Tubes for the mark series

[Facelift]

I havent seen a thread dedicated to just tubes and how they affect the tone on the mark series amps. Ive seen several thread that mention what people use but not one that has all the info in one place. Im thinking this would help any newcomers to the mark series (like myself) with ideas of what to expect from certain tubes to help get the tone for the style of music they play.

In m Mark III Im currently using all stock Mesa 12ax7 tubes for the preamp except for one. Im using a JJ12ax7 in V5. Using 2 Mesa 6L6 and 2 Mesa EL34 for power tubes.

The sound Im getting is very brutal and aggressive with no real loss of note definition. As with any tube amp they never sound the same day to day. Ive been toying with the idea of different tubes to enhance what I already have going so basically my ideal tone out of this amp would be shimmering cleans with a hint of breakup. I dont care for snappy/twangy cleans. For heavy distortion, I like alot of warmth but like the chainsaw sound as well. It must have deep gritty chunk and some good "bite" on single note palm mutes. Not looking for mud but not looking for something too trebly. I dont like sterile sound. It must have an overtone that only tubes can offer. So my question is, Is there such tubes that will give me all that rolled into one? What I have is close to that already but surely there are better tubes out there that will make it just that much better.

Basically just post what style of music you play and what tubes are your preference to get you in sonic heaven.

Style of music I play is Pantera/Slayer/Metallica type thrash.

 

[Skyless7620]

I was just about to make a thread with almost the same exact questions!

I've got groove tubes 12ax7's in my Red stripe Mark III and I'm looking to add a tiny bit of saturation/gain to the preamp. Sorta "wet" the sound a tad without sacrificing the tight, "in your face"ness of the tone. The only thing I may want to alter in the tone is subduing some of the high end so I can bring up the presence and open up the amp without getting a harsh treble.

 

[boogieslayer]

when i had my III i switched off between JJ and GT's... a couple other types have been suggested to me but i have not tried them yet

personally i love the JJ's

 

[Facelift]

when i had my III i switched off between JJ and GT's... a couple other types have been suggested to me but i have not tried them yet

personally i love the JJ's

what style of music do you play? IT will help tremendously in this post on what sound youre getting from using all JJs or GTs. Ive looked at getting the JJ set from Eurotubes but not sure if I want to go that route.

 

[av8or3]

I am a believer in using whatever tubes the amp was designed
around. In the Mark series you can't go wrong with NOS power
and preamp tubes. They are expensive, sure , but most are 11,000
hour tubes. I have never been less than amazed at the difference
they've made. And as a result I've begun stockpiling those that are my
favorites.
Give them a try, while you still can.
Jim

 

[Neptical]

I whole heartedly agree with what Jim said. Check out some classic NOS tubes to put in the preamp and power amp sections. The NOS tubes have a certain magic to them that I haven't been able to find in newer tubes. If you want that deep, thick warm punch but not brittle and smooth in the highs..definitely give them a try.

If you can't afford NOS 12AX7's AND 6L6/EL34s at the same time, I would start with ONE nice NOS 12AX7 (rft,mullards,amprex/hammonds,jan phillips,etc.) in V1 (and V3 if affordibility is not an issue), then work your way out to the power section with some newer Svet Winged =C= 6L6/EL34s.

I, ( as an old metalhead ) find that would give you that big rich full sound your looking for. Remember- everything including pickups,speakers, wood of the guitar, etc all make just as much a difference in the end as well.

~Nep~

 

[mrd]

+1 to the NOS.

Putting a NOS Mullard in the V1 of my MKIV was the single biggest change in tone I have ever heard from any of my rigs and guitars. Overtones jumped out and seemed more organic, and the gain was richer and more detailed and responded better to subtle playing nuances. Sweet! :twisted:

 

[Skyless7620]

If you can't afford NOS 12AX7's AND 6L6/EL34s at the same time, I would start with ONE nice NOS 12AX7 (rft,mullards,amprex/hammonds,jan phillips,etc.) in V1 (and V3 if affordibility is not an issue), then work your way out to the power section with some newer Svet Winged =C= 6L6/EL34s.


~Nep~

I'll probably try the popular RFT/Tungsram combo throughout.

Should I put the RFTs in V1 and V3 or the Tungsrams?

or are there others you would recommend more? I was thinking of these since peoplespeak highly of them and they're not as expensive as a Mullard or Telefunken.

 

[Neptical]

If you can't afford NOS 12AX7's AND 6L6/EL34s at the same time, I would start with ONE nice NOS 12AX7 (rft,mullards,amprex/hammonds,jan phillips,etc.) in V1 (and V3 if affordibility is not an issue), then work your way out to the power section with some newer Svet Winged =C= 6L6/EL34s.


~Nep~

I'll probably try the popular RFT/Tungsram combo throughout.

Should I put the RFTs in V1 and V3 or the Tungsrams?

or are there others you would recommend more? I was thinking of these since peoplespeak highly of them and they're not as expensive as a Mullard or Telefunken.

Skyless,

The RFT/Tungsrams are a great combination. Those are pretty close in the description I gave in the earlier post. If your looking to tame down some of those highs, I would try the Tungrams first in V1/V3 because their smoother, but still have that nice punch,mid cut,sweet singing sustain and keep those nice lows.... and especially if your using a 'red stripe' (which I own as well) because the circuit is already quite a bit hotter..so you want to tame some of that sizzle out and turn it smooth. The RFT I think is a bit bright and has more highs which were trying to take out in the first place, but great for those nice sparkly cleans. I think that's a great start right there..definitely. IMHO- I think you would be quite happy.


~Nep~

 

[Skyless7620]

If you can't afford NOS 12AX7's AND 6L6/EL34s at the same time, I would start with ONE nice NOS 12AX7 (rft,mullards,amprex/hammonds,jan phillips,etc.) in V1 (and V3 if affordibility is not an issue), then work your way out to the power section with some newer Svet Winged =C= 6L6/EL34s.


~Nep~

I'll probably try the popular RFT/Tungsram combo throughout.

Should I put the RFTs in V1 and V3 or the Tungsrams?

or are there others you would recommend more? I was thinking of these since peoplespeak highly of them and they're not as expensive as a Mullard or Telefunken.

Skyless,

The RFT/Tungsrams are a great combination. Those are pretty close in the description I gave in the earlier post. If your looking to tame down some of those highs, I would try the Tungrams first in V1/V3 because their smoother, but still have that nice punch,mid cut,sweet singing sustain and keep those nice lows.... and especially if your using a 'red stripe' (which I own as well) because the circuit is already quite a bit hotter..so you want to tame some of that sizzle out and turn it smooth. The RFT I think is a bit bright and has more highs which were trying to take out in the first place, but great for those nice sparkly cleans. I think that's a great start right there..definitely. IMHO- I think you would be quite happy.


~Nep~

I won't lose any gain level with them right?

 

[Neptical]

I won't lose any gain level with them right?

You'll still have all the gain you'll need and then some. If your getting them both, experiment with them in different positions...you'll see what I mean.

~Nep~

 

[Facelift]

Being as this is my first tube amp and a total tube noob, Im not getting what you guys mean by NOS tubes. I take it NOS means New Old Stock right? IF so, Im not seeing which ones would be the perfect match for me as I dont know anything about NOS tubes or where to get them. Are they jsut something that pops up on ebay every now and then or is there a supplier?

 

[Neptical]

Being as this is my first tube amp and a total tube noob, Im not getting what you guys mean by NOS tubes. I take it NOS means New Old Stock right?

Yeah, mon.

IF so, Im not seeing which ones would be the perfect match for me as I dont know anything about NOS tubes or where to get them. Are they jsut something that pops up on ebay every now and then or is there a supplier?

You can find them on the 'bay which can get pretty expensive, or even look around on CL. Their getting harder to come by these days, so alot of folks just resort to new stock and find themselves quite happy also. Depends on what your really trying to do with your amp.

~Nep~

 

[Facelift]

Being as this is my first tube amp and a total tube noob, Im not getting what you guys mean by NOS tubes. I take it NOS means New Old Stock right?

Yeah, mon.

IF so, Im not seeing which ones would be the perfect match for me as I dont know anything about NOS tubes or where to get them. Are they jsut something that pops up on ebay every now and then or is there a supplier?

You can find them on the 'bay which can get pretty expensive, or even look around on CL. Their getting harder to come by these days, so alot of folks just resort to new stock and find themselves quite happy also. Depends on what your really trying to do with your amp.

~Nep~

Basically i want it aggressive chainsaw, tight, punchy, deep chunk, with bite. Not too trebly or hissy. I like it smooth but not too smooth because of lost gain. I like rich overtones and not sterile.

Is there a list of NOS tubes that are worth checking out that might fit that description? Or even just list of ones that I can check out.

 

[Neptical]

Basically i want it aggressive chainsaw, tight, punchy, deep chunk, with bite. Not too trebly or hissy. I like it smooth but not too smooth because of lost gain. I like rich overtones and not sterile.

Is there a list of NOS tubes that are worth checking out that might fit that description? Or even just list of ones that I can check out.

For a start, give this a read (http://www.tgpwebzine.com/?page_id=83). This will give you an idea of what some of those NOS tubes are in comparison.

From your description, sounds like you may also dig the RFT/ECC83. They were/are a popular tube for the metalheads..also used alot in the older Marshall JCMs. So, if you want to get that big ballsy grit, check them out. They sound like they would be perfect for the tone your searching for.

~Nep~

 

[cremona]

+1 on the RFTS`s,

The also work wonders in the Phase inverter in my c+, that was night and day compared to stock mesas

The RFT`S share some similarities with the Tungsram , the both fill the sound out with wonderfull overtones that make the sound bigger and more 3d wich eny guitar player will like including metal players , just better really

The tungsram sound more natual and have a beautiful refinet swirling top end with tons of those NOS tube overtones , where the RFTS´s have more balls, more dynamic but less refinet , putting the tungsram in V1 V2 and tungsram in the rest created a great balanced sound .
Sound is both much deeper , bigger, more dynamic ,organic , magica overtones, and more responsiv sounding then with stock mesas, the diff is enything but subbel

I play Metal mostly , and the amazing think about great nos tubes is that the make your amp so responsiv to your playing , the RFT`S and Tungsrams makes the c+ sound so angry its orgasmic,

 

[Facelift]

Thanks for the replies on this. I will hopefully look into your suggestions shortly. Would you mind posting a picture of the RFT and Tungsram tubes. When I look for these tubes I want to make sure what they look like as I have no idea on how to spot a fake. Ive already seen 2 different RFT ECC83s and dont know which is real or fake or if either are real or fake.

 

[Facelift]

anyone? I really not in the knowhow on how to spot a fake. I see several different types made at the RFT plant but dont know which are fake or not or if they are. Really interested in trying different tubes out and need to know if there is a supplier of these tubes out there. Ive looked at the tubestore and they look similiar to what I see on ebay but still unsure because of the huge price difference. If I cant get any info on these then Im just going to go with the JJ set at eurotubes.

 

[Boogiebabies]

These are RFT's made in East Germany. Look at the construction of the plates, getter and mica spacers. They are very distinct to RFT's
as is the black flashing.

 

[MrMarkIII]

Here's a tube-buying guide from a seller on eBay:
http://reviews.ebay.com/The-Tubeking-apos-s-Guide-to-NOS-and-Vintage-Audio-Tubes_W0QQugidZ10000000017053944
You can never have too much information