Speaker options for my Boogie...

[jimtalkbox]

Hello Everyone,

I've got a Mesa/Boogie Subway Rocket combo that I've had for over 10 years. It's a pretty good little tube amp (a very loud 20 watts, 2 EL84, 4 12AX7, 1x10" Black Shadow Eminence) but I've grown weary of the tone lately. The tone is very Mesa, fairly dark and tight. Whenever I play through it I just get the sense that the speaker just isn't putting out what the amp is capable of, so I'm on a quest to find a suitable replacement speaker.

I primarily record, but play small gigs about 6-12 times a year. I primarily play basic rock music like The Beatles, Tom Petty, etc. as well as some contemporary Rock/Pop stuff. I use a variety of guitars, (The basics: Strat, Tele, Les Paul, SG, Dano, and a few guitars with P-90s, just whatever feels good that day...) and would like to find a replacement speaker that will match well with this amp. The main characteristics I like in an amp are String-to-String clarity and a fairly focused sound. As far as I can figure, the best options I've found are:

1.) Buying a 1x12 extension cab (Lopoline, Avatar, etc.)

2.) Buying a 2x12 extension cab (same as above, although I don't think it would be driven hard enough)

3.) Replacing the stock speaker with one of these:

Eminence:
The Copperhead
Ragin Cajun
Red Fang 10

Celestion:
G10 Vintage
G10 Greenback

Jensen:
MOD 10-35

Weber:
British - Alnico Blue Pup 10"
British - Silver Ten
Alnico - 10VS

This is my first experience with trying to replace a speaker as all of my amps just have the stock speakers in them. I don't know the pros and cons of my options but want to get the best possible sound out of my amp while trying not to burn too big of a hole in my wallet. Any opinions or help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Anonymous]

Right now I've got a 2x12 Avatar that I use with my Bogner Ecstasy. It rocks! If I could recommend something to you, it would probably be - since you use your amp primarily for recording purposes - to get a 2x12 Avatar with some lower powered speakers in it.

I've got a Celestion V30 and G12H30, and this combination is phenomenal for clean through distorted stuff. Something that may work even better for you would be to get a Greenback and an H30, for a 50W cab.

Now I recommend this for two reasons. First off, a 2x12 is going to sound a lot bigger than a 1x12, let alone a 1x10. It's going to have a sound that, for rock, will work really well. Second, the speakers I would go with, since they're relatively low wattage, will be pushed pretty well by your amp. On a recording, this'll give you an excellent tone, and since there's two speakers, you can have multiple options as to how you go about getting your sound.

The other thing worth mentioning is that the Greenbacks and H30s are probably the most prominent on classic rock recordings of any speakers.

 

[jimtalkbox]

I've read about that mixture of speakers. (V30 and G12H30) At one point a few months ago I had considered getting a 2x12, and now I'm thinking that may be the best option for me. I think the stock 10" speaker really limits that amp.

Anybody else have any other suggestions?

 

[Old BF Shred]

I have a Studio Cal. 22+ that I have used with 1x12, 2x12 and 4x12 cabs (all with various celestions) and all combinations can peel paint! :shock:

Most guitar speakers are fairly sensitive (efficient), esp. most of the Celestions.

Magic8's suggestion of a 2x12 is probably gonna be the best combination of size, low end thrust and "lighter" weight for hauling (compared to a 4x12). Even a 1x12 in combination with the internal 1x10 could be an awesome set up. Just be sure the impedance matches OK when adding more cabs.

Either way, it will be LOUD :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

 

[soundchaser59]

For the sound I think you are after, you will not find peace simply by switching out single 10 inch speakers inside the amp. I would go a step further and suggest that you will not easily find a 10 inch speaker that sound better than the Black Shadow that's in there. IF it's stock, then it's probably a Celestion BS anyway, so switching out with other Celestions won't, imo, get you anywhere.

You will get the most mileage from using an external cab with 12 inch speakers. My Rocket sounded fantabulous thru 12's. I had good luck with Weber Michigans for the Rocket, but you wont really know unless you buy some and try them yourself. After cycling thru 3-4 dozen speakers in the 10 and 12 inch class, I've concluded that the best bets are EVM12L, Eminence Commonwealth, Tone Tubby, Cannabis Rex, and the 15 inch Weber alnico Blue Dog. The JBL's are supposed to keep pace with the EV's but I've never been able to find one that I could afford or bid enough to win!

And if you like speaker breakup, you might want to test drive some alnicos. If not, then ceramics are good, seems to me they dont breakup as early as the alnicos do when you push the amp power output.

By the way, the 10 inch G10 Greenback is great sound, but very flimsy build quality in the frames, despite being "Made in the UK" according to the label. So if you get one, treat it with kid gloves when you mount it. The 12 inch Greenbacks are a bit tougher, and sound much better to me than the V30's ever will. A couple of retailers have told me that Tone Tubby is the only guitar speaker builder that has not downgraded to thinner gauge basket metal recently.

 

[jimtalkbox]

Thanks for the opinions! I think I'm going to go with either a 1x12 or a 2x12 cab. Now the speaker options are what's going to be the hard part!

I saw some vids online that showed cabs that would have 2 speakers that could be run independently or together, that would really be versatile!

I haven't researched 12" speakers by Weber or Jensen as much yet, but after doing a lot of research on Eminence and Celestion speakers I'm looking at:

Celestion Vintage 30
Celestion Classic Lead
Eminence Wizard
Eminence Man O War

I really liked the clarity in the Man O War (sound samples and vids). My biggest "want" in an amp set up is "string to string" clarity. I play a lot of weird chords and it's frustrating not to hear all the notes in a chord (with moderate gain) when I'm playing. Obviously, the speaker isn't the only factor in this, but I want an option that will help. I'm open to more suggestions if anyone's got 'em!

 

[soundchaser59]

If I understand what you mean by "string to string clarity" then it will, me thinks, amount to more than just amp choice and speaker choice. (The Celestion Hot 100 and the Weber Silver Bell come to mind, also!)

Those are the two biggies, but......

You might want to experiment with an EQ pedal and maybe a good clean compressor. I have not foudn anything to beat an Allums modded GE7 and Allums modded Dyna Comp, although the modded CS3 is pretty good. Comp to even out any uneven string hits by the player, and EQ to even out the overal tonal spectrum response up and down the neck. I think it gives the amp + speaker a better chance of spitting out what you want to hear.

 

[nomad100hd]

i'd hate carrying around a combo and a cab. you should make a head cab for the amp part of the combo and take it out of the combo

 

[harryjmic]

I have a Subway blues and just got done with a Scumback speaker in it. Great tone for leads but between the amp's voicing and the speaker I thought it got to be a bit too midrangy for me.

I just picked up a Weber California (think JBL) I am hoping this speaker gives me a bit more Fender vibe and a little less mids. When I hit it with an overdrive (already a lot of mids there) I don't want it to be over the top, just right there in the sweet spot. I would like to open up the frequency response a bit (small speaker issue I believe) my thought is a EV or JBL type speaker will do this better then anything else out there.

 

[badboybubby]

I have an original Subway Blues with the 10" Eminence. I use a close backed, ported Thiele cab with a 200W 12" EV for an extension speaker. The combination of the open backed stock speaker with the close backed EV is awesome. The presence and punch is great compared to the somewhat wimpy sound of the 10" by itself.