Express Output Transformer

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assat012

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Hi,

I purchased an Express 5 50 a couple of months back and am loving it. I do wonder however why the ouput transformer (not the choke) is so small compared to most other 50W valve amps. I've seen 25W amps with bigger transformers. It sounds great so makes no difference but just wondered given that most people say you need larger tranformers for good bottom end.

M
 
Not being an amp tech, all I imagine is that technology has improved. Bigger isn't necessarily better. Compact designs and better heat dissipation in the design probably. I like my 5:50 because it is lighter for the same power of other amps. The Fender Blues Jr weighs 40 lbs. and is 15 watts. The 5:50 is 40lbs. and over 50 watts. Don't you remember some big heat sinks on some of those heavy older amps?
 
The main ideas behind smaller transformers are:
1. Saturation - (stolen from another forum because I haven't had my coffee yet...) - Saturation is magnetic saturation of the transformer iron. Iron is a magnetism multiplier. When you apply a magnetic field to a piece of iron by wrapping it with a coil with some current flowing through it, the magnetic domains of the iron line up in the same direction as the applied field, and this creates an induced magnetic field that can be around 2000X the strength of the applied field. However, once all the magnetic domains are lined up in the direction of the applied field, the iron is saturated. You can increase the applied field, but you won't increase the induced field (well only slightly). The more iron you have in your transformer, the harder it is to saturate. The type of steel can have an effect too on when it saturates. When the transformer saturates, it acts like a compressor because it can't put out any more volume. It also adds distortion because certain frequencies saturate first.

2. Cost - If you are trying to make an amp or even a washing machine, you have to set a goal of what it cost you to manufacture vs. what you can sell it for. Nobody (almost nobody) is in business for very long without making money.
Soldano doesn't care about cost because they sell their amps for what they want and people buy them.
Mesa tries to keep the cost down to a reasonable level without compromising more than their values will let them.


As for size, the physical size really does matter in a couple of areas.
Number of windings and the amount of iron (as well as the number of laminations in that iron) make a huge difference on headroom.
Basically, the smaller the OT, the faster the amp will overdrive on a clean channel.
The larger the OT, the more clean headroom (less overdrive) you will get on a clean channel.
If you like the sound, then keep it stock. If you need the amp to be louder and cleaner, then a larger transformer such as a Heyboer or Mercury would really open the amp up.

I guess the easiest way to say it (sorry for the rambling):
Fender Princeton Reverb - almost magical distortion when you crank the amp, and very manageable volume levels - tiny output transformer
Fender Twin Reverb - almost no distortion when you crank the amp and the volume can bring down small planes in the immediate vicinity - HUGE output transformer!
 
Thanks for the explanations. I was just curious as i'm more than happy with the tone i'm getting so not considering changing anything. No problems with loud cleans either!

M
 
Yeah, I'm constantly amazed by the mod guys who buy a classic Princeton Reverb, whose chief attraction is its distortion at low volume, and immediately replace the output tranny with a larger one in order to gain more clean headroom. Um, uh....

Bob
 
:lol: Only reason I can see to do it on the Princeton is to save the original if it's a blackface.
You could easily replace it with a Heyboer for under $60 and keep the original one just in case you get bored and sell it.


The only reason I've been thinking about changing the OT on my Express 5:25 is to add more clean headroom. It's plenty loud enough to use with the band, but the cleans really suffer (blossom, depending on what type of cleans you're looking for) at band volume.
 
That's another reason I chose the 5:50 over the 5:25 is the clean headroom. I play several oldies songs and, like the early Beatles, everything was clean.
 
Hi,

just read somthing today about the 5:50 o/p transformer. Someone was suggesting to steer clear of the 5:50 as the size of the o/p transformer was bound to make it prone to failure as it was dramatically undersized for a 50W amp.

Just wondered if anyone had experienced any failures.
 
5:25 also has very small, undersized trafos...but I doubt it will fail because mesa trafos are extra quality and can handle all kinds of overloads...they are hi spec so you don't have to worry...

the only bad thing is that the size of the trafos has it's impact on the sound...
 
I haven't heard of any output transformer failures on 5:50s.
 

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