endless droll for a cry for a MK II C+ reissue.

[gts]

Well said Chip!

 

[chipaudette]

Thanks, George.

It's funny. After writing about my FrankenFender (and kinda badmouthing it), I fired it up again this morning. Since my failed IIC+ experiments on it, I ended up using my ears to guide my circuit fun. I cut way back on the gain ad pulled more bass out of the early part of the circuit. Firing it up this morning with my cheap strat, she sounded so fun! Loose, warm, spongy, and funky. Nothing like my IIC+, but it sounded good. Like a Fender (which it is) plus a little something extra. She's definitely gonna be getting some more play.

So, to anyone who wants to clone a IIC+, I'm not trying to poo-poo on your dreams. The joy of amp experimentation, and exploration, and smelling the solder are all pretty awesome. I'd offer to you, though, to not get your heart set on the IIC+ sound. Build your amp the way you want (like a IIC+ or not) and then, once it starts to speak, let your ears tell you where to take it from there. You'll likely find something that works for you even better.

 

[Mark Fore]

Randall Smith was overheard when asked about reissuing the IIC+, "I wish people would move on."

+1000 for the James Hetfield Signature Mark IIC+ with Half-Back 4x12 EVM loaded cab!

 

[zodiac272]

Randall Smith was overheard when asked about reissuing the IIC+, "I wish people would move on."

+1000 for the James Hetfield Signature Mark IIC+ with Half-Back 4x12 EVM loaded cab!

I can believe RCS saying that... He always seems to be about the future and forging on with new gear. I mean look how fast they stopped the C+ and started the mark III... the first trimodal amp... then a touch of backpedalling with all the stripes, like blue and red, then forward again with the green stripe which pretty much became the mark IV.

how about a JH IIC+ with built in chorus! hahaha

NOT!


Scott

 

[JOEY B.]

Randall Smith was overheard when asked about reissuing the IIC+, "I wish people would move on."

+1000 for the James Hetfield Signature Mark IIC+ with Half-Back 4x12 EVM loaded cab!

I can believe RCS saying that... He always seems to be about the future and forging on with new gear. I mean look how fast they stopped the C+ and started the mark III... the first trimodal amp... then a touch of backpedalling with all the stripes, like blue and red, then forward again with the green stripe which pretty much became the mark IV.

how about a JH IIC+ with built in chorus! hahaha

NOT!


Scott

Forward thinking is great, and I respect him for doing so. Then the marketing machine comes along and names three of the nine modes of the Mark V after previous models. It's all about business, and I understand. I truly can't stand the thought of MESA making a "signature" amp of any flavor. I hope they're above doing a "sell out" move like that, as I would quickly lose respect for their idealology. There are already too many of the musical instrument companies that have jumped on this "exploitation" bandwagon, it's all smoke and mirrors. :evil:

 

[zodiac272]

i can't imagine mesa ever making a "sig" amp. mesa just seems to attach artists to their different lines of amps... like hey, you wanna approximate andy timmons? get a stiletto or lone star... john petrucci? get a mark V or maybe even a road king from when he used those. Hetfield? get a triple recto or whatever recto ... triaxis/2:90, or mark V...

 

[boogiemon]

i predict that the next "lunch-box" amp from mesa (after the TA-15 & mini-recto) will be a Mark-ish re-issue w/a "+" mode. Not that it'll sound like a C+, but it'll sell well for a while anyway.

...we'll see.

 

[revgsmall]

i predict that the next "lunch-box" amp from mesa (after the TA-15 & mini-recto) will be a Mark-ish re-issue w/a "+" mode. Not that it'll sound like a C+, but it'll sell well for a while anyway.

...we'll see.

Shall we call it the Mark IIC+ Mini Me....? :wink:

 

[chipaudette]

Regarding the Mark IIC+ Mini-Me, if they'd switch their lunchboxes from EL84 to 6V6, I think that they'd have something. It wouldn't sound like a IIC+ for metal rhythm, but the 6V6s would make for possibly the creamiest lead tone ever heard.

I couldn't make it sound good in my amp (IIC+ pre-amp with 6V6 power section) but that's because I'm an amateur. The opportunity is there. Mesa could do it.

This thread just totally changed for me. I had thought that it was just a fun abstract discussion. Now I've got GAS. GAS for a product that doesn't exist and probably never will. Mark-style, high-gain lunchbox 6V6. Tasty!

Chip

 

[dodger916]

Regarding the Mark IIC+ Mini-Me, if they'd switch their lunchboxes from EL84 to 6V6, I think that they'd have something. It wouldn't sound like a IIC+ for metal rhythm, but the 6V6s would make for possibly the creamiest lead tone ever heard.

I couldn't make it sound good in my amp (IIC+ pre-amp with 6V6 power section) but that's because I'm an amateur. The opportunity is there. Mesa could do it.

This thread just totally changed for me. I had thought that it was just a fun abstract discussion. Now I've got GAS. GAS for a product that doesn't exist and probably never will. Mark-style, high-gain lunchbox 6V6. Tasty!

Chip

Well, you could always load a Mark IV with 6V6s. Not luchbox, but...

 

[chipaudette]

I've never played a Mark IV, let alone one with 6V6s. I'm very intrigued.

In my imagination, however, I get stuck on the issue that the Mark IV is a beast that was designed as a 90W amp...not an amp designed as a ~20W amp, like a 2 x 6V6 lunchbox would be. There's a huge difference there. The whole build approach of the amp becomes different when you're dealing with smaller power. The power transformer becomes smaller the output transformer becomes smaller and the speaker becomes less beefy. All of these things affect the sound.

In truth, the whole Mark-series aesthetic grew from the original Mark I, which was a smaller Fender amp that was beefed up. Randall put in a more powerful power amp along with huge transformers that wouldn't saturate as easily as the (deliberately) undersized ones that came with the original Fender design. Oh, and he switched out the lower-power speaker for a big, heavy high-powered one to handle all that power. Taken together, it was all that new-found headroom provided by Randall's upgrade that gave the new amp its distinctive sound.

Then he started cascading the pre-amp. That gave the Mesa the other part of its distinctive sound. The cascaded pre-amp probably became *the* distinctive part of the sound, but the beefed-up power amp and beefed-up transformers and heavy-duty speakers were all still there making their important contributions.

So, I'm intrigued by the heresy of stripping away some of that Mark history. It could be a terrible thing, but I want to hear the pre-amp that defined the liquid solo tone paired with the spongy juice of a pair of 6V6s under a bit of strain. It would most definitely not be a IIC+ (which, for you 105PT hounds out there...sponginess is not a good thing), but it could be a Mark flavor that really works for some people.

My imaginary problem with the 6V6-enabled Mark IV is that the Mark IV still a lot of iron and beef. Sure, you might get the 6V6's cooking nice and hot at loud volumes, but you'll never hear the contribution of a sagging power transformer or saturating output transformer because they're just too over-sized in the Mark IV for the 6V6s. IMHO, to get the 6V6 vibe that I'm talking about, you really need to scale down the whole amp. That's the appeal of the lunchbox...the whole amp can be scaled for a nice and tidy 2x6V6 plays-like-butter, voluptuous-lover-with-2-bottles-of-wine, tone machine.

And maybe I'd be able to lift such an amp as well.

Chip

 

[boogiemon]

one could also take the pre-amp signal from the effects loop or direct out of a c+ & pipe it into the power section of say, a blue angel...

 

[MrMarkIII]

+1 on the need for a Mesa 6V6 amp.
I've played a Mark IV with 6V6s, and while it was still Boogie-licious, it wasn't a huge, life-changing, transformative event.
Just a bit smaller, less head-roomy, a tad spongier. You must run four 6V6s in Tweed mode, which accounts for a great deal of the sound, I'm sure.
It's not a Deluxe sound, tweed or blackface. It's still a Mark IV.

 

[dodger916]

+1 on the need for a Mesa 6V6 amp.
I've played a Mark IV with 6V6s, and while it was still Boogie-licious, it wasn't a huge, life-changing, transformative event.
Just a bit smaller, less head-roomy, a tad spongier. You must run four 6V6s in Tweed mode, which accounts for a great deal of the sound, I'm sure.
It's not a Deluxe sound, tweed or blackface. It's still a Mark IV.

Yeah, I tried it too and wasn't crazy about it, but there have been others who loved it.

 

[MesaGod666]

I propose that Randall Smith reissues the IIC+, however, the new IIC+ would have to break the time/space continuem to transport the user back into January 1985 in order for it to be the real deal.

I would buy the **** thing so long as Randall's version of the flux capacitor includes Mr. Fusion...cuz...you've gotta respect the environment.

Otherwise, I'll just keep hoarding as many Mark V amps that I can get my hands on.

 

[user 19640]

Yes! As mentioned in another forum:
:wink:

Mark V Coliseum w/ old school Simul-Class.

Yeah right on!
Btw: I had a dream...

Would be cool if it came true. A great idea I think! 8)

Two channel head.
With classic clean tone from the Quad Rythm 1 ch, (sounds almost like a piano). And of course the IIC+ lead channel. :mrgreen:

I wish..

 

[JOEY B.]

If they brought back the "build to order" C+ reissue, complete with all the options, how many would they sell? The prices would probably start at $2500 for a stripped down 60 watter, and end at $5000 for a Simul-Coli. 100% down payment at the time of order, nothing else ever to pay! :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[GIG4FUN]

Schumacher is still in business, though they are no longer Woodward-Schumacher I think (EIA code 606 as part numbers have been). I've seen some big lists of new parts with the 606 codes, but I can't recall if the new ones have them. But as far as I know they still make custom linear power transformers and are in business as Schumacher Electric. Mesa just switched brands during Mark IV production...

My New Blonde Fender Supersonic Twin has Shumacher transformers in it...