Hypothetical Question

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crestwood1972

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If I bought a new guitar in 1999 from an official dealer and just the other day discovered that the wrong brand of pickup was installed at the factory for the 1999 model year when in fact that guitar was made ...

Would the manufacturer be obligated to fix the problem for free and pay for shipping to and from even though the warranty has long since expired?

(This is assuming of course that the manufacturer could clearly verify that the pickup was not installed at a later time as a replacement - say the tech's initials were placed on the original).

I say yes because the problem was introduced at the factory and existed from day 1 regardless of when it was discovered.

note: this did not happen to me or anybody else I'm aware of but I have a reason for asking which I will soon make clear.
 
Why not?

After all, the guy paid for a guitar with the advertised pickups and didn't get it. He got something else.

What difference does it make when the error was discovered?
 
My experience is that people won't take you seriously and that you're trying to pull one on them. Good luck though.
 
yes, but my question wasn't "would they" my question was "should they".

in addition, in my example, I included the proviso that the error could clearly be determined by the manufacturer. so they would have no way to argue the point.

the issue i am trying to get to is if an error was made at the time of manufacture, should the warranty period running out matter?

the point is we're not talking about normal wear and tear of a part here, we're talking about the customer not getting what he paid for but discovering the problem "late".
 
but this isn't a case of the specs changing. the manufacturer didn't begin installing this other pickup for all guitars.

in the example i'm providing, the manufacturer goofed on ONE guitar and installed the incorrect pickup. no formal specification change took place. none was announced. they simply put in the wrong pickup at the factory.

i can see this is becoming a logical chore for some of you. so let me tell you the real issue which in fact did occur.

a guy bought a nice guitar used. it is a little over 3 years old and thus past the warranty. he discovered that the guitar had a case of fret buzz and took it to a luthier. not some kid in the back room of billy bob's bait, tackle, and guitars, but a luthier at a university music department.

the luthier told him the problem was that the truss rod had not been installed correctly and that the guitar would never be "right" until that problem was corrected. the truss rod was not broken. the problem, according to the uthier, was that the truss rod was installed incorrectly at time of manufacture.

in my opinion, the problem should be corrected free of charge by the manufacturer and they should pay all associated shipping charges. even though the problem was diagnosed after the warranty had run out.

i read of this problem on another forum. i wrote there that the manufacturer shouldn't be obligated to just take the luthier's word for it, but that they should offer to fix the guitar free IF the manufacturer could confirm that the truss rod was indeed installed improperly.

this set off a truckload of fireworks that ultimately resulted in my getting banned for life. (oh, how will i ever get to sleep tonight worrying about that).

ultimately the manufacturer disagreed with the luthier and charged the customer. the customer is very happy with the guitar, as i am mine, but unhappy that he was charged to fix something that his own people were telling him was a manufacturer introduced problem.

this just struck me as an interesting case and i would hope that manufacturers would take the attitude that the customer is always right until they are proven wrong.

a better way for the manufacturer to have handled the problem, in my opinion, would have been to offer to discuss the matter over the phone with the luthier and hear him out. then, if the luthier is still certain about his conclusion, offer to reimburse the customer for all charges IF and only if the manufacturer, upon inspecting the guitar themselves, agrees that the problem was caused by the factory.

one point here. i use the word "customer" rather loosely here because the person involved was a second-hand buyer of the instrument. he was not the original customer. however, since the original owner never had the guitar checked out, in my mind, it shouldn't make any difference if he was the second owner or the twenty-second owner. he paid good money for something that didn't work properly due to a fault caused by the factory.

there is much more to this story as the actual owner of said company immediately dismissed the luthier's conclusion and refused to entertain the notion that the guitar should be fixed for free "because it is a 3+ year old guitar".

this is wrong thinking in my book, an incredibly arrogant attitude, and an obvious attempt to protect his business at any cost including humiliating someone on a public forum before finding out what the facts were.
 
I would honestly be surprised if you were even able to speak to anyone on the phone, let alone get them to inspect your guitar.

They also probably wouldn't care because anything out of warranty doesn't matter. It wouldn't be the first time a product has been made that literally self-destructs so you have to replace it.

The way I see it, you're either talking about a nice guitar: hand-made in the USA, uses quality parts; not a "price point" guitar : made in some country, pickups are made 1 step above a can tied to a string, parts are junky.

If the guitar is a nice guitar, (say Gibson) they may hear you out but put the burden on you to test the guitar and have it fixed or replaced. (out of warranty so youre going to pay)

if its an imported guitar (epiphone) just move on.

Maybe I'm wrong but it wouldn't be the first time a company has NOT stood behind their product.
 
Hey, I KNOW what these companies WILL do. They'll do what the owner of this company did and claim that because it was a second-hand user and a 3+ year-old guitar it was not his problem anymore.

What I am getting at is I think that this is completely wrong and unfair.

If the truss rod was broken then of COURSE the company shouldn't be liable. The guitar wouldn't have played worth a **** from day 1 and it is perfectly reasonable to assume that the original owner would have complained right away.

But this company's owner immediately took the position that it was IMPOSSIBLE for the truss rod to be installed incorrectly at the factory (uha) and that the university luthier didn't know what he was talking about.

Unacceptable. Arrogant. And extremely poor customer service in my book.

If they didn't make such **** fine guitars, I'd of boycotted them. LOL.

Mine is perfect and they have a great reputation for quality workmanship.

I just objected to the attitude the guy had and the immediate dismissal of any notion that the company might have made a mistake.
 
a. I didn't know the answer everyone would give. I said I knew what almost any company would do. My question to the forum was IS THIS RIGHT.

b. Next time I get ready to start a thread I'll runit by you first and see if you're OK with it. To see if there is any real point.

I don't want to be rude here but you seem to have a real problem with reading comprehension. You might want to work on that.
 
If you have an original purchase receipt of the guitar then the least they should do is send you the proper pickup free of charge, and have you cover the labor to install it, to prove that they care about the quality of the product they are producing. They will not however due to the stature of limitation law which it has far exceeded. I think we have become obsessed with customer service, the wal-marts, targets, home depots of the world let people return items at most anytime without any consequence. That is just spoiling us and the customer is not always right when they are wrong.
 
The problem from a manufacture side is since the guitar is in the hands of the second owner, how are they to know that someone didnt somehow put in the wrong truss rod after the fact.

What are we talking about a 300 dollar guitar or a 3000 dollar guitar?

In a perfect world the manufacturer would say send the axe back and we will look at it. If indeed the wrong piece was installed then they would fix it. Now should they prorate this since so much time has transpired? Also the luthier might not know what he is talking about? Maybe he just couldnt fix the problem and blamed the manufacturer? Maybe he stuck your friend with some big repair bill. Most guitar techs Ive met wouldnt admit they were wrong about anything, they all seem to know it all when it comes to guitars otherwise why would we take our axe to them and not fix it themselves.

Im sure there is a lot more to this story than you are revealing. You probably only know your friends side. Most of the times there are 2 sides to a story and the truth lies somewhere inbetween.

Theres a lot of grey space in this story.
 
The warranty was void on that guitar as soon as the second owner bought it, and that's why they write warranties like they do.
 

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