How to use a Plexi?

[jab]

Been playing a Stiletto for a while now, and I hear so much about the god-like plexi tone. But when you play a 100W version for example with the volume past 9:00 it's simply too loud for the band. I believe it when people say you have to crank them for the great tone, but it's not practical. So for a classic-hard rock situation, how do you use these and how do they sound?

Seems most people recommend a Hot Plate but that stresses the amp. So, if you put a high quality pedal in front of a Plexi (like an Xotic AC or BB), is the resulting tone something so much better than if you just bought a high quality amp with a preamp section (think Stiletto or the like). Or is the Plexi type of "tone frame" (for lack of a better word) just something so much bigger and bolder that a pedal and Plexi can be far superior to an amp that does it all to start with.

I know these are all big time opinions I'm asking for, but that's what I want. I know I need to go out and hear it for myself, make my own judgement, blah blah blah. I'll do that but I'd like your opinions too and experience with these more single volume knob type of amps.

 

[stephen sawall]

First off the Hot Plate does not put any more stress on a amp. Turning up a amp puts more stress on it. It does not matter if it is plugged into a speaker or speaker/Hot Plate. It is the same.

Plexi amps do not have very much gain. The tite clean channel on the Stiletto is very close to it. Putting a pedal in front of the amp is not what the amp sounds like. That is what the pedal sounds like. Or something like that. The Plexi is about power amp distortion. This means volume. For me this means using a Hot Plate.

If you mess around with tite clean channel of the Stiletto that well get very, very close to the circuit/sounds of a Plexi. Turn the gain pretty high and turn the master above half. That well get you in the ball park.
As you can imagine this is "stupid loud".

As for what sounds best. That is only a point of view.
I would feel at home with any combination you asked about.

:mrgreen:

 

[Charlie]

I think the whole 'god like' tone people talk about in regards to non master volume amps is blown out of proportion. Don't get me wrong they sound great but I think part of it is that some people are just in love with being loud as fu#k. And let's face it that is just impractical in a modern band situation.

If you want to see what the whole non master volume thing is about I'd suggest trying out a Marshall JTM-45 (an original or a well made clone NOT the crappy pcb reissues). These run at 30 watts but still get pretty loud.. but manageable for a lot of situations. OR you could try one of the 18 watters.

Anyway I think a good master volume amp can sound great... just as good as a non master volume and you won't piss your band or the sound guy off. Yes, you can always get a hot plate but that changes the tone and feel so what's the point?

The Stiletto is an awesome amp and with the right tubes it can get VERY close to a lot of classic and modern Marshall tones. At least the Stage I... never heard or played a Stage II.

 

[dirtyroadie]

I just built a 100W Super Lead Plexi replica from metropoulos amps and am loving this thing. I bought a used 3 channel Triple Rec a couple of months ago and really thought it was the amp I wanted. I teched for a band back in the late 90's who used Dual Rec's and loved the high gain sound, but I got tired of the Triple Rec really quick. It just wasn't the sound I was looking for.
My first impressions of my Plexi are: this thing is loud, way too loud for bedroom volumes unless I use my Hot Plate, which is what I'm doing. Despite the volume, there are alot of subtleties right at your fingertips with this thing. I'm using a Tube Screamer for a boost and a Micro Amp before that, which I find I'm not needing.
Rolling down the volume on the guitar brings out a great clean tone with a bit of bite and rolling it back up the gain's right there. Old Van Halen sounds great through this thing as does Thin Lizzy, Led Zep, UFO, Aerosmith and all the other greats. Slayer doesn't sound so bad either, though if that's your style, a Plexi might not be the right amp.
I'm going to install an FX loop and Post Phase Inverter Master Volume to see if I like it. If not, it's a quick fix and I'll stick to the Hot Plate.
My two cents. Hope it helps.

 

[francm]

To start getting into power tube overdrive, you only need to crank up to 4 or more. A power attenuator is a good idea though.

 

[flieger67]

I just got a plexi myself recently from RJS Amplification (I'll post pics in another thread). My plexi is a 50-watt head and I'm running it through a closed-back 2x12 with UK-built Celestion Greenbacks. For reference, I also own a Stiletto Ace combo.

The plexi really does need to be wound up pretty good to get all of the sustain and crunch available because a good measure of the plexi tone is the power tubes distorting. Unless you are using an attenuator or some sort of a master volume setup (like a PPIMV), that means a LOT of volume. That's probably a good part of the reason that a lot of our older rock guitar heroes are a little hard of hearing...

To get a wound-up plexi tone at a low volume level, you've got really three options: an attenuator, a master volume setup of some sort or use a pedal with the amp's volume set much lower. Of course, using a combination of these methods is certainly a good approach, too. But there are drawbacks. Attenuators can not only alter tone and feel, they can react kind of funny when trying to absorb a lot of power, like trying to crank an amp up full and yet only put out whisper-level volume through a speaker cab. A poorly-done master volume can also alter tone and feel in a very big and bad way. And pedals can sometimes put their own sonic stamp on the sound and cover up the tone of the plexi that you are really seeking. For me, I'm using a Hotplate and currently a Tubescreamer (set for just a bit of boost and only a little dirt) when I need to use the -16 dB setting on the HP but I'm looking for a different pedal.

I would disagree that the Stiletto gets really close to a plexi, at least in my experience. The plexi reacts a lot differently to lower-output pickups and cleans up a lot more when you turn down the volume knob on the guitar. I think the Stiletto tends to have a more low-end girth than my plexi when using the high treble channel/channel 1. And I'm running STR 450's in my Stiletto, which made a noticeable improvement over the stock power tubes. The Stiletto is my favorite Boogie and it definitely sounds British-voiced to me but I don't think it's really that close to a true, non-master-volume plexi.

 

[stephen sawall]

I was talking about the series I Stiletto. They are a lot closer than a Mark or Dual Rectifier.... etc. In the ball park.
Congratulations on your new amp.

 

[goestoeleven]

I was talking about the series I Stiletto. They are a lot closer than a Mark or Dual Rectifier.... etc. In the ball park.
Congratulations on your new amp.

+1

I have a Stage One and Channel 1 Crunch gets me close to plexi. Still the best "plexi tone" takes volume...50 watt setting, Master dimed, channel volume controlled by Gain and guitar volume. Sounds great thru my Marshall 1960AHW can (Celestion Heritage G12H 30s). If I need to reduce dB's...I use a Keeely-modded TS-808 set with gain at 10 c'clock; level at 2 o'clock.

 

[KH Guitar Freak]

I think the whole 'god like' tone people talk about in regards to non master volume amps is blown out of proportion. Don't get me wrong they sound great but I think part of it is that some people are just in love with being loud as fu#k. And let's face it that is just impractical in a modern band situation.

If you want to see what the whole non master volume thing is about I'd suggest trying out a Marshall JTM-45 (an original or a well made clone NOT the crappy pcb reissues). These run at 30 watts but still get pretty loud.. but manageable for a lot of situations. OR you could try one of the 18 watters.

Anyway I think a good master volume amp can sound great... just as good as a non master volume and you won't piss your band or the sound guy off. Yes, you can always get a hot plate but that changes the tone and feel so what's the point?

The Stiletto is an awesome amp and with the right tubes it can get VERY close to a lot of classic and modern Marshall tones. At least the Stage I... never heard or played a Stage II.

I still remember that day where I had the volumes on the JTM45 at 8 at a music store. The people outside the store weren't impressed...

 

[stephen sawall]

Preamp distortion is very very compressed. Power amp distortion well give you a lot more dynamics. The amp response to your right hand gives you way more control. No preamp distortion well have the ROAR (envelope) of power amp distortion. You need a Hot Plate or some other devise to be able to use these amps like this for most situations.

Every tube ~ preamp and power amp tube has its own tone and distortion property's. If you do not taste these flavors you well never know what they taste like. You may like the flavor.

One is not better than the other ... it is just different.
Most of the time you use a blend of the two types of distortion (pre/power).

I do not think being loud is a real advantage in a lot of situations.
I tend to balance my volume with the drummer....