Enlighten me -- why the ED over the MKV? Roadster Owner...

[JOEY B.]

It totally depends on the music of course, but I think, overall, I like an amp that allows your playing dynamics and technique to show. This is how I felt playing a cranked Marshall 1987x -- great crunch and gain, but the lack of a clean channel kind of killed it for me.

The Electradyne is extremely dynamic and will show off your technique(good or bad) for sure. The higher voicing of the Mark V makes it easier to play leads, but the low end grunt and clarity of the Electradyne really cuts as a rhythm amp. With a mild OD pedal out front, the ED can get some smokin' lead tones going, but still has a different feel than the Mark series. If you like cranked Marshall tones, try the ED with EL-34 power tubes. At about 10:00 on the master volume in the 45 watt setting, the blue channel with EL-34's will plaster a smile on your face. 8)

 

[BostonRedSox]

If you're having trouble being swallowed up by the other guitarist you two need to work out your tones better. If one is going high mids the other should go low mids. If one is really scooped and wide the other should be narrow and focused.

Since you're using a Recto you're scooped and wide by default. If he's narrow and focused, he's going to cut through you like butter. If he's the lead and you're the rhythm player, then this is great. If you're the lead and he's the rhythm then you two need to talk.

If it's a simple clashing of mid frequencies... ie, you're both trying to occupy the low mids, then try boosting your Recto with a Tubescreamer. This will thin your tone and give you some more upper mid emphasis. Alternatively, bringing your bass knob down will also increase your midrange emphasis.

The thing about a Recto in a live band is that sometimes you need to make it sound bad to make it sound good. IE, you need to dial in tones that on their own might sound harsh, honkey, fizzy, bright, dull, etc... but in a full band mix it fits in and sits nice. The same is true for the other player.

Trust me, my first response to this issue (which I've had for a year now, with many recordings from our shows to detail my efforts) isn't, "I need to buy another amp!" I am not going to lose money on the Roadster by selling it. I have definitely tried setting the amp up differently as well. In the end, the real estate we share really is too similar -- his Victoria and my Roadster. I have talked to Mesa too. Their suggestions were great, but pretty much everything I already knew -- which was use the MIDS to try to become more present in "the mix," and only use the TREBLE and PRESENCE to fine tune you tone. Those are things I've known and tried. This is a case where I think we both need more distinction. I've contemplated going with a parametric equalization pedal, but I think I would like to own another amp of a higher voicing to take care of these issues.

I am just not entirely sure I want to go as bright sounding as say a Stiletto. Maybe one of the newer Vox handwireds though -- those are great, even if they are made in China, and seemingly overpriced.

 

[danyeo1]

It totally depends on the music of course, but I think, overall, I like an amp that allows your playing dynamics and technique to show. This is how I felt playing a cranked Marshall 1987x -- great crunch and gain, but the lack of a clean channel kind of killed it for me.

The Electradyne is extremely dynamic and will show off your technique(good or bad) for sure. The higher voicing of the Mark V makes it easier to play leads, but the low end grunt and clarity of the Electradyne really cuts as a rhythm amp. With a mild OD pedal out front, the ED can get some smokin' lead tones going, but still has a different feel than the Mark series. If you like cranked Marshall tones, try the ED with EL-34 power tubes. At about 10:00 on the master volume in the 45 watt setting, the blue channel with EL-34's will plaster a smile on your face. 8)

10:00 on the master even in 45 watt mode will make you go deaf. :lol: But yes, that's where the amp really kicks ***.

 

[screamingdaisy]

Trust me, my first response to this issue (which I've had for a year now, with many recordings from our shows to detail my efforts) isn't, "I need to buy another amp!" I am not going to lose money on the Roadster by selling it. I have definitely tried setting the amp up differently as well. In the end, the real estate we share really is too similar -- his Victoria and my Roadster. I have talked to Mesa too. Their suggestions were great, but pretty much everything I already knew -- which was use the MIDS to try to become more present in "the mix," and only use the TREBLE and PRESENCE to fine tune you tone. Those are things I've known and tried. This is a case where I think we both need more distinction. I've contemplated going with a parametric equalization pedal, but I think I would like to own another amp of a higher voicing to take care of these issues.

What you're saying hits the nail on the head over why I've owned both Marks and Rectos for awhile. I hate getting buried to the point where I can't even hear what I'm playing, and I've found that a lot of guitarists only have one good amp and they're usually pretty attached to it, so I've found it's easier for everyone if I have the option of adjusting my voice to suit who I'm playing with.

It seems as though you're mulling over a fair number of options in your head. If you can, I'd try borrowing/renting some of those options to see how they work out within the context of your band. Even a cheap Fender, Vox or Marshall can give you a good general indication before you spring for some of the high value options you're looking at.

 

[JOEY B.]

10:00 on the master even in 45 watt mode will make you go deaf. :lol: But yes, that's where the amp really kicks ***.

"I cannot tell a lie." 8) :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[BostonRedSox]

Joey B and Screaming Daisy:

Awesome suggestions everyone. I am thinking of going ED at the moment, and for more reasons than I previously listed. It really would be nice to have an amp that just sounds great with low gain, yet still retains a lot of bass. From the clips I've heard on netmusicians.org, and some on YouTube by Mesa and MusicRadar, the ED really has some low-end grunt to it. I just don't have the opportunity to play an ED where I live.

I am scheduled to fly out of Hawaii tomorrow. When I get back to the mainland, I am going to intensify my search. Thanks for the suggestions -- they really helped. I'll keep you posted.

Screaming: It sounds like a good idea to have two opposing voiced amps for reasons you listed exactly. I cannot get rid of my Roadster, although in the past I've definitely contemplated it. Now I've saved up and am probably going to just get a higher voiced amp to help me further in my future endeavors. What you wrote is very, very true -- at least for my circumstances.

Any past time with the Orange AD50? That amp looks killer too, and higher voiced.

 

[screamingdaisy]

Any past time with the Orange AD50? That amp looks killer too, and higher voiced.

I've owned an AD30 and AD140, but never an AD50. In a lot of ways modern Orange are like a darker Marshall. An AD series amp is kind of Plexi-ish with a post phase inverter master volume (PPIMV). On the twin channel ADs both channels are the same, except that channel 1 is dark and channel 2 is bright. The AD50 is single channel and I don't know if it has the dark or bright voice? Or maybe it has something in between?

If the AD50 has the bright channel then it might be an option. If it has the dark one you'll be in the same boat you're in now.

Also, since EQ is important to your situation... one of the really limiting points of an Orange is it's EQ. Basically, it does nothing. Yes, it will let you adjust the treble, mids and bass, but in a very limited fashion. The voice of the amp is basically set from the factory and you get limited range to tweak before it sounds bad. There is also no presence control, so no way to control the upper end cut since the treble knob simply adds harshness as it's turned up. Long story short, the amp's are one or two trick ponies... but it's a very nice trick.

Further (I don't know if this is important to you), AD series amps have no effects loop. It's a limitation of the PPIMV design that you can't (or at least shouldn't) put an effects loop after the master volume because the signal has already been split into separate phases.

That said, as a former Orange user the first thing that popped into my mind when using the ED was that it had a very Orange like vibe to me, but I've only ever used an ED once so take that for what it's worth.

 

[BostonRedSox]

Thanks Screaming.

Yeah, having an Orange Tiny Terror has made me love Orange's take on distortion -- gritty and grainy.

Orange's definitely seem overpriced to me as well. They can't even include footswitches or manuals as standard? Anyways, I doubt I'll go Orange for exactly the reasons you mentioned. No effects loop is a killer, and the Orange's with loops have terrible loops employed. I guess the newer Rockerverb MK2 is supposed to alleviate that issue, and the useless reverb issues, but I am not sold on their reliability quite yet.

 

[YellowJacket]

Joey B and Screaming Daisy:

Awesome suggestions everyone. I am thinking of going ED at the moment, and for more reasons than I previously listed. It really would be nice to have an amp that just sounds great with low gain, yet still retains a lot of bass. From the clips I've heard on netmusicians.org, and some on YouTube by Mesa and MusicRadar, the ED really has some low-end grunt to it. I just don't have the opportunity to play an ED where I live.

We just demo'd an Electra Dyne COMBO for 2 hours or so today with a few popular guitars. I tried a Roadster earlier today and the Electra Dyne is simply better for what I do. The clean is phenomenal and the two brit modes (low and high) are great for crunch rhythm and solos respectively. Any clip you hear does not do this amp justice. It is definitely a good mesa and travels many styles within the tones it has to offer. In my opinion, it is pretty much the perfect gigging amp, if just for the insane horsepower. The tone also sounds great at "low" volumes which are still loud! You'd be surprised how much jam this thing has! Buy this for your band, not your bedroom!

 

[JOEY B.]

Through my Genz-Benz 2x12 (Stereo with non connecting grounds), I just did a Mark II/Electradyne mix. 15 watts on the C+ (Lead channel, no GEQ) with 6CA7's and 45 watts on the (blue channel) ED with SED EL-34's. They blend so well with the goldtop LP. Each amp gives the other what it is lacking in its stock form. 8) The clarity of gain from these two amps combined is the magic touch. No super-scooped GEQ on the Mark series, PLEASE. :evil:

 

[dank]

I'll chime in here, as I own both amps: Mark V 1x12 combo and an Electra Dyne 2x12 combo. It really depends upon what you want to get out of the amp. They both have wonderful clean tones. The Mark V has it over the ED interms of distortions-there's simply more variety and versatility due to the three switchable channels.

In my opinion, they are are both easy to dial in world class tones. As another forumite said, you can't give a good opinion on an amp based upon a demo in a music store. You have to take it home, fiddle a bit, try the settings in a rehearsal and give it a go at a show. Spend time with either amp, and you'll find they're not complex at all. I play classic rock, and both amps work well in that regard. I would suggest that if metal is your thing, you'll want to throw a couple of pedals in front of the ED. I ahve a rather large pedalboard that goes into the front of the amp; no issues.

The only thing I wanted was to be able to turn up the Master Volume on the amps to get a richer sound. I can now do that with the Aracom Attenuator I just received. The Aracom is a great addition to both amplifiers.

 

[SST]

I just returned my electra dyne. I found out mainly it was too heavy and too loud for my tastes. Also I have a Mark V, which to some degree I'm struggling with to really dial in, but the Mark V takes pedal SO much better than the electra dyne. Any type of OD pedal I used sounded really thin and fizzy with the electradyne (OCD, DSL, Crunchbox and Tim). Also though the clean were really nice and chimey they sounded more like a Vox than a fender too me and I couldn't get anything approximating a country twang or R&B type of clean with it despite what the manual said. And the bass was a bit overwhelming to me too.

The Lo gain and High Gain channels were really nice and I think if Mesa could somehow replace the crunch and edge channel on channel two of the Mark V with the low gain and high channels of the electra dyne, the Mark V would for many be the ultimate unbeatable amp.

 

[ifailedshapes]

I just returned my electra dyne. I found out mainly it was too heavy and too loud for my tastes. Also I have a Mark V, which to some degree I'm struggling with to really dial in, but the Mark V takes pedal SO much better than the electra dyne. Any type of OD pedal I used sounded really thin and fizzy with the electradyne (OCD, DSL, Crunchbox and Tim). Also though the clean were really nice and chimey they sounded more like a Vox than a fender too me and I couldn't get anything approximating a country twang or R&B type of clean with it despite what the manual said. And the bass was a bit overwhelming to me too.

The Lo gain and High Gain channels were really nice and I think if Mesa could somehow replace the crunch and edge channel on channel two of the Mark V with the low gain and high channels of the electra dyne, the Mark V would for many be the ultimate unbeatable amp.

The more I read quotes like these, the happier I am with my Express and the less GAS I have. My little amp sounds good at low and high volumes, and it's very pedal friendly when it comes time for sounds not inherently found within.

 

[J.J]

I just returned my electra dyne. I found out mainly it was too heavy and too loud for my tastes. Also I have a Mark V, which to some degree I'm struggling with to really dial in, but the Mark V takes pedal SO much better than the electra dyne. Any type of OD pedal I used sounded really thin and fizzy with the electradyne (OCD, DSL, Crunchbox and Tim). Also though the clean were really nice and chimey they sounded more like a Vox than a fender too me and I couldn't get anything approximating a country twang or R&B type of clean with it despite what the manual said. And the bass was a bit overwhelming to me too.

The Lo gain and High Gain channels were really nice and I think if Mesa could somehow replace the crunch and edge channel on channel two of the Mark V with the low gain and high channels of the electra dyne, the Mark V would for many be the ultimate unbeatable amp.

I fullt aggree about weight, that they work better with volume and the bass needing taming, but am surprised that you couldn't get your pedals to work, or country and R&B tones. The only OD I have that you mentioned it the OCD and I love it with the ED. I guess it shows how differently we all hear things and how differnt our tastes are.

I'm right with you about getting a MKV and giving it the ED vintage gain tone. If I could make a custom Mesa it would be a MKV with channel 1 and 2 as they are, and the ED vintage gain for channel 3.

 

[primal]

The more I read quotes like these, the happier I am with my Express and the less GAS I have. My little amp sounds good at low and high volumes, and it's very pedal friendly when it comes time for sounds not inherently found within.

I think the problem with the ED at low volumes is simply the 90 watt speaker. You gotta give it alteast some gas to get it moving. I notice at low volumes it sounds better going through my recto 1x12 with the vintage 30.

That said for me it sounds better then any other Mesa combo for the sounds I am looking for.

And this is the first I have read of anyone saying the ED does not take pedals well.

 

[dank]

As I said earlier, I have a huge pedalboard going into the front of the ED, and it sounds great. I also used it with the Aracom Attentuator last week. Even better!

 

[gonzald1]

I haven't tried ED but what I can say tho based with my own experience using my Roadster is that if you want:

1. Thickness in tone, crank the Master volume higher than the channel you are on.
2. If you want a cleaner tone on channel 1, then use a passive pickup I like using my strat. Set it to tweed.
3. If you want metal with thickness then use channel 4, crank the desired channel volume but lay off on the master. Use active pickups, I like both the seymour duncan blackout and the emg 89/60, 81/85 or 60/85. I like using Diode and Bold in this area.
4. If you want tighter bottom then use 6L6 power tubes vice versa use EL34 if you want loose or not so much bottom.


Again, this is my opinion. Regardless if you choose Mesa gear you have to familiarize with your amp. It takes days sometimes weeks before you can actually set your own tone.

 

[satch4u3]

I went from a ED to a Mark V. Here's my expereince with both:

For me the ED wasn't practical in a band situation. For me the ED had to be way to loud to get that sweet spot. But it's sweet spot was very nice. There is much more bass in an ED for sure. But again in a band situation my bass player has that frequency covered. The Mark V is mid focused and sits in a mix nicely. Especially in a cover band situation. So much variation and control over your volume and tone. Sure the Mark V does have it's issues just like any other amp but it rocks my socks every time I turn it on.