Express 5:50 ... metal?

[microwerx]

I think that some amplifiers sound very different depending on the output tubes and others don't. Dual Rectifiers sound pretty close, but the Express series really does have a different sound. I guess with the EL84 tubes they sound muddy to me. My wife didn't like the 5:25, but when she heard the 5:50, she bought it for me the same day! I personally think it comes down to the type of tube. I think I just don't like EL84 tubes.

I think the differences come down to the midrange nature of the amplifier. Clean headroom is also important. The EL84 tubes really don't have clean headroom on the Express, it sounds muddy to me. But the 6L6's really have a clean, clear bubbly sound to them which I think I like more. The great thing about the 5:50 is that you can still do 5 watts yet retain an American sound.

Actually, I did want to revise my personal suggest for boosting the amp. I think there's a decent amount of chug to the amp by itself. If I was augmenting the amp, I would choose a good noise-gate, compressor, and EQ. I like the tube screamer because it can make a good boost into the amp, but it can start to feel muddy to me. A compressor on the other handy will help boost the sustain and you can do a clean boost for your guitar. I much prefer clean boosts because I still like hearing the clarity of the preamp with my guitar. I figure that the high gain sound has been carefully tuned to ensure that the overdrive is smooth and transparent. It's tricky to tune in distortion pedals.

And the contour control is good for getting a mid-scooped sound, but I think having an EQ that you can really cut the mids out is essential for getting thrash metal tones.

 

[microwerx]

I think that some amplifiers sound very different depending on the output tubes and others don't. Dual Rectifiers sound pretty close, but the Express series really does have a different sound. I guess with the EL84 tubes they sound muddy to me. My wife didn't like the 5:25, but when she heard the 5:50, she bought it for me the same day! I personally think it comes down to the type of tube. I think I just don't like EL84 tubes.

I think the differences come down to the midrange nature of the amplifier. Clean headroom is also important. The EL84 tubes really don't have clean headroom on the Express, it sounds muddy to me. But the 6L6's really have a clean, clear bubbly sound to them which I think I like more. The great thing about the 5:50 is that you can still do 5 watts yet retain an American sound.

Actually, I did want to revise my personal suggest for boosting the amp. I think there's a decent amount of chug to the amp by itself. If I was augmenting the amp, I would choose a good noise-gate, compressor, and EQ. I like the tube screamer because it can make a good boost into the amp, but it can start to feel muddy to me. A compressor on the other handy will help boost the sustain and you can do a clean boost for your guitar. I much prefer clean boosts because I still like hearing the clarity of the preamp with my guitar. I figure that the high gain sound has been carefully tuned to ensure that the overdrive is smooth and transparent. It's tricky to tune in distortion pedals.

And the contour control is good for getting a mid-scooped sound, but I think having an EQ that you can really cut the mids out is essential for getting thrash metal tones.

 

[soundchaser59]

My wife didn't like the 5:25, but when she heard the 5:50, she bought it for me the same day!

I want a wife like that..... :mrgreen:


Now that I think about it, I dont recall hearing about anyone who is heavily into distortion who also likes EL84's. I think distortion of any kind sounds like crap on my 5.25, and I'm sure it has a lot to do with the EL84 tube family being generally under qualified to handle real full bodied distortion.

 

[ifailedshapes]

I don't think it's the fact that EL84 distortion isn't pleasing to the ears; I think it just depends on the ears doing the listening. I, personally, really like the tones I get out of my 5:25. I also think a lot has to do with the style of music that you enjoy listening to. For example, I hate listening to metal. I like alternative and rock, and while those are my favorite styles of songwriting, my favorite guitar tones are actually found in country songs (with the exception of the really twangy Tele clean - I hate that.)

Can my 5:25 do metal? Heck no, it can't do metal (in my opinion), but I don't want it to! I want a solid amp with a nice, distinct tone that will find it's own, unique place in the mix. The 5:25 does that for me. Play a Strat through channel 2 Burn with an old tape delay in the effects loop and it's perfect!

Personally, I'm done with this topic. I think we've successfully worn it out, but I think people who read all of these posts in the future - especially people who are doing research before making a purchase - will learn a great deal.

Conclusion: If you're into metal and have your heart set on a new amp, buy a Mark V. If you don't have the cash for the Mark, get an Express 5:50 with a good boost/OD pedal to kick the preamp in the nuts. And by all means avoid the 5:25!

 

[Newysurfer]

I agree that a 5:25 combo vs a 5:50 combo sound a lot different. I would argue that if you played them both through the same cabinet, they would start to sound a lot more similar.

Yep - agree with you there for sure.

I also really like EL84 tube amp distortion.
There's been lot's of classic EL84 distortion tones and I've owned a few Marshal JCM's myself.
I just prefer the American flavoured 6L6 amps for cleans and OD is all.
On distortion I think EL84's and 6L6's tones are both equally great.
Just depends what flavour you're in the mood for. :mrgreen:

 

[ifailedshapes]

I also really like EL84 tube amp distortion.
There's been lot's of classic EL84 distortion tones and I've owned a few Marshal JCM's myself.
I just prefer the American flavoured 6L6 amps for cleans and OD is all.
On distortion I think EL84's and 6L6's tones are both equally great.
Just depends what flavour you're in the mood for. :mrgreen:

Ok, so I said I was done, but maybe I'm just done with talking about metal! :lol: That's what I love about the 5:25 - the cleans don't sound thin! That and the fact that the 10" combo is so portable are what sold me in the beginning.

EDIT: When I hear EL84 I immediately think Vox, and while many people herald Vox cleans as their benchmark, they've always sounded very thin and trebly to me. I much prefer the warmer, fuller Fender style cleans that a 6L6 power section provides. I was pleasantly surprised that they did such a great job of voicing the clean channel on the 5:25 to sound very Fenderesque (yeah, it's a word now.)

Also, I'm a bit of a gear snob, and I wanted something light and portable to use as a practice amp. Go ahead and flame me for getting a Boogie as my practice amp, but I know what I like! For the style of music I play, this Express is perfect. The only other amp I want is... another Express, just the 5:50 this time!

I used to be a HUGE Lone Star fan, but I've gotta admit that I am digging the tones out of the Express series. And when you compare the cost-to-tone ratio, the Express is a far superior value. Not to mention that there is a tremendous difference in weight, and since I don't have any roadies (yet) ease of transportation is a major factor!

 

[Newysurfer]

I also really like EL84 tube amp distortion.
There's been lot's of classic EL84 distortion tones and I've owned a few Marshal JCM's myself.
I just prefer the American flavoured 6L6 amps for cleans and OD is all.
On distortion I think EL84's and 6L6's tones are both equally great.
Just depends what flavour you're in the mood for. :mrgreen:

Ok, so I said I was done, but maybe I'm just done with talking about metal! :lol: That's what I love about the 5:25 - the cleans don't sound thin! That and the fact that the 10" combo is so portable are what sold me in the beginning.

EDIT: When I hear EL84 I immediately think Vox, and while many people herald Vox cleans as their benchmark, they've always sounded very thin and trebly to me. I much prefer the warmer, fuller Fender style cleans that a 6L6 power section provides. I was pleasantly surprised that they did such a great job of voicing the clean channel on the 5:25 to sound very Fenderesque (yeah, it's a word now.)

Also, I'm a bit of a gear snob, and I wanted something light and portable to use as a practice amp. Go ahead and flame me for getting a Boogie as my practice amp, but I know what I like! For the style of music I play, this Express is perfect. The only other amp I want is... another Express, just the 5:50 this time!

I used to be a HUGE Lone Star fan, but I've gotta admit that I am digging the tones out of the Express series. And when you compare the cost-to-tone ratio, the Express is a far superior value. Not to mention that there is a tremendous difference in weight, and since I don't have any roadies (yet) ease of transportation is a major factor!

+1 totally agree
For what you want the 5:25 is by far the best amp available IMO.
I have an Egnater Rebel 20 too which is my practice & small gig amp.
At $US600 it's fabulous value too but the 5:25 has superior tone right thru the range, plus is 2 channel and has tube reverb.
The new Egnater Rebel 30 is very comparable on features to the 5:25 combo but the Mesa still sounds better and is lighter.

 

[ifailedshapes]

It's funny that you mention Egnater. They are the only amp manufacturer other than Mesa/Boogie that has my attention. As Bruce Egnater becomes a more common name, I think we will see his prices go up respectively. That man is a true visionary when it comes to amp design.

 

[Heritage Softail]

Egnater has a great oversized 2x12 cab. I am playing my MKV thru one. On the metal tone issue though, I like a roadster tone. That is not really in the MKV to my ears. I am thinking about a BBE pedal to get there. Any ideas? A Tube Screamer? I am not much into effects, only have the green analog delay MXR and a Vox wah, well a chorus I don't use. Playing thru passive double coils, variety of guitars.

 

[shredmaestrobri]

Run a Wampler Triple Wreck distortion pedal through the Express. It may just save you lots of $$$.