importance of rackmount

[facefreezer]

I have been a diverse musician for several years and have spent most of my time in my studio tweaking knobs and editing mixes, as opposed to getting trashed, breaking bottles, and putting on the show of my life on the stage. however, I recently agreed to do some performances for a local band and....being the tone freak that i am in the studio (as well as a novice to live performance) I'm a little concerned about producing a sub-par guitar sound.

I always hear and see of people having massive rackmount racks for their guitar rigs but i never really understood why. Is there something magical about them that makes them better than their foot pedal counterparts? and why buy a high-end preamp if your amp head's preamp is already great? i guess i may be missing something here. sorry if this sounds like a stupid question but i never understood what having a rack is for other than maybe a furman PC or something.

My current setup i am running is an f-100 head, 2x12 mesa cab, a boost pedal, wah and loopstation before the amp, and a DL4 running through the fx loop. the music the band is doing is kind've modern rockish, with spacey 'minus the bear' breakdowns intertwined. i know this post has kind've turned into an ongoing ramble. but on top of better understanding the importance of rackmount gear, any suggestions, tips, tricks of the trade, etc on creating the best sounding live performance would be of great help.

thanks everyone for your time.

and yes, the band owns a pretty nice PA.

 

[ToneAddictJon]

I use to do the whole huge rack full of gear, plus halfstack, plus pedals to control everything, and it just got to the point where I spent more time messing with it than playing. My personnal belief is that live sound comes through better on a simple aproach, I bring my amp, a delay pedal, sometimes a wah or phaser depending on the gig, and my guitars. I usually plug straight into my amp with a little delay in the loop for those double guitar parts with one guitar (my band covers a lot of priest and I'm the only guitarist...). The rack thing works well, does it sound better- not for me, for some yes. Is it worth the extra time and hauling gear to have the 35th preset for the one part in the one song, it depends, as a live player in my own band no, as a session player yes.

 

[CoG]

rigs don't have to be huge. a big part of it is being able to mix and match features that you want.

Even in a small rig, lot of guys really like the flexibility you get from a programmable preamp like a Triaxis or a Prophecy or a JMP-1-- no amp will give you that-- and from the ability to put in a power amp that suits your needs in terms of power and tubes. Plus, pro fx=rackmount. If you want top-notch fx these days, you're gonna have a rack anyway, so why not just stick everything in there?

For me, I ended up going rack because I was so happy with my rec pre in the studio that I decided to build a live rig around it.

It's like anything else, the more versatility you have the more complications you introduce. And everybody goes through phases...!

 

[phaboo]

The rack stuff is just bigger and has more flashing lights!

The size gives the equipment designers a bit more room to work with. Fitting everything inside a little pedal can mean they have to cut a corner here and there to make everything fit.

For me, it means all the patch cables and things can be hidden away in the rack and I don't have to worry about them. There's nothing for me to wire up when I unload. I have a complicated setup (because I'm a hopeless gear ***** and I came up in the 80's), and I'd hate to have to plug everything in every time I set up.

That being said, it's easy to plug a whole bunch of crap together and destroy your sound. Having everything together in one rack gives you a bazillion options, but if you don't watch what you're doing you can degrade your tone until there's nothing left. I have a bunch of effects units, but everything goes through a rack mixer (with effects fed from the aux sends and returns handled back through the mixer) so that my source tone doesn't have to run through anything. Most of the time, though, the effects are turned OFF. I mix them in when I want them via an Ultrafoot so that I not only get on/off, I can set their levels on the fly.

I think effects are used most effectively (is that a pun?) when you don't really notice them.

 

[18&Life]

As I said I use 4 things.

1 tuner
2 triaxis
3 gmajor
4 2.90

On the floor an ada mxc,a cry baby from hell and a expression pedal.
Those things give me all tones I ever wanted.

I don't have gas so I don't need tons of equipments.
You can always keep it in the size you want. :wink:

 

[18&Life]

well for small gigs I don't play with my rig.
I use a pod live through a PA or some amp that is already on the stage.
Rack stuff for small gigs never,at least to me. :wink:

 

[facefreezer]

thanks all for your mesa wisdom. it makes sense that rackmount gear is more professional but how do you control that all while your playing?

 

[CoG]

all I have/need to control my rack is the 2-button footswitch from the rec pre and a Tech21 MidiMouse (3 buttons) that lets me bop up and down the five patches in my Yamaha Rev500 that I actually use live.

I have anywhere between one and three fx pedals as well, but that's not the rack's fault. I think I still have less buttons than a guy wth a RKII.

Some people need... more :lol:

 

[WillPlayForFood]

I have mixed feelings here. No reason to overdue it, and yet there are things that a musician needs, to be able to work. That said, it is COMPLETELY personal. I use all different set-ups based on what I need in the moment. We are playing covers...which for me means I have to be able to get certain sounds. I have played a PODXT pro (that's the rack unit), direct to PA and/or through a VHT power amp into a cab and both were acceptable. Line 6's shortboard is all I need for pedals then, easy

If you look below, my cureent rig is racked, because I wanted to make it as easy to set-up as possible. I mean, I plug my Furman in and run a cable to the foot controller, ADA MC-1, and it's done. Everything is hooked up in the rack and I don't have to mess with pedals, they are racked too.

Again, it's personal preference and ease of use that drives me to use a specific set up. We will be playing an outdoor, lunch time, gig this week in downtown Missoula, MT. I will bring the PODXT pro and the VHT power amp in one 4 space rack and then a cab. That's it...use the Line 6 shortboard for switching. Everything is done quickly and cleanly. That's another issue. Clean stage!!! No cables running all over the place and not a bunch of pedals strung together to trip over. If you have a big stage, that's another consideration. It all comes into play, for me at least. The trick with this gig is we are the first of 2 bands. So, tear down has to be quick. I need to be able to grab my foot controller, my rack, and my cab and be off the stage. It is a 1 1/2 hour show.

Anyway, use what works for you! My gear headedness is showing here, but I have a few different set-ups for different needs. Feel free to ask questions. Good luck!!!

 

[18&Life]

thanks all for your mesa wisdom. it makes sense that rackmount gear is more professional but how do you control that all while your playing?

Have you never heard about MIDI ???!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

 

[facefreezer]

hahaha, i am actually VERY familiar with midi since i do lots of work in the studio. however, i have never used a midi controller for guitar. ive heard of it, but never considered its possibilities...I am now doin' a little research on the idea as we speak. I know i'm new to the ultra tech side of guitar..but I can assure you I am not new to the 6 string itself.

:wink:

 

[Mr_You]

Bottom line is most people who use rack gear want as much versatility combined with MIDI programmability in a (comparatively speaking) small package. Its a good form factor for making rugged, rackable, mobile, highend equipment without adding much to the cost.

If you need professional effects and tone for the road or studio, its the way to go.

The problem with rack effects is they are usually made to be ran in the effects loop (often in series). So if you want a wah or front-end delay you'll still need a pedal.

IMO, the use of high-end rack effects is a luxury and is best used with a parallel loop or the analog to digital conversion will suck your warm tube tone. Mesas power amps help quite a bit here (ie. Mesa 395) and many guitarists don't mind the D/A conversion.

Some more thoughts in this thread.

 

[phaboo]

well for small gigs I don't play with my rig.
I use a pod live through a PA or some amp that is already on the stage.
Rack stuff for small gigs never,at least to me. :wink:

There are no small gigs . . . only small players.

 

[medwards1969]

Being the libertarian I am, I say think about your goal - is it to copy or to create?

We had some creativity in the 60's and 70's - since then there has been some good stuff, but basically more and more copying - until music is now is a sad state.

I'm waiting for a great great new band to come along - and it isn't here right at the moment.

 

[stomplex]

Been doing alot of gigging lately and to me it boils down to the venue. If it's a decent size stage and they have a stereo cab available I'll bring my rack gear.

Pros to using my rack gear:

All my cool little sounds from my G-Force
Ability to control my gain with an expression pedal
Noise gate
My monster tone
My racked wireless

Cons to using my rack gear:

Pretty much fully loaded, HEAVY! 10 space Mesa shockmount rack BULKY-HEAVY backbreaker!
Bulky Pedaltrain Pro w/ road case for my pedals
If no stereo cab, I have to bring at least one of my oversized Mesa recto cabs
Overall more space required, lots more work and possibly a little more time to setup

On the other hand, if it's a small venue and/or I know that the venue has backline gear and/or I know we'll be playing a short set I bring a duffle bag with a couple of cables and spare Bad Horsie Wah that I just bought.

Pros to traveling light:

I'm much more mobile - don't really need any help loading or looking after my gear
It's a challenge to produce a good sound when you don't have home turf advantage(I view this as a pro because I think it helps keep you grounded)

Cons:

I don't have my monster tone
Backline isn't always the best to work with - Never as flexible as my setup!

 

[reo73]

Ahhh, the old debate...Rack Gear vs Amp. For me it just boils down to what I want out of my guitar rig. I have what I consider to be more of a home rig/recording rig that is a 14 space rack with a Studio Pre and Mesa 50/50 being the "amp" and some other effects units all midi controlloble with my GC Pro. For me the Studio Pre offers the Mesa tone I am looking for plus I can add other preamps or effects units for other flavors in the rig. Just something fun to mess around with. Now, if I had a gig to play it would need to be somewhat substantial for me to haul all that crap around otherwise I usually just grab my Mesa F-30 and small pedal board for live use. I have found that I have become less critical about my live sound and a good combo amp with a few good pedals gives me all the tone I desire on stage. But, the rig I prefer is still my rack rig and if I had the means and desire I would prefer to play that rig over any other set-up.

 

[Zorshelter]

I'm also thinking about it, the solution I may go with is my mark IV head(currently in a 4 space rack) and add another 4 space rack with a Furman, a switcher/looper (8 loops, 4 pre gain, 4 post gain) and my foot pedals (wahmmy, eq, noise gate, bb preamp...) The whole thing would be controlled by a midi footswitch.

Currently, I kind of tap dance during songs, because if I want to go from a clean sound with a delay to a whammy + eq + lead channel, I have 4 buttons to push... :shock:

So this solution would allow me to go from any sound to any other sound pushing only 1 button (better isn't it), it would clear the ground from all the pedals I currently have, not speaking about cables and power supplies...So only a midi footswitch (rocktron all access or maybe midimate if it's enough), an expression pedal and my old wah would remain at my feet, on the cons maybe more weight which is annoying but I don't see how to get the versatility i want otherwise, I'm even thinking about getting a rocktron all access or similar for my practice (more buttons allowing me more different sounds so I can try different sounds) and a midimate or similar for gigs with preprogrammed effects (just because it is smaller....)

I may change my mind but for now I think it can give me what I want without sucking too much of my tone