last posting on this thread; I had a 'thought' which I wished to share,

'rustyvandewege' posted about his great results with the 'Yellow Jackets' in his LSC. Several of us 'chimed in' with our stories. 'Rusty' told about getting his at 'Tonetronix' because everyone else was back ordered. I checked them out and they offer a much wider selection (or at least they bother to feature it) than any other suppliers.

Anyway...I noticed something VERY interesting. They may have been offered for quite some time (and I just didn't know it) but that's beside the point. What is of interest is that they offer several Yellow Jackets that 'run' the EL84s in 'TRIODE'-Mode...rather than the 'PENTODE'-Mode I was familiar with.

What does this mean to us? Well for even less power than the regular Yellow Jackets (about 1/2 power) we can buy a pair of these 'Triode'-Yellow Jackets and put them in the outside 2 tube sockets of our Lone Star 'Classic'. On the 50-watt setting we would then get about 8 to 10-Watts total output rather than the 15 to 20 Watts we get with the regular Yellow Jackets! You could also use 4 of these 'Triode' versions. You could then assign your channels as either 8-10 watts or 15-20 watts.

This might 'ease the envy' some of us who own the 'early version' of the LSC feel towards the newer LS with the 10-watt option. Using the 'triode YJs in the outer 2-sockets 'WILL NOT' give us the 'single-ended' sound that the actual LSC with 10-watt option has (as it will be running in 'push/pull' mode) but it will certainly get us close (volume-wise)!

This is certainly another great example of the versatility and great options we LSC owners enjoy. I HAVE NOT tried this yet...I just became aware of the 'Triode-Yellow Jacket'; but you can be sure I will try them fairly soon!

If any one else 'beats me to the punch' (or has already tried these) please post your impressions.

To every one; be VERY CAREFUL to order the proper Yellow Jacket-Triode Adapters which are specifically set up for use with 6L6, 6V6, EL34 tubes etc. I 'think' the JYSD Triode set is the one we need to order...but I advise 'double-checking' with the supplier before ordering.

Cheers: Charles

 

[Pageburst]

I love all this LSC activity and have been thinking of checking out the yellowjackets.

Hey Charles can you tell me which ones you bought for your amp.

Now the only decision is whether or not to go with the triode models

Hey Charles have you checked out the EVM12L speaker. I am really considering this for my LSC but I don't want to loose the vintagey tone.

 

[Charles Reeder]

pagebuest asked

I love all this LSC activity and have been thinking of checking out the yellowjackets.

Hey Charles can you tell me which ones you bought for your amp.

Now the only decision is whether or not to go with the triode models

Hey Charles have you checked out the EVM12L speaker. I am really considering this for my LSC but I don't want to loose the vintagey tone.

my answer:

Hey! I bought the 'regular' or 'pentode' versions that give you about 15 to 20 watts per pair in an amp like the Lone Star. The model number is # YJCD. (the D stands for 'duet' as in pair). I don't even know if they made the 'triode' version back when I got mine.

If I were just getting started with the Yellow Jackets; I think I would go for a set of the model # YJCD (15 -20 watt a pair, 'pentode') versions first. (They will be the more versatile choice) You can experiment with them in either the outer tube sockets or the inner tube sockets and pair them up against 6L6s or 6V6s in the other sockets. If it turns out you like the tone and want to go for a little less power...for recording or practice etc...then give the YJSD (8-10 watt a pair, 'triode') versions a try too.

No I haven't tried an EVM 12L yet... but I am definitely interested...and I have been reading everything anyone has to say about using them in a LS. I've rotated a bunch of different speakers through my Lone Star...and it has been rather frustrating really...because I actually liked something about all of them!
I think it may be that the Lone Star sounds good with just about any speaker...we just have to find what speaker sounds closest to that 'elusive' tone that is 'playing in our heads!'

Regards: Charles

 

[medwards1969]

I presume all this works only for the combo amps, as the heads don't have enough room to install yellow jackets, yes?

 

[Charles Reeder]

I presume all this works only for the combo amps, as the heads don't have enough room to install yellow jackets, yes?

Hey medwards1969:

My first impulse would be to say you are correct; that it will only work for combos; but I won't really know until I try it.
I have a LSC head arriving this week; so I will find out then and let you know. I love my LSC Combo (with the channel-2 gain and master pot swap) so much that I just had to get a LSC Head too!

Even if it will not work on the head version 'as is'; there is a relatively 'unobtrusive' modification that can be done to the bottom of the head cabinet that will 'probably' allow use of the 'Yellow jackets'.

But,I'll wait and see before I 'get ahead of myself...I don't want to mislead anyone. I should know by Thursday.

Regards: Charles

 

[medwards1969]

Charles,
Does your "Reeder Mod" (!!) work also in the environment of the Yellow Jackets?

 

[Charles Reeder]

Charles,
Does your "Reeder Mod" (!!) work also in the environment of the Yellow Jackets?

Oh absolutely! The 'contrast' is dramatic no matter the selection of output tubes. It is very pronounced in any wattage choice and in both the 'tweed' and 'normal' on settings.

Charles

 

[Charles Reeder]

I presume all this works only for the combo amps, as the heads don't have enough room to install yellow jackets, yes?

Hey medwards1969: (and other LSC Head owners)

Just got my LSC Head in a few minutes ago...and remembered your question.

Good News...if you are considering putting Yellow Jackets into a Lonestar Classic Head...they do fit...with no problem at all!

I have the 'longer' version of the Yellow Jackets...and I honestly thought they wouldn't fit. I thought I'd either have to drill holes in the bottom of the head to give 'wiggle-room' or buy the short YJs (which are rarer and cost more).But they go in quite easily!

So...I guess you have no excuses any more...you're just gonna have to try them! Chuckle!

Have fun! Charles

 

[ChuckB]

Does the LSC head also have a fan in it? if so does it interfere with low volume playing?

 

[Charles Reeder]

Does the LSC head also have a fan in it? if so does it interfere with low volume playing?

Hey ChuckB:

Yes the LSC Head does have a fan. I would think it's probably more of a necessity on the head than the combo because of the somewhat restricted airflow.

The head I received today is a very early production unit and does not have an on/off switch for the fan. I understand later versions do. I can't really judge the fan noise on this amp yet because I haven't had much time to play on it yet. After testing it out and doing an A/B comparison with my other Lonestar I immediately set about doing my channel-2 'mod' on it.

However; I have had a Lonestar Combo for several years and have always used it with the fan on and it has never bothered me in the least when playing at low volume. Of course your idea and my idea of 'low volume' may vary greatly!

A note of possible interest to other members of the forum: I purchased this amp from the "Boogie Classifieds" on this site. I bought it from member 'pjrhd28' and it was one of the smoothest transactions I've ever experienced. He shipped the day after he received payment and went out of his way to keep me informed every step of the way. I very highly recommend him as both a seller and as a person.

Regards: Charles

 

[medwards1969]

Do you mind Charles, tell me what the reach length is with the Yellow Jackets? I have an early short-head and it may be shorter than the current production heads as far as room is concerned.

Oh, and which particular model Yellow Jacket and tubes are you using if it were to fit in the head that you got.
Thanks,
Mark