Another TC-100 vs Badlander topic + a novel trick

[danielpasco]

I'm still lugging around my old 100 pound beast Electra Dyne 1x12 combo. It just sounds so good. I'm in a classic rock cover band and even the drummer said "how good my guitar sounded" lol.
It's always funny when someone goes to help me load in or load out and grab the amp! Holy sh!t this thing is heavy!

I still regret selling mine.

 

[Eevil]

I'm still lugging around my old 100 pound beast Electra Dyne 1x12 combo. It just sounds so good. I'm in a classic rock cover band and even the drummer said "how good my guitar sounded" lol.
It's always funny when someone goes to help me load in or load out and grab the amp! Holy sh!t this thing is heavy!

Had one of those narrow combos.. did not gel with the combo cab tone but the amp itself works and is glorious

 

[bandit2013]

Quite interesting set of responses on the TC100. My issue with the amp was that it kept losing output volume. It got to the point where the TC50 had more power than the TC100 at 100W. It was all due to the instability of the Chinese 12AT7. The JAN/Phillips 12AT7 made a huge difference and I restored that volume I had when the amp was new. Odd that I prefer the Chinese 12AT7 in the RA100 as it has a similar design. Tried the JAN/Phillips in the TC50 and that did not change anything.

If I have not stated before, the 12AT7 tube V5 is always in the signal path. The send circuit is a cathode follower with low output impedance and the recovery stage is the other triode of that tube. The FX on/off circuit is just a relay that shorts the send to return when something is plugged into the FX loop jacks. If you do not plug anything in, the return jack has a shorting switch to connect to the send so it is bridged internally. Turning on the FX loop or turning it off should not have any change in character. Just insert a jumper cable from send to return and see if that does make a difference when you turn on the loop or turn it off.

My cables are 10ft as well. I have several sets of this cable. I have yet to have issues in tone suck with any amp unless the gear is not compatible with line level signals.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...trument-patch-cable-10-foot-straight-straight

I mostly use Strymon stuff as that was the only brand that worked with the Mark V90 FX loop without getting overloaded or suffer major tone suck or compression. I still have some of the units I experimented with that did not work well with the Mark V90: TC flashback triple delay, and Line-6 DL4. The TC unit was just a shift in tone, the Line-6 was more of a buffer overload issue as it compressed the signal so bad it had no detail in the effect. I did try something other than Strymon, a Source Audio Ventris. Its specs stated it would work with line level signals +8dBu. However, when I used it, the output level seemed to drop, it would go back to normal level if I turned it off. This issue was not just with the TC100 or TC50, I had the same issue with the JP2C and that signal level is not line level either. Perhaps I need to update the firmware or do something with the NEURO interface to correct the output. It is a decent unit, just did not maintain unity between input and output.

Some of the FX units may have some sort of configuration programming through a downloadable resource. If the input and output are not self adjusting to maintain unity in signal levels, you may have to adjust some parameters of the unit using the proprietary program to configure it. I need to see if I can get the Ventris to work better. If I could fix that drop in volume issue it would be a cool fx pedal to use.

 

[bandit2013]

@marcelomazzuco made a great video comparing cable lengths and use of some buffers. At first, I was not sure what I was looking at but I did see what he was doing here. I will buy that. He made some good points. Sure, long cable runs will affect the tone more so with the upper frequencies.

https://boogieforum.com/threads/mesa-triple-crown-tone-suck-test-new-video.88094/#post-542055

I should have asked if the Dual rec below the TC100 has any similar issues on cable runs.

 

[MarkIVWump]

I ordered a Jan/Phillips 12AT7 based on this recommendation and put it in the V5 of my TC50 and the volume of my FX loop started fluctuating and dying. I tried another 12AT7 I had lying around and the same thing happened. I put the Chinese Mesa 12AT7 back in and the FX loop works as fine as can be expected again. Any ideas what is happening?

Edit: Also one of the pins was bent on my original 12AT7 which I noticed someone else mentioning. Did they bend a pin on purpose for some reason?

 

[bandit2013]

Pins are not supposed to be bent. It may have been caused by its removal or how it was inserted. Best to verify by feel that the pins are aligned before pressing the tube into place. If they are not straight, it becomes more difficult to get the tube installed. Never force a tube into the socket.

Sorry you had issue with the JAN/Phillips 12AT7WC tube. Where did you get it from?

Considering the fire Shuguang had a few years back, 2018? whatever stock of the Chinese tubes were left, I am sure that inventory has been long gone. Mesa replaced the Chinese 12AT7 with the TungSol 12AT7. Not just for keeping up inventory but more so due to performance issues. I had inquired why the change with the Mesa TT800 as it came stuffed with the Tung Sol 12AT7. Someone from Mesa in one of the facebook clubs for Mesa bass amps, claimed the Chinese 12AT7 was not very reliable. The Tung Sol 12AT7 had more stability. Sure, fine in the BASS amp but they were super bright in the TC amps. I actually favor the Chinese 12AT7 in the RA100. TC is a bit different. It was the TC100 that I had issues with and much to what you described. The JAN/Phillps 12AT7 worked well and has been in there since I first mentioned it.

 

[MarkIVWump]

I got my JAN/Phillips 12AT7 from Ruby Tubes on Reverb. I tested it in another amp and it works so it's not the tube. And my other spare (unknown origin) 12AT7 works in other amps. My TC50 is from 2017 and it looked to me like no one had ever pulled the tube before, so it seems likely it's the Chinese 12AT7. Also, no matter what tube I had in V5, the amp functioned completely normal as long as I didn't turn the FX loop on.

I did just give the manual a thorough read through and found out that the TC50's FX loop level controls are the channel master volumes. I had been running all of them at noon and the manual says to keep the master volumes lower than noon for the FX loop to work properly.

By putting a more efficient tube in V5, could I have been running too hot a signal through the FX loop that caused some damage or a failsafe to trigger? My Mark IV also has this shared channel volume/FX loop level design and I've actually experienced something similar there when running a hot signal pedal through the FX loop with the channel volumes too high. The difference is there was noticeable distortion and crackling on the Mark IV but it did have a significant volume loss in the same way.

I will attempt trying the tube again today to see if it works running the channel volumes at different levels, but I'm curious, what channel volume levels is everyone running when they experience FX loop tone suck or inefficient volume? Is everyone aware that the manual states to keep the channel volumes between 9:00 – 12:00?