Sound Clips! 6l6 vs. EL34

[arvee72]

Update 08/26/2010: Man, I like EL34's in my Mark V. Haven't had a chance to get the new 6l6's installed, and may not go back. See my latest post in this thread for a current sound clip.


*********Update 05/10/2010: One pair of 6l6's is being replaced by Mesa under warranty. I was 2 weeks over the 6 month tube warranty but they were gracious enough to send a pair anyway.*********

Once the new tubes arrive and I achieve a quiet amp with 6l6's, I will re-record the clips and post the results.

Update 5/24: Received one matched pair of 6l6's from Mesa. I will post new clips soon.

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Hi folks.

I have been struggling with noise issues (mainly in channel 1 EDIT 05/07/10: Probably caused by CH1 being at 90 Watts and CH2 and CH3 at lower wattage, therefore outer tube may be defective) in my Mk5 since day one.

I recently swapped the stock 6l6 tubes for EL34's as an experiment in tone, but also found that it caused my noise issues to disappear.

Rig:

ESP Eclipse II (less than one week old, factory stock 2010 model) EMG 81 in bridge.
Evidence Audio Melody cables, all true bypass pedals (tuner/modfactor/)
Mesa Mark 5 combo (5 months old)
Preamp tubes: Original Stock Mesa 12ax7's in all positions except V1 JJ ECC803 (I originally tried to solve the noise with this tube)
Mesa Slave Out (noon position) into a Palmer PDI-09 set to "Normal" and "0" attenuation.
Presonus Firepod
Sony Acid Pro 7
Recorded as 24/96 WAV, bounced to 16 bit/ 44.1 WAV

Material:

A riff from a Porcupine Tree tune called "Blackest Eyes". Drop D tuning on the low E, otherwise, standard tuning.
My playing is sloppy, but the tonal differences will shine through.

Amp Settings:
Channel 3 MK IV mode
45 Watt mode
EQ off
Loop in Hard Bypass
Bright: On
Gain at 2 o'clock
All other controls at Noon.

6l6 clip (original stock Mesa 6l6's, bias switch set accordingly)

http://www.box.net/shared/3lpjerr39g

el34 clip (Mesa EL34 tubes purchased at GC this past weekend, bias switch set accordingly)

http://www.box.net/shared/h6euuaydyv

My observations

-I use too much gain! I need to lay off the gain knob a bit!
-The EL34's completely eliminated all noise at idle (possibly had a bad 6l6? anyone?)
-The El34's are much less compressed sounding (6l6's break up earlier? not a bad thing though..)
-Although I didn't record it, the cleans are much "sweeter" sounding with the EL34's. I love the cleans now.

In conclusion, I love EL34's in the Mark 5 with my Eclipse. When I get my strat back from the shop I will post my observations.
I have to wonder, however, if my noise issues were caused by a faulty 6l6?

 

[MesaManBoogie]

I liked the EL34's tighter tone, better tone overall.

 

[borisson]

I liked the EL34's tighter tone, better tone overall.

Thats strange, from my experience i would say that its the otherway around. I had the Mesa EL34s in and the 6L6s were much tighter and balsier. More like the clip here with EL34.

 

[phyrexia]

you got you some bad power tubes, son

call mesa and tell them you think your 6l6s are bad, but do it quick before your 6 month tube warranty is out. explain you switched to 34s and the noise went away. they probably won't try to diagnose which tube, just send you either a duet or a quad.

 

[4406cuda]

I prefer the the tighter bass and cleans from a 6L6. I am using SED 6L6s

 

[arvee72]

I swapped the 6l6's back in to try to troubleshoot the noise issue.

I was getting noise in all channels in 90 and 45 watt mode, then I swapped the 2 matched inner tubes for the 2 outer tubes.

Well, noise in the 45 watt mode disappeared, however, the 90 watt mode (which employs the outer tube pair) has plenty of noise at idle.

Here is sound clip where I'm switching between 90 and 45 Watt modes on channel one using the exact gear as in my original post.
Notice the high noise floor, then a "click" when I toggle down to 45 watt mode, then beautiful silence. That's the same silence I enjoyed when I swapped in the EL34s for the first time.

(Turn the volume up a bit)

http://www.box.net/shared/static/thlhrnueb8.wav

Clearly my 6l6's are affecting the noise issue, and no doubt the overall tone in 90 watt mode..

Add this to the equation: http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=46129

 

[arvee72]

Update:

One pair of 6l6's is being replaced by Mesa under warranty. I was 2 weeks over the 6 month tube warranty but they were gracious enough to send a pair anyway.

Once the new tubes arrive and I achieve a quiet amp with 6l6's, I will re-record the clips and post the results.

 

[arvee72]

OK folks.. sorry about the wait, but I spent some time getting used to the EL34s. I have yet to swap in the new 6l6's.

Here's a quick clip of one of my band's rehearsals. (lead sounds this time)

http://www.box.net/shared/mz49vko2pm

SM57 this time (The Palmer is cool, but not as "smooth" as the mic IMHO).

No effects used, just guitar to amp ( via Evidence melody cable). Reverb added in DAW mixdown.

The clip was recorded using an entry level Yamaha mixer with inserts feeding the Firepod.

Same ESP Eclipse with EMGs.

 

[rick297]

Ok ive looked at the posts re the valves. Just to let you guys know, that i have changeed from the 6L6 valves to EL34 s this week.I installed the EL34/SVETLANA/WINGED C 1999-2000 valves from Watford Valves England as recommended by them.

Well all i can say is that the bottom end is a lot tighter, i note someone said the 6L6 are tighter, well thats just not the case. I have the combo by the way , and found the rock sound a bit flabby on the bottom end. I could not EQ this out at all.

Now tha amp sounds tighter and harder and the bass eq on channel 2 really works. The sound is close to the Marshall , but a bit smoother i would say.

The clean channel is not quite as clean with a noticeable fiz on decay of the notes, but still a really nice clean sound, albeit not as good as 6L6, if you do want to use mainly clean sounds i would recommend using the 6L6 valves.

Oh and according to Messa power valves make little differance to the sound, im afraid thats just not true in my experience. I think this is a great improvement to the sound and agree this should be a shipping option with the Amp

Hope this helps as i spent £150 on valves and could not get any real assesment of if it would work, luckily it did

 

[Adambomb]

I recently switched from 6L6 to EL34 and there is a huge tone difference. Love the EL34's punchy harder mid range. Getting more of a JCM 800 and EVH tone now. I just threw some old EH EL34's in there for now, but will soon be ordering some Winged =C= EL34's.