Anybody get the TC-100 yet?

[Pongo]

I think this is more a function of the speakers than the amp.

Interesting! Would not have guessed that... will run through a Type A tonight and see if it makes any difference!

Through Vintage 30s, reducing gain stiffens the amp until it starts to feel a little dead. I think the V30s are a little too clean/tight for lower gain settings and (IMO) excel with the gain turned up (or the gain turned down and the volume cranked, but either way the amp is providing the majority of the breakup). This "issue" isn't exclusive to the TC... I've had it with every Mesa I've owned through Mesa V30s. I think they're outstanding for high gain, but I also think it's why they never quite nail the low/mid gain sounds some people are looking for.

Hahah... yeah, I've got strong feelings on Vintage 30s, myself. They're one of the easiest ways to be heard in your band, but to my ears, words and phrases like "dry," "harsh," or "box of angry hornets" come to mind. Sure, it's possible to get a good sound out of them, and tons of players have (especially metal specialists), but they're just too much work for me.

I'm currently playing through two Boogie Compact 1x12” Thiele Cabinets w/ C90s until I get a suitable 2x12"/4x12" replacement. It's a warm, even, and full-sounding setup, but as you might expect, not a ton of personality ("jack of all trades, master of none").

Like you, I love the sound of Greenbacks (both the 25 and 30 versions), but have heard too many horror stories of blown speakers. That's an expensive "Oops!" At 100 watts coupled with boosting effects, I'd be nervous using them in anything less than a 4x12"... and as cool as that would sound, that's not something I wanna be carting around! The Neo Creambacks seem to have the better qualities of both m-65 and h-75 Creambacks, and would easily work in a 2x12" context, but have only heard them in YouTube videos up to this point.

 

[bandit2013]

I recently coupled a Cream 90W alnico with a Creamback H75 in my RA100 combo. Now that sounds amazing and much different than I expected. Better than two 90W cream alnicos or two Creambacks (which is what I had before installing the two 90W'ers). I will have to channel the TC-100 though that and see how I like it. Was considering swapping out the speakers in the Horizontal 212 to see how it sounds in a closed back format. Not sure I would do that off the bat if the one cabinet is all you got (unless you really hate the V30 speaker).

 

[Pongo]

I will have to channel the TC-100 though that and see how I like it.

YES!

No joke, I was minutes away from ordering a horizontal rectifier cab w/ Creamback 7H5 and Alnico Cream the other day. Things that stopped me were: 1) Upcharge (!) 2) I couldn't decide between full or compact version of the cab, and 3) lack of real-world experience hearing Alnico cream in a closed-back/higher gain setting.

If you can/will post any sound samples of that with your TC-100, that'd be super helpful. I know it's not closed back, but I'd love to hear it!

Alnico Cream is just one badass speaker, but IMO you are smart to pair it with something that has more bite. I love smooth, but there is such a thing as too much smooth...


EDIT for screamingdaisy:

Have been running through an A Type for the last hour... can't say if the thinning effect is actually less pronounced, or if the speaker is simply a little fatter and greasier no matter where you have the dial. I'd like to say I can hear noticeable difference, but nothing huge, no. On a related note, this is really making me wonder how A-types and V-types would sound together in a big box. V's are nice sounding and lack the bzzzzz of V30s that drives me crazy, but by themselves don't have a ton of personality...

 

[bandit2013]

Hard to say If I will be recording anything soon. I actually found the Creme Alnico had more bite than the Creamback. Also the bottom end is more abundant. For some reason I think the pair of creme anlicos were cancelling each other out. They were wired correctly. Also the volume seemed to be lower and it did not matter if the pair of speakers were the original V30's, a pair of Creambacks or the anlico's. Odd that the cream and creamback just sound huge together. I can say this, the RA100 combo never sounded better. Still has a vintage tone but not as dramatic as it was when the two speakers were of the same type. If I can gather my gear and get a recoding thing going I will do it. Still want to push the JP-2C onto the RA100 combo with the mixed pair of speakers.

 

[screamingdaisy]

EDIT for screamingdaisy:

Have been running through an A Type for the last hour... can't say if the thinning effect is actually less pronounced, or if the speaker is simply a little fatter and greasier no matter where you have the dial. I'd like to say I can hear noticeable difference, but nothing huge, no. On a related note, this is really making me wonder how A-types and V-types would sound together in a big box. V's are nice sounding and lack the bzzzzz of V30s that drives me crazy, but by themselves don't have a ton of personality...

Isn't an A Type speaker supposed to be American sounding (ie, scooped and Fender-ish)? That's pretty much the opposite of a G12M-25.

 

[Pongo]

Isn't an A Type speaker supposed to be American sounding (ie, scooped and Fender-ish)? That's pretty much the opposite of a G12M-25.

They're advertised as "American" (ish), and yeah, they're definitely more even across the spectrum. More bottom end, no mid bump, and not really harsh anywhere.

I've never heard them sound bad in any context/style, but I'm not sure they excel anywhere, either, except perhaps in Fender combos? I'm mostly interested in how they mix with other speakers (e.g. w/ V-types?) right now

 

[bandit2013]

I got around to installing the Celestion Crème 90W and the Creamback H75 in the larger of the horizontal cabs (only one I have as I do not have the compact version). I am not very impressed with this in closed back form. There was better presence in tone with the open back combo of the RA than in the closed back Horizontal cab. I did mount the Alnico first and tried it with one of the V30s. That was mudd heaven. I you really like mudd with no note definition do that and you will happy. Otherwise I would not recommend combining a Crème 90W alnico with the V30 as it sound more like poo, crap or that for letter word starting with the letter S and ending in T and rhymes with hit.

As for the Creamback combined with the Crème Alnico, I was not very impressed. The two V30's do a much better job in the deep cabinet for cleans, medium gain to heavy all out punch. the combination seemed to be lacking anything short of tone from a single speaker and guess which one was dominating, the one with the ceramic magnet G12H75 creamback. Bottom end was not very tight either and the clean channel sounded terrible. You would not have been happy with that combination, was not even worth wasting the time to record it. I was wanting to return the creamback to the RA100 combo anyways so I will try the Crème 90W in the 212 cab and see how that turns out. if not good, that would have been a good down payment on another amp or new guitar (actually I could have bought a guitar for the cost of the two Celestion Crème 90W Alnico speakers. I believe the Horizontal 212 as well as the vertical 212 may be tuned specifically for the Celestion V30 speaker. I will find out soon enough once I pull the chassis out of the combo and retrieve the other Celesiton Crème 90W. Who knows, it may be a win or loose situation.

 

[bandit2013]

Well now. Nothing good to reveal about the Crème 90W Alnicos. I can say this, they will not sound good at all in a Mesa cabinet. In a pair loaded in the RA100, sounded like a blanket over the amp. Wired correctly. Not bad with the Creamback but not great either but I will say it sounded much better than it did in the Horizontal cab. A pair of them in the Horizontal cab was okay but not superb. V30's seem to be the best option in the Rectifier Horizontal 212 cab. I would assume the same would be true with the Vertical. What a disappointment. I will not recommend them.

TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, Mark V sound the best with the 212 cabs with the stock V30s.

 

[Pongo]

Well, thanks for the update... sucks you went through all that swapping for nothing, though.

In defense of the Alnico Cream, I can say with certainty that it is heavenly by itself in an open back cabinet or combo amp. Sounds like it doesn't play well with others (or even itself).

 

[bandit2013]

I heard some good recordings with that speaker in a 412 cab. I think it was a Marshall cabinet. Different dimensions than the Mesa cab. The 212 cab is too deep for that speaker. It is not bad. I loved the one I had in my Mark V combo until I burned the coil with the JP-2C.

I wound up with one Creamback and one V30 in the RA100. Had the better tone and loudness. Running to V30 in open back is not very great, two Creambacks is ok but seems softer in volume, the two Alnico Crème, definitely not bad but too much reduction in volume. I wonder if the voice coils had the same polarity. Almost sounded like the speakers were bucking. I should have tried it miss-wired to see if that would make a difference. Too late. Back the box they went (for a rainy day perhaps or a thinner cabinet). They definitely had more treble cut, similar to the Redback speaker but not as much as the OTR.

If the speakers sounded great I would have recorded something. Unfortunate they did not.

 

[Pongo]

I can only push the gain to a few minutes past 10 o'clock without having to dial back the volume knob on my guitar, humbuckers even less.

Uh, yeah, this is totally not the case at all anymore. On NORMAL mode, the Clean mode stays "clean" with the gain much, much higher now.

I have no idea what was going on there; it definitely wasn't in DRIVE mode, and there have been no other changes in my amp or settings or pedals (the channel sounds basically the same, too, just a touch fuller now that the gain can go up several notches), so I'm gonna call it unknown user error.

 

[bandit2013]

I can only push the gain to a few minutes past 10 o'clock without having to dial back the volume knob on my guitar, humbuckers even less.

Uh, yeah, this is totally not the case at all anymore. On NORMAL mode, the Clean mode stays "clean" with the gain much, much higher now.

I have no idea what was going on there; it definitely wasn't in DRIVE mode, and there have been no other changes in my amp or settings or pedals (the channel sounds basically the same, too, just a touch fuller now that the gain can go up several notches), so I'm gonna call it unknown user error.

Sorry for this question....but who are you quoting?

The TC-100 is a beast and more so than I thought it would be. A week or so ago I had some friends over. One of which brought a 62 les paul, may as well call it an SG (he claims it is a les Paul before the other les paul was adopted and the horned devil became the SG model) That axe has a hot wound original P90 in it. I could not believe my ears when I heard it. I was playing drums at the time so things generally sound differeint when you are not the one playing the guitar. Now I am oogling a set of HSP90 on the bare knucle web site. May get the Mississippi Queens but decided on a pair of humbuckers instead (juggernaut set) for my Carvin CT624C. I still want the P90 pups though may have to build another guitar for those. I do have another CT6 but does not have a tremolo on it. I may just get the picups anyway and try them out in that guitar first. So in a band setting, the TC-100 definately works its majic. Too bad nobody was playing bass when I was playing the drums.

 

[Pongo]

Sorry for this question....but who are you quoting?

Haha... myself, sorry for the confusion.

When I first got the amp the CLEAN channel was breaking up even with the gain set low (e.g. 10 o'clock w/ P-90s). This did not please me, but I liked the HI and LO channels so much, it wasn't really biggest deal in the world...

Then a few days ago, I was using a bridge humbucker, and noticed the gain was up at 2 o'clock on the CLEAN channel... but still crystal clear. Like I said, I have no explanation for the change, but it's a welcome change. CLEAN channel sounds better, fuller with the gain up a little higher.

The TC-100 is a beast and more so than I thought it would be. A week or so ago I had some friends over. One of which brought a 62 les paul, may as well call it an SG (he claims it is a les Paul before the other les paul was adopted and the horned devil became the SG model) That axe has a hot wound original P90 in it. I could not believe my ears when I heard it. I was playing drums at the time so things generally sound differeint when you are not the one playing the guitar. Now I am oogling a set of HSP90 on the bare knucle web site. May get the Mississippi Queens but decided on a pair of humbuckers instead (juggernaut set) for my Carvin CT624C. I still want the P90 pups though may have to build another guitar for those. I do have another CT6 but does not have a tremolo on it. I may just get the picups anyway and try them out in that guitar first. So in a band setting, the TC-100 definately works its majic. Too bad nobody was playing bass when I was playing the drums.

Yes! That's been my experience, too. They sound fine when I'm noodling by myself, but in a full band setting, TC-100 + P-90s sound both huge and very complimentary to the mix as a whole. Hope yours work out for you.

 

[bandit2013]

I generally run the gain setting high on the clean channel. Too low it will sound a bit dark or lacking musical content. That circuit has more of a traditional Fender tone stack and sits between V1A and V1B followed by V2A. (had to think that one through as the RA has the HiLo gain channel using V1 and V2 and the 12AT7 tube is V3, the TC places the 12AT7 tube in V5).

TC-100 does have a thicker tone to it. Perhaps one of the Mesa 12AX7 are not to spec. I have had to replace preamp tubes with new ones as I found one or two on the verge of microphonic ringing (one on the JP-2C and the other on the TC-100).

Back again off topic- since it cost me $600 for the pair of Crème 90W alnico speakers I decided to throw them back into the RA100 combo. I purposely miss-wired them out of phase and it was not favorable, scooped tinned sound. So at least I know they were wired properly the first time. Swapped two wires on one speaker so both are in-phase and all was good. I have to keep in mind that ALNICO speakers take longer to break in than your ceramics speakers due to lower magnetic field strength (this is assumed). Also re-tubed the RA to make the preamp as bright as possible and decided to stuff the stock Mesa EL34 in the power section. Not bad at all. Still have the amp chassis out and will see how things change when I get the amp all closed up. Definitely would not use the Crème ALNICO in a horizontal or vertical 212 as the tone would be very dark. They sound much better in open back format. Since the Crème Alnico is similar to an EV speaker (tone wise) the bottom end is much more dominant but there is that classic vintage tone that peaks out and a bit of bell like chime on the top end. I think these speakers have a lower signal response or SPL than the V30 or Creamback speaker. I will see how things go for a while and force myself to play though the amp more than the others. Break-in, breaking, broke. I do recall I took my time with the first one I tried in the Mark V combo. Still it delivered out of box far better than the Jensen Blackbird ALNICO speaker. That one took forever to break in but sounded really good with the clean channel it did not favor the distortion too much but it eventually started to improve and when it was at its sweet spot I poked one of the screws though the webbing when I was swapping it out to compare to the Celestion Crème back. Swapping speakers can be just as painful as chasing the pickup balloon. Some work great and some do not. Even when it is endorsed by someone or raved about in many forums or reviews, does not mean it will work for you. Power tubes and preamp tubes can also leave you chasing tone that never seems to be achievable. I am not trying to sound like any artist in particular as I am trying to seek my own tone or what I find pleasing to listen too. If I can get lost in what I am hearing and if it puts a smile on my face (I may not even notice if I am actually smiling but I am somehow).

back on topic... I think :roll:
Out of box, the TC-100 is sweet, it is a beast, it is pleasant yet sinister if you want it there. Works awesome for dropped tunings and standard tuning. I still believe the TC-50 has a bit of a dryer tone to it and that one is also sweet too. Dry tight response on the bottom end similar to the JP-2C but not the same obviously. As far as sounding like a Rectifier amp, the closest thing I have is a Roadster, sure it is a DR but different unless I exclude CH4. Yeah, perhaps it does sound like a DR on CH3. RA100 has more of a Mark tone with CH3. Perhaps that is why I like running both the TC and RA together. Will have to pull out the grid slammer and or flux drive if I can remember where I put them. :roll: