Stomps or Multieffects?

[ironjose]

hey you guys...

i was wondering what should i use for effects...
1- a multieffect processor
2- stomp boxes

in your experience what should i use?

 

[thunda1216]

I really like my old GNX3 but for live I prefer individual stomps. Just my 2 cents. YMMV.

 

[Jackie]

Heh, that old debate.

I have a multiFX which works fine for me, but I don't use a lot of FX to begin with (chorus+verb on clean, flange on one song), so for what I do, it's enough (the fact that it also does my amp switching via MIDI helps a lot too). For me it's a cost effective way for MIDI control and FX. I agree stomps sound better to some extent but IMO if you know how to tweak a multiFX really well, chances are you would choose the processor over the pedal in a blind test.

 

[madnova73]

You could always use a Line 6 M9 or M13 to have the best of both worlds. Acts Like a stomp box but in a multiprocessor. Also uses midi for all your midi needs.

 

[MesaENGR412]

You could always use a Line 6 M9 or M13 to have the best of both worlds. Acts Like a stomp box but in a multiprocessor. Also uses midi for all your midi needs.

I used to have individual stomps, but they can be a hassel with wall warts, power boxes and a ton of patch cables. Plus, the good ones are normally about half as much as a solid multi-fx unit, so, you buy two, and you've paid for the M13, in my case.
I love my M13. It sounds great, is easy to use, and acts like individual stomp boxes. Also, in my experience there is little to no "tone suck" when the unit is on, and the sound of your guitar will still come through if the unit is turned completely off. I have also heard great things about the TC Electronic G major, G minor, Nova (the other system I was looking at) and the G system (but, that is about $1200, so, might not be in the budget). All of these can be MIDI controlled, which makes switching functions easy, and lessons the need to "tap dance" to turn on multiple effects.
However, there are always people that swear by stomp boxes (just look at Tim Mahoney......stupid amount of pedals, and they work for him), and there are midi boxes that let you patch your stomp boxes and MIDI control them as well. So, it is really up to you, your budget, and the sound you are looking for in the sound of your instrument, and the effects.

-AJH

 

[Dave G.]

I have to say i personally prefere individual stomp boxes purely for their ease of use. During a gig if you decide you need a little bit more delay or chorus for example all you have to do is bend down and twist a knob. For most multi fx's you would need to go through menu upon menu just to adjust the one parameter. Unless you already have several programmed with different amounts of delays.

I also like that you can see EXACTLY what effects are turned on with the stomps but not necessarily with the multieffects.


I do however love the portability of multieffects as they are so much easier to transport and need alot less cables. With the technology in them these days they sound as good as stomps too. Just for easy of use i much prefere the stomps, especially for live use.

 

[MesaENGR412]

I have to say i personally prefere individual stomp boxes purely for their ease of use. During a gig if you decide you need a little bit more delay or chorus for example all you have to do is bend down and twist a knob. For most multi fx's you would need to go through menu upon menu just to adjust the one parameter. Unless you already have several programmed with different amounts of delays.

I also like that you can see EXACTLY what effects are turned on with the stomps but not necessarily with the multieffects.


I do however love the portability of multieffects as they are so much easier to transport and need alot less cables. With the technology in them these days they sound as good as stomps too. Just for easy of use i much prefere the stomps, especially for live use.

This is true. However, with the M9 or M13 (not sure about the Nova or G system), you have adjustability on the fly, just like a regular stomp box, with the 6 knobs that are above the 4 "banks" (3 on the M9). And you also have a global tap tempo with the ability to make any time-based effects sync up perfectly, or you can set everything by milliseconds, if you play to a click and want to do it that way. That can come in handy. Just some things I find helpful.


EDIT: And, the M13 has stereo ins and outs, and a stereo fx loop for the 4 (or even more) cable method. You can also position each of the 4 effect banks to be either before or after the on board fx loop, so, using the 4 cable method, you can run things in front of and in the loop of any amp.

-AJH

 

[screamingdaisy]

Ideally (for me) if I'm doing something effects heavy I'd use pedals in front of the amp and a multi-FX in the loop. There would be a midi switcher with the pedals in loops and enough triggers to channel switch my amp.

Reality (for me) is that FX have not gone over well in my attempts to use them live so I generally stick to a wah and my amp's foot-switch.

 

[benjamin801]

For live, I prefer a multi (I use a TC Electronic Nova System). I like simplicity, and being able to stomp on a single button when I take a solo that gives me delay, reverb, and a 6db boost, is invaluable.

The nice thing about the Nova System is that you can set it up in "pedalboard mode," where each of the buttons acts as a programmable individual pedal (modulation, pitch shift, delay, etc.), or "preset mode," where each button engages an entire patch of effects, which is what I do.

 

[ryjan]

I much prefer multi fx for live use. I'm just not talented enough to switch amp channels, turn on a delay pedal, turn off a chorus pedal, hit the solo switch, all the while singing, and all on one beat.

 

[elvis]

I have 2 setups, a G System and a GCX/Ground Control with pedals. I prefer the pedal setup for tone and flexibility, and the G System for ease of setup.

No one perfect solution.

I do agree that automation is awesome.

 

[cheameup]

pedals for me all day. they just sound better than any mutli I've heard

but I also dont use allot these days. I have had heaps on my board in the past but stripped it back recently when doing a bunch of gigs . for me the less tapdancing at a gig the more i can just play and enjoy it

just compressor, OD , tremelo in front

and flanger and timeline delay in the loop

 

[ironjose]

that was exactly what is was thinking, get the essential stomps, an OD, a delay, chorus, and then some... lol

 

[JGMesa09]

I take the best of both worlds. I use G Major, Digitech GSP1101 and TSR-24S, with an amp switcher all ran midi. These are great for reverb, chorus', delays and weird synth stuff. In front of my amp i have my midi foot controller, a Boss flange that sounds great in front of amp, with my Dunlop Bass Wah (i like the frequency range, however, since i play guitar for a Tool Tribute Band i plan on getting the 535Q Wah soon) then Volume Pedal and Boss Loop Pedal so i can click on/off all the pedal board stuff with one.

The thing about FX processors is that i can create TONS of different effects and settings and with different parameters, mix and match etc. etc.

 

[LesPaul70]

I'd say it really depends on two basic things...

1) How much do you need your effects?

For great many years, I thought I needed lots of effects, all this and that, because I had heard it on such and such great album or song, and wanted to get a roughly similar kind of sound. Or thought I did. Multi-FX units are great for that, they have tons and tons of different weird sounds on tap.

Then...
over the years, I realized I was actually using fewer and fewer effects, and concentrating on my playing and the actual songs instead. The effects were only an unnecessary distraction from that. So, one by one, I was removing pedals from my board. Currently it's down to a compressor/OD in front of the amp, and a delay in the loop for some of the solos I play, and that's all I need or use live, really.

So, as a rule of thumb:
If you need and actually use lots of different effects, multi-FX is probably your thing.
If you only need a handful of different effects, you're probably better off getting single stompboxes.


2) How particular are you about your tone?

All modern multi-FX units do AD/DA conversion (yes, some stompboxes do, too). It will usually result in tone loss. Some people are more sensitive to this than others, and some units are worse than the others. It is definitely noticeable on most units - maybe not so much on the considerably higher-end units like Fractal Axe-FX. But whether you're willing to invest that much in a digital FX unit is another matter.

Of course individual stompboxes can also suck your tone big time. Contrary to popular belief, true bypass is not a silver bullet to great tone here. A good buffered pedal can sound just as good or even better.

Another rule of thumb:
If you are a tone snob, you will probably want carefully handpicked stompboxes that don't offend your ear.
If you are not too picky, you will probably be perfectly happy with a multi-FX unit. You might not even notice a difference. Your audience probably won't anyway.

 

[papersoul]

Personal preference. For me, stomps all the way!

 

[screamingdaisy]

All modern multi-FX units do AD/DA conversion (yes, some stompboxes do, too). It will usually result in tone loss. Some people are more sensitive to this than others, and some units are worse than the others. It is definitely noticeable on most units - maybe not so much on the considerably higher-end units like Fractal Axe-FX. But whether you're willing to invest that much in a digital FX unit is another matter.

[edit]

If you are a tone snob, you will probably want carefully handpicked stompboxes that don't offend your ear.
If you are not too picky, you will probably be perfectly happy with a multi-FX unit. You might not even notice a difference. Your audience probably won't anyway.

I'd just like to add that while it's really easy to be a tone snob while you're sitting at home and listening to your guitar amp under a microscope, pretty much all the finely tuned nuances of your tone disappear the second the drummer hits his snare.

It's been my experience that the logistics of setting up and performing are more important than purity of tone, and that the use of multi-effects and midi controllers greatly aid in making a guitarists life easier while on stage.

That said, some dudes are great at controlling 20+ pedals without missing a beat. Myself, I'd rather focus on playing my guitar and engaging the audience than trying to remember to tap two or three pedals when switching from the verse to chorus to verse several times a song.

 

[elvis]

All modern multi-FX units do AD/DA conversion (yes, some stompboxes do, too). It will usually result in tone loss. Some people are more sensitive to this than others, and some units are worse than the others. It is definitely noticeable on most units - maybe not so much on the considerably higher-end units like Fractal Axe-FX. But whether you're willing to invest that much in a digital FX unit is another matter.[/i]

This is largely not true. This wasn't even really true when it was true.

Modern AD/DA equipment is transparent to well below the threshold of even Neil Young's ears. Granted, a few cheap apples spoil the bunch, but largely the converters are AWESOME.

The reason people have problems interfacing with digital equipment:

1. Impedance mismatch. Even without the converters, connecting your amp's high output impedance to a low-impedance circuit makes a filter. An ANALOG filter. This is also why some FX boxes sound different depending on the order you place them. Can be easily solved with a BUFFER.

2. Latency. This means that the converters delay your signal slightly as they process them to or from data, and the DSP delays it when it does the math required to calculate the FX algorithm. The delays are very small (generally <1ms) which you cannot hear (the delay of audio in air from one ear to the other is about 20ms, which you CAN hear). However, mixing the delayed signal with a dry, non-delayed signal from the amp (via a parallel, or partially-parallel FX loop) also causes a filter. An ANALOG filter. This one you can blame partly on the amp and partly on the FX box. The issue is that you cannot convert or process signals in zero time, and amps cannot be built with 100% series loops without an extra $200 or so added to the price tag to separate the pre-loop and post-loop signals. Every amp I am aware of has some bleed around the loop.

3. The ANALOG circuits in the FX boxes aren't always well-designed. Remember, if it was designed by digital-savvy people, they probably got the analog circuits out of a book. Or from Google.

 

[Jackie]

I much prefer multi fx for live use. I'm just not talented enough to switch amp channels, turn on a delay pedal, turn off a chorus pedal, hit the solo switch, all the while singing, and all on one beat.

What he said! I don't think talent has anything to do with it, I'd rather make life easier.

I found most multiFX units to be quite transparent WHEN you match the levels or in other words achieve unity gain. I dime my output knob on my GT and use the internal Patch Level parameter to set the level, that way I can save the level and have a transparent signal all the time. Yeah you have to do it for each patch individually but once it's set it's set.

 

[LesPaul70]

Modern AD/DA equipment is transparent to well below the threshold of even Neil Young's ears. Granted, a few cheap apples spoil the bunch, but largely the converters are AWESOME.

The reason people have problems interfacing with digital equipment:

1. Impedance mismatch.
(...)

2. Latency.
(...)

3. The ANALOG circuits in the FX boxes aren't always well-designed.
(...)

I bow to your superior understanding of the matter. I had simply observed that most MFX units (at least those that didn't cost $1000 or more) tended to slightly degrade your amp tone. Some more, some less. Apparently I was wrong when I blamed it on the converters, though.

However, I fully agree with screamingdaisy here:

pretty much all the finely tuned nuances of your tone disappear the second the drummer hits his snare.

And that's the truth!