TRiaxis FX loop woes.

[backyardburial]

I am running about 5 stereo pedals into the loop of my Triaxis and am getting VERY mixed results. Sometimes it's totally fine, but we played a gig in the weekend and I SWEAR with everything set up the same, I get no signal at all if the fx loop is on. If it's off, I get everything fine.
I just read about the loop button, something about running through the button 32 times before it gets back to it's original setting. I know this somehow related to external switching, but is there anyway this could just be affecting the fx loop? For the record, I plugged the pedal board into my JMP-1 pre, and it's all fine through that loop.
I believe the "Master" parameter comtrols the send level of the loop, and I have messed with that so I can rule that out, and I should add, over the last couple weeks I also had a situation where having the loop engaged meant I got fx out of one channel, and zilch out of the other. I am totally at a loss with what's going on, especially as it seems completely random when and where it decides to work.

Im playing the Triaxis through a VHT 2 90 2, so it's always in stereo by the way....any ideas at all?

 

[JMMP]

What stereo pedals are you using? Are you changing the order of those pedals, or changing the patch cables between them?

 

[Jackie]

Two things come to mind:

1) your V5 tube is iffy. Try replacing it and see if that fixes your problem. It's the tube that is closest to the FX Send/Return jacks.

2) you have a bad power supply. Though not as extreme as dropping out completely, I sometimes get a weird out-of-phase type tone if my TriAxis isn't getting enough juice.

 

[backyardburial]

JMMP- Im using, in this order in the FX loop, Boss PS-6-TC ELectronic Corona chorus-TC Vortex Flanger- TC Hall Of Fame -TC Flashback delay.
But because everything works fine with the JMP-1 preamp I'm fairly sure that the board itself is fine. Though I have had some problems with the Boss first in the chain-from memory I think the Mono out on the Boss has to go into the Stereo In on the Chorus (and the stereo out on the Boss goes into the Mono in on the chorus, whereas I would think it would be the other way around.
Jackie, I'll try that, but I did read on another forum that if I am geting my dry signal fine then it can't be a tube problem? Regardless I'll try it anyway!
Also I'm pretty sure power is all good, if it was power I'd be getting dry signal issues as well I'd assume? Thanks guys!

 

[backyardburial]

:mrgreen: Promised my 5 year old she could add a smiley face, so here it is! :mrgreen:

 

[allphourus]

You sound Confused about the Switch track effect loop switching and midi implimentation , Could You use this, sounds like you don't have one.

http://mesaboogie.com/manuals/Triaxis.pdf

 

[backyardburial]

That is exactly what I'm confused about. The manual doesn't really go into a great deal of detail on this though. from what I understand, "programmable" just means you can determine whether the loop is on or off depending on what preset you have. What I'd like to know is do any of these switching combinations mean anything to me if I don't have a 2:90? I thought these were only relevant to that particular power amp.

 

[allphourus]

What I'd like to know is do any of these switching combinations mean anything to me if I don't have a 2:90?

Yes they do.

 

[a2dconverter]

Hey BYB..

The SWITCH Outputs on the Triaxis are used to control the following functions...

On the MESA 2:90 Power Amp
1. DEEP/ EXTEND
2. MODERN
3. 1/2 DRIVE

On the MESA HIGH GAIN AMP SWITCH91. SELECT AMP #1
2. SELECT AMP #2
3. SELECT AMP #3
4. SELECT AMP #4

By pressing the LOOP/SW button on the Triaxis, you cycle through all of the combinations of the switches... stop when you get the switches that you want ON and store those positions with the preset. This includes the position of the FX Loop and whether it is ON or OFF as well.

Those Triaxis Switch Closures can be used to control functions on other AMPS as well.

When the loop is ON, and you have no FX in the loop, you are adding an extra tube stage that may affect your tone.

Also, if you are using the Loop, make sure that you put time based FX in the loop (reverb, chorus, delay) and compressors and gain pedals before the Triaxis input.

I recommend turning the Triaxis FX loop always OFF and using the A/B outputs to feed your Time based FX...

An even better set-up, so you don't chop up your tone by going through the A/D and D/A converters of 5 FX pedals, is to use Triaxis output A to feed your FX processor input (like a G-Major 2) and combine the output of the G-Major 2 with Triaxis Output B using an external Mixer. This will create a parallel FX chain that means your Dry tone goes right to the mixer. No digital chopping!

Also, Going through 5 stereo "pedals" in the Triaxis FX loop could be a disaster... the Triaxis FX loop send is fed from the output volume control... if you are playing at a gig where you have to turn up the Triaxis output level, you will be feeding >more< level to your FX, which probably get overloaded... as most pedals are not setup to accept close to line levels.

Make sure that you set the G-Major 2 to Kill-Dry mode so that your Triaxis dry tone doesn't get phase shifted with the Dry from the G-Major 2

Or you can do this...

I hope this helps

seeya

Joe

 

[backyardburial]

thanks for that, but I'll never be going anywhere near an effects processor. I thought putting effects in between the power and the pre amp wasn't a great idea? I think I read on this forum that the inout levels are quite high, so they should be in the loop? It sounds like if I'm not meant to put my effects in the Triaxis loop, then maybe I shouldnt be using a Triaxis! That's what I thought the loop was there for!

 

[a2dconverter]

I thought putting effects in between the power and the pre amp wasn't a great idea? I think I read on this forum that the inout levels are quite high, so they should be in the loop?

As long as you are using rack FX that can handle the Triaxis output levels, placing FX between the preamp and power amp is completely acceptable and used by all of the major rack builders, like Bob Bradshaw etc...(He was the first to do this in the 80's)

Putting pedals in the FX loop, or between the preamp and power amp , is not possible without distortion unless you use a level matching box like this one...

http://www.glab.com.pl/sa-1_en

At that point you might as well invest in a second hand TC G-Major for your delay, reverb, chorus. Keep your drive/ boost pedals up front....

One thing to remember, when you are putting your rack FX in the loop, is that as you go from the bedroom to the rehearsal hall to the show, you will be adjusting the Triaxis output knob to get more level into your power amp because you need to be louder... as you turn up the output knob, you are increasing the output of the Triaxis FX loop Send Jack and you will have to adjust the input to the FX processor using the processor's input gain control so that you do not overload the processor.....very bad

If you are using a parallel FX connection, like in the above diagrams, you will adjust the output level to the power amp using the mixer output control... that way the Triaxis output knob stays at "3" and you don't have to keep adjusting the FX processor's input gain knob.

I hope this helps clarify what is not possible with pedals in the Triaxis loop

Seeya

Joe

 

[eatsleeprock]

I could be wrong, but isn't the effects send level independent of the master output? Allowing you to change the output of your triaxis without rejiggering your effects every time you do it (which would be a monstrous pain in the ***, and really defeat the purpose of the loop)

 

[a2dconverter]

I could be wrong, but isn't the effects send level independent of the master output? Allowing you to change the output of your triaxis without rejiggering your effects every time you do it (which would be a monstrous pain in the ***, and really defeat the purpose of the loop)

Good Catch..Yes you are correct...from the Triaxis manual..

"FX LOOP:These jacks provide a Mono send and Stereo return effects loop configuration. The LOOP is programmable via the LOOP/SWITCH and ENTER keys located on the Front Panel and its’ status determined per PRESET.
The Front Panel programmable MASTER control determines the FX SEND LEVEL."

It is the Master Level that controls the FX Send and the Master Level is proportional to the FX Send Level..

Since in my Rig, I am using a parallel FX routing, I do not use the Triaxis FX Loop... I have My Triaxis Output Level Knob Always Set to >3< and I control the output to the Power Amp via the Mixer's Master out.

Some Mesa Boogie amps...like the Express, have the problem that I describe where the increase in Master Volume increases the FX Send level... I have experienced this as well

seeya

Joe

 

[backyardburial]

Thanks for your replies in this a2d...but I won't be buying any rack effects. I appreciate the time you have put into those posts though! Allphourus, thanks for your extremely helpful ones as well.

 

[backyardburial]

Well a few months down the track and I'm posibly looking at getting an effects processor even though I SWORE to myself I'd never do that. I think for what I need a version G mahor would suffice and they do pop up used fairly often here in New Zealand, whereas the GM2 hardly ever does...

The main question I guess I'd like to ask now is if I had a simple midi controller like the Midi Moose or Midi Mouse for example which selects presets ( as far as I know) can I use the one controller to change presets on my Triaxis as well as effects on the G major?
IE I want to go from no fx at all on preset 10 (my main dirty sound) to preset 11 with the same Triaxis sound, but having delay from the GM, and then preset 12 could be delay AND chorus?

Hopefully that makes sense. From the diagrams above provided by A2D, the setup looks really complicated, but as someone else mentioned, I would likely just keep the GM in the loop and still keep a few pedals in front. basically I know next to nothing aout Midi short of changing presets on my Triaxis, and I guess the main question is can one controller change two devices?

Ive been reading the GM manual...and I THINK this is where midi mapping comes into play?