Stiletto Ace 1x12 or 2x12 for Gigging?

[onelastrun2002]

Hi everyone, this is my first post to any forum although I am a long-time reader here. I will get right to the point; I play in a modern hard rock band (think Breaking Benjamin, Theory of a Deadman, etc.) that gigs out once or twice a month at smaller clubs/bars. For the last year or so I have been running a Dual Rec. half stack but am now starting to question using it for several reasons (no particular order):

1) It is a pain (literally) to haul around.
2) It has to stay at the rehearsal space because I have a car (we borrow a van for gigs) so I can't jam on it at home.
3) I don't care about having the look of a 1/2 stack back line.
4) Every place we've played has mic'd the cab thru the PA and I've gotten my onstage volume from the floor monitors.
5) Numerous times I have been told to turn down during soundcheck. A fairly well respected sound guy at one of the clubs told me "reasonable stage volume = good FOH mix". To that end, I have resorted to running it at 50 watts (2 tubes pulled) and using a Hot Plate to get a good tone at lower volume.

So...I started looking at combos, naturally started with Mesa, came across the Stiletto Ace, and was very impressed. I prefer EL34's (I use them in the Dual Rec.) and surprised at how good and full the Ace sounded, especially the bass response with the closed back.

So here are my questions for people that have been in a similar situation:

1) Is going to a combo a good idea overall? Pluses or minuses in addition to what I mentioned above? Any drawbacks from a gigging stand point?

2) Is it worth the extra $100 and added weight to get the 2x12 as opposed the 1x12? The cab size is the same. I tried both and they sounded about the same but wasn't able to really crank them wide open in the store so I don't know. The sales guy (non-commission) said that the 2x12 would sound fuller with more low end thump (which would effect me at rehearsal but not live so much as only one speaker gets mic'd anyway, right?) and that it would have a better re-sale value.

3) If I go with it I think I am going to special order a black one. The store quoted 6-8 weeks. Anyone have any experience with ordering an amp from Mesa? Are these time quotes reliable?

Any advice and answers are appreciated; sorry for the long post. Thanks.

P.S. Anyone know what pro touring bands do? We've played some of the same venues that book national acts and these guys roll in with 100 watt full stacks that get mic'd (albeit just one speaker) as well. Even if one cab is for back-up and/or show their onstage volume must still be as loud as hell. What's the secret?

 

[Maury]

P.S. Anyone know what pro touring bands do? We've played some of the same venues that book national acts and these guys roll in with 100 watt full stacks that get mic'd (albeit just one speaker) as well. Even if one cab is for back-up and/or show their onstage volume must still be as loud as hell.

I've opened up for several national acts over the past few years, and most of the time its been at the same venue... we've been around soundchecks onstage and near-stage. Many of these acts do have 1/2 stacks and/or full stacks, but the stage volume has been far quieter than I ever expected ... almost every time. I think it is true that quiet stage volumes = great FOH mix and I'll bet most touring acts "play nice" when it comes to stage volumes. At least the acts I've seen upclose.

If your're hearing yourself via monitors as much as you say, I can't see any downside to getting a combo.

 

[jamme61]

If you can lift the 2x12 get it, I think the 2x12 will sound better and is well worth the $100. The 1x12 and 2x12 are the same size (as you stated) and only about 10 LBS difference in weight.

 

[Anonymous]

actually the 2x12" ace weights one speaker more than the 1x12' version. which is quite a lot when carrying by yourself in a car or taxi. in vans with other band equipment i would not mind.

personally for frequent gigging i'd prefer a head/cab combination by separated loads and maintenance. i had often experienced that the guitar monitor sound sucks (no feedback, flat sound, presence etc.) and i rely mostly on my guit speaker. a combo can be placed that the audience will not be effected and is directing to the guit player from the front.

I like the sound of the ACE and therefore accept to carry this load with a little help from my friends (mostly 2 at once, when it comes to powerful sessions even two more)

the ace cannot compare with a head n 4x12" cab, even the 2x12" version cannot. its a combo. but definetely a good one.

 

[jamme61]

your right the 2x12 is listed by mesa at 88lbs and the 1x12 at 78lbs. 88lbs is really tough. I am in the middle of this too: for me it's either 2x12 or the head? I do have two celestion neo's that weigh about 4lbs each, that might work?

 

[jtb226]

Why don't you put EL34's in your Dual Rec, sell your 4x12 and get a 2x12 cabinet? That way you don't have to spend nearly as much $ to get the sound you want. And also, with a 2x12, the stage volume won't seem as loud because the cab isn't facing your ears.

Plus, instead of having 1 very heavy thing to carry, you'll separate the load into 2 pieces.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes the SOUND! the ace 2x12" hits it really marvellous. I asked myself if I was going for the sound or the handling and looks. the choice was easy ;-)

 

[fabien]

I too would go for 2x12. It's a big difference with a 1x12 so I guess going from 4x12 to 1x12... you might be disappointed/frustrated.
I'd also go for a head/cab instead of combo. Total weight is more to carry but you can balance the weight in both hands or carry it in to runs.
The cheapest way will be indeed to sell your 4x12 and get a 2x12 but if you like the tone of the stiletto...

 

[Platypus]

I've gigged the 2x12 Ace... it's a bear but it's not that terrible. Also, 10 more lbs is pretty insignificant when you're already carrying something heavy. I would go for the 2x12.. has such an awesome tone.

 

[Dusty Rhodes]

Here is another alternative which I did. I have the 1 x 12 combo with an additional 1 x12 matching wide body closed back extension cab. The sound is seems to be fuller as there is more air space to move. You can also separate the two for better coverage. It's the best of both worlds but the down side is the added cost of around $600.00. It looks pretty sweet too if you stack the combo on top of the extension cab. The matching green tolex and grill cloth looks killer.

 

[jab]

I know exactly how you feel. I have dropped the combo/4-12's concept and gone with an Ace head, and 1x12 and 2 x 12 Roadster cabs. Why? It's not so heavy and big to lug around, it's portable, I can keep one cab at rehearsal space and one cab at home (just take my head back & forth), and stack them both for a gig. I can't say I can really tell the difference between the 1-12 or 2-12 cab. The 1-12 has a small port-hole in the back, and is lighter obviously. It REALLY kicks it out for a 1-12. 2-12 probably is a bit bigger sounding, especially when sitting on the floor but at any gig I do, I mic a cabinet and sound comes through the mains anyway. I keep my rig on the side of the stage facing directly in so me and the other guys can hear it, and let the mic / mains supply the crowd. I'd probably be just as happy with 2 1x12's stacked. Another reason for the 2 cabs is on top of the bigger sound, your head is at least waist high and not down at your knees.

 

[onelastrun2002]

Thanks to everyone that replied. I just ordered the Ace 2x12 combo in black. I've really decided to give the Ace a try and buying the head and a 2x12 was out of my budget. 6-8 weeks till delivery (hopefully more like 6!). I've decided not to sell my 1/2 stack yet so I figure I'll do some gigs with the Ace and if it doesn't work out, I'll just sell it (hopefully at a small loss). Thanks again.

 

[jamme61]

I have the ace 2x12 combo and It is freakin heavy. I have already replaced the 2 V30's with 2 celestion Neo (had these for a long time)vintage speakers to save some weight. Looking at the weights on the celestion site, I should be saving about 14LBS in weight with the neo's which still leaves the amp very heavy LOL. I got so used to just grabbing my combo and going to the gig that I didn't want to go back to the head and cab thing. I think you'll be very happy all the best with the amp

 

[Bikedude]

I'll add my .02 here. I had a 2X12 LSC, and now I have a 1X12. To me the single 12 sounds fuller than the 2X12 I had. Don't know why, it just does. So why waste the $$ for more weight. Get the 1X12. Altought your talking about the Ace here, i don't think it would be much different than the LSC. BTW, I have a set of the JJ EL34's in my LSC, and it gets real close to the Ace, with a little more clean headroom to boot.

 

[jamme61]

I'll add my .02 here. I had a 2X12 LSC, and now I have a 1X12. To me the single 12 sounds fuller than the 2X12 I had. Don't know why, it just does. So why waste the $$ for more weight. Get the 1X12. Altought your talking about the Ace here, i don't think it would be much different than the LSC. BTW, I have a set of the JJ EL34's in my LSC, and it gets real close to the Ace, with a little more clean headroom to boot.

I did like my Express in the 1x12 (open back) better then the 2x12(open back) but, the ace 2x12 is a sealed 2x12 cab, and the amp gets into higher gain tones, which makes it different IMHO. The sealed back with the higher gain stuff adds a lot to the tone, (you get the thump). The ace 2x12 and 1x12 are the same size, the weight difference is the extra speaker (10LBS more 2x12= 88LBS vs. 1x12 = 68lbs). If the 1x12 ace was physically smaller then, I might have looked at it. FYI The celestion vintage Neo's sound fantastic in the ace and get the weight down 14LBS which makes my 2x12 ace 64LBS, 4 LBS les then the 1x12 ace. some people will like the sound of a 1x12 vs. a 2x12, I did in the lower gain, smaller size, express. You have to try and play this stuff at the store, which is tough because the GC's by me don't like to carry the whole mesa line. I played the ace 2x12 at GC for a week till I took it home.