220V and Mesa amps in europe/Australia

[crisis]

Yes, 240V (unlike a huge number of Rectos in use in Australia). I wanted to avoid using a step-down. Extra gear to lug and some experts say that they can have a negative effect on sound and amp performance. If I didn't find a 240V here I was going to buy a 110V Recto off eBay in USA and have the seller ship it to Voodoo Aplification where a Mercury Magnetics 240V transformer would be fitted. I could also have had an aftermarket output tranny and other mods done at this time. That option was looking the goods for me until the 240V version popped up locally.

Interesting. What “negative effect” do they suggest? I intend to put my transformer along with some another **** in the stand I use for my quad so it will all be easier to carry around.

 

[enuenu]

To be honest I don't know what the negatives are. I have lost track of all the research I did before making my purchase. I do recall reading the advice of a technical person somewhere that step down transformers can cause problems. I wish I could tell you more but I just can't remember where I read it and the details, sorry for being so vague. It seems however that a lot of people use step down transformers without any problems at all. I have neither the technical knowledge or experience to offer any meaningful advice, I just know I can't go wrong with a Mesa 240V transformer in the head.

 

[terranova]

hi all

Slightly off topic:
I use a 500W US/Canada step down transformer with my US Peavey 5150 mk1 head and have experienced no problems. I would suggest that you go for a toridal type transformer if possible as they have less power noise than conventional transformers. Trade off is they're more expensive. If possible, get a unit that is much larger than the max. power draw of the amp so you won't be pushing the boundaries of the step-down unit. A peavey serivce agent in Melbourne said that they would charge me $300 fitted for a 240V replacement which seems a lot more reasonable than the $700 being quoted for the mesa heads here. The 5150 is a 120W amp. Not sure how that compares to the power rating of mesa amps being discussed on this forum

On topic:
I do have a on topic question though. I have recently purchased a Mesa Studio Preamp and Mesa Simul 395 power amp from Europe and was told by the owner that they are 230V versions.
The preamp states 220V/50Hz/0.5A so I would imagine it should be fine with a plug replacement here in australia, but the Simul 395 is labelled as 120v/60Hz/6A.

Are these power amps one of the units that is power switchable? I am waiting on clarifcation from the previous owner as I would hate to damage it. I have also emails Mesa in the US, but if someone in the know could help me with this that would be awesome.

 

[94Tremoverb]

If what you have is a step-down transformer (not a "voltage converter") and is rated for at least the maximum power draw (not output power) of the amp, there is no problem whatever and no harm will occur. It's better to have an even greater power rating still, but not essential.

Does your 295 have a captive power cord, or a socket on the back? If it has a captive cord, what type of plug? - if it's an Australian plug, you can assume the conversion has already been done no matter what it says on the back of the amp. (Frequently techs don't correctly re-label things.) If it has a socket and you aren't sure, what to do is to plug it into the step-down transformer on the assumption that it's a 120V unit. If it works, it is. If it doesn't, it's a 240V one. No harm will occur by being tested at half the correct voltage.

The chances are very good that if you do accidentally plug a 120V unit into 240V, it will just blow the fuse and do no other harm, but you can't completely count on it.

Be careful with 220V units - for a preamp it should be fine to run on 240V, but for a power amp not always, the resulting 10% overvoltage might put the tubes outside the safe operating range for either voltage or power dissipation.

Most Mesa amps have special transformers that can't easily be replaced with aftermarket ones by the way - because they have extra primary windings for the 'Spongy' or 'Tweed' modes. It still doesn't justify the prices they charge outside North America though.

 

[terranova]

Thanks 94Tremoverb 8)

The Simul 395 has captive power leads, but they are wired for European (Poland) power source.

I just received an email confirming that the Simul 395 has been converted already to 230V/50Hz and the label on the back was becuase the amp was orginally from America. The previous owner was from Poland (http://www.kropla.com/electric2.htm) and from my research the difference between power in Poland/Australia is 230V/50Hz and 240v/50Hz.

It should just be a simple matter of replacing the Polish power plugs with the Australian ones I believe.

Do you think becuase the frequency of the power is the same, that the 10V difference will be a problem?

I know that 240V in australia is not a guaranteed voltage - typically under 240V depending on where you live.

Yeah I use a step down transformer for my Peavy 5150. I think the power draw is about 400W - works really well, just a pain having to remember to through the step down unit in (plus it is heavy) :mrgreen:

 

[KH Guitar Freak]

The pricing differences is partly explained in here...

http://www.guitarsatbmusic.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=483

After all, if you look at the prices of amps such as Ulbricks cost here in Australia, Mesa prices in Australia isn't too far off. Of course one might argue it's a comparison between handwired vs. partial PCB, but hey, perhaps Mesa do put in a lot of attention to detail to their products as well...

Don't forget, on top of some of the reasons mentioned in that thread, the USA gets "shafted" over products not made in the US. I haven't done the calculations yet, but even other non US products such as Marshalls are substantially more expensive in Australia than the UK...

Lastly, there are definitely some Mesa Boogie dealerships in Australia than can offer significantly discounted prices on some brand new Mesa Boogies, some discounts would make the price you pay for one in Australia only a few hundred dollars more expensive than buying from the US, without the hassle of overseas shipping, transformer swaps, and warranty being void. I would like to also add that if you are smart in finding out the best prices for Mesa Boogies in Australia, you'll find that the difference between that price and the RRP would be significantly less than some of the other amp brands out there...

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

i dont know how many of you have experience in importing large quantities of merchandise, from what it sounds like most of you have bought a pedal from ebay and all of a sudden your a guru at importing goods.

think of the finances they have tied up in importing, they wouldnt be importing 1 or 2 at a time, they would be getting containers of them, probably in the vicinity of $100,000 worth of stock to make it worth there while which is alot of money. then they put there margin on it and the guitar store puts there margin on it, which would be higher than the US because we do not turn over as much goods as they would and voila its not that hard for it to be double, triple the cost.

you arent getting ripped off per se, im sure you will find it the same with cars, other electrical goods even. its just the way it is. those MI amps that are australian made are over the 2k mark so i dont think $3500 for a dual rec is totally unreasonable.

i bought 2 brand new mesa's over here, not going to lie it was expensive but buying overseas sure isnt helping the problem

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

i should probably add that i get a bit frustrated at the price also, but i can understand it on some level. i just dont think pro audio are out there ripping everyone off

 

[94Tremoverb]

The point about overpricing of imports like Mesa in the UK and Australia etc is not that they're more expensive - since there is shipping, duty etc to take into account, and that is understood - it's that *some* companies choose to (or allow their distributors who they give exclusive license deals to) charge far more than others. In the UK (and I think Australia from what I'm reading here) Mesa are relatively so much more expensive than some other US brands like Fender that there really is clearly some excessive profit-making going on compared to the US prices.

If you think about it, why does Mesa need to be so strict about US dealers not shipping overseas? Because if they didn't overcharge in other countries, the plain economics of importing one amp privately vs. the distributor doing it in bulk would make it more expensive anyway and so there would be no need to prevent it. The very fact that they ned to protect their overseas distributors from competition proves that they're overcharging. I am *not* saying that Mesas should be the same price in the UK as in the US, what I am saying is that they should be the same amount more expensive as can be accounted for fairly, and which other companies often do.

 

[KH Guitar Freak]

The point about overpricing of imports like Mesa in the UK and Australia etc is not that they're more expensive - since there is shipping, duty etc to take into account, and that is understood - it's that *some* companies choose to (or allow their distributors who they give exclusive license deals to) charge far more than others. In the UK (and I think Australia from what I'm reading here) Mesa are relatively so much more expensive than some other US brands like Fender that there really is clearly some excessive profit-making going on compared to the US prices.

If you think about it, why does Mesa need to be so strict about US dealers not shipping overseas? Because if they didn't overcharge in other countries, the plain economics of importing one amp privately vs. the distributor doing it in bulk would make it more expensive anyway and so there would be no need to prevent it. The very fact that they ned to protect their overseas distributors from competition proves that they're overcharging. I am *not* saying that Mesas should be the same price in the UK as in the US, what I am saying is that they should be the same amount more expensive as can be accounted for fairly, and which other companies often do.

Btw, if I'm not mistaken, Fender has a policy whereby a dealer would have to stock and perhaps sell a fixed amount of Fender products in a year, to then allow them to continue to hold onto their dealership. Not to mention that a new dealership would have to stock and perhaps sell a fixed amount of Squires before they are even allowed to sell actual Fender products. Maybe then that's why they are cheaper cause they do bring in more Fender products that way. Also, don't forget, that almost all music stores that sell guitar products are also Fender dealerships...

Also, distributors here have to pay duties and taxes a whole lot more cause they are actually selling products in Australia. If you are bringing in a one off item, you only need to pay those duties and taxes at the individual rates...

I could be wrong though, but maybe there are some concessions that the US government have in place for US products being sold in the US itself? If that's so, maybe the concessions don't apply for goods outside the US???

Personally, I don't necessarily think it's just pure shafting of customers outside the US. For example, a Marshall JVM410H costs quite a bit more than say a Mesa Mark V. Also, a lot of German made products in the US cost almost comparatively the same as the price you would have to pay to get one in Australia...

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

thats strange because i got great prices on both my mesa's. the first time i had cash and he dropped 11% off the ticket straight up

 

[J.J]

I have bought two brand new Mesa's in Australia in the last two years. Do I like the price, no not at all. Facts are though, that Pro Audio are not raking it in and laughing all the way to the bank. They sell way more of the lower priced Chinese amps. I am sure Pro Audio would love to sell Mesa's much cheaper than they do, as they would sell many many more. Also, I love being able to go to Pro Audio where they have just about the full range of Mesa products.

Currently with the US dollar being quite low, there are great deals to be had on Mesa products in Australia. You do have to ask for them though

 

[Blaklynx]

I'm sorry but I think we get ripped off here. I've read the entire thread and there has been many heated discussions about this on Melband (Aussie site, Melbourne) about this very issue.

Yes, there a pro's and cons to both arguments and I understand that distributers have $1000's tied up in stock. So do shops in the US. I also understand that they have to make sure that regulations and approvals are met and that it does cost a few hundred dollars (I think from memory $300-500) for testing and approval of electrical equipment for that revision product (one off cost for that revision only). Subsequently if there's another electrical revision on that product, approval needs to be gained again. OK, understood.

However, how does it explain that if I buy an amp from a shop in the US, I can still get it so much cheaper? Said shop still pays wages, insurance, shipping (to shop), rates, utility costs etc., In other words, I still pay for all their overheads and running costs. In Australia, it's the same, right? Granted, the actual costs as a direct comparison may be cheaper in the US but I'm still paying for it, regardless.

Now consider this... when the distributor over here orders, it's direct from the manufacturer, or at the most, from another distributor. They won't be shop prices that you and I pay. Also, shipping costs are not what you and I pay. They get a discount and usually by a huge difference. Do you think they'll pay $300~500 for only one amp? I think not.

I may have said it simplisticly but to me I feel that we do get ripped off. A case in point, I boughtt an entire One Spot power supply combo pack for $50AU shipped to my door. Here, just the power supply (yes, only the power supply) is $50 or so, let alone $6~8 or so for each cable/adapter and Multi-Plug 8 Cable for $33 and so on. Getting ripped? You bet.

It's time Aussie shops give us a fair deal, not a ripoff deal. Let's face it, we get ripped off on everything, not just musical gear.

 

[lostcause]

It's time Aussie shops give us a fair deal, not a ripoff deal. Let's face it, we get ripped off on everything, not just musical gear.

Maybe not so much the "shops". One way for an Aussie store to remain competitive with the US is not to have a store front, to just be a warehouse shipping out items. No where for anyone to try gear out, no floor stock. No sales staff, just boxed items to go. Check out chick and a scanner. No expensive lease in a down town or centralized location. This will only reduce prices by a little but its about all a store can do the rest is up to other parties involved. The prices we pay are a combination of Government legislation, the importers distributors and stores.
Most stores already pretty much discount to their limit on items anyway, the owners might as well close their doors and invest money elsewhere if they go any cheaper. There is a point where they would have to ask themselves is it worth having so much tied up in stock and other expenses when they could find cheaper ways to make the same coin.

 

[KH Guitar Freak]

If the checkout chicks are hot, I don't care either way...

 

[Blaklynx]

It's time Aussie shops give us a fair deal, not a ripoff deal. Let's face it, we get ripped off on everything, not just musical gear.

Maybe not so much the "shops". One way for an Aussie store to remain competitive with the US is not to have a store front, to just be a warehouse shipping out items. No where for anyone to try gear out, no floor stock. No sales staff, just boxed items to go. Check out chick and a scanner. No expensive lease in a down town or centralized location. This will only reduce prices by a little but its about all a store can do the rest is up to other parties involved. The prices we pay are a combination of Government legislation, the importers distributors and stores.
Most stores already pretty much discount to their limit on items anyway, the owners might as well close their doors and invest money elsewhere if they go any cheaper. There is a point where they would have to ask themselves is it worth having so much tied up in stock and other expenses when they could find cheaper ways to make the same coin.

I understand what you're saying, however, most items are not a fair deal. The difference is too great.

As an example, why is it that I can buy an MI Audio Tube Zone pedal cheaper from the US rather than from my local store? They are made here for crying out loud. The shops here may match the price (or knock-off 5~10%) if you haggle but why go through that process? They should be cheaper to begin with. We subsidise the OS market, not with just musical equipment but vehicles, etc.

A Mesa Mark V is $5,495.00AU (Pro Audio) and in the US it's $2,249.00US (Sweetwater). This was based on a quick google search on the first links I could find. Massive difference. You can bargain but will they knock off $500~600? Even then, it's still double the price. If I import and pay $300~500 for postage, I'll have enough change to buy a ticket for a holiday with spending money.

I work hard for my money. If shops want my money, prices need to be fair and reasonable. If the Mark V was between, say, $3000~3200, I'd buy it here. That's reasonable considering warranty and service and local support.