So.. is my Mark III supposed to sound this bad?

[kwirk]

I made a thread on here a few months back about how bad my Mark III was sounding, so I finally got around to fixing it up. I did it locally, which I suppose was probably a big mistake. It's not the settings because believe me, I've messed around with it for a looong time.

I brought into a local Mesa authorized shop to get it fixed up. I've heard only good things about this place, which is why I opted not to send it to Mesa. They did fix the few problems I had with it, such as the reverb and the mid EQ slider going out (well, so far so good), but the middle EQ knob still seems to act as a gain/volume knob more than it does a mid knob. That's great and all, but the amp still sounds the same as it did before I brought it in. Ugh.


Anyway, here's how it sounds without and with a tubescreamer:

http://soundcloud.com/axiong427/wtfffffffffff/s-mOBzk

Someone please tell me Mark IIIs are not supposed to sound like this. It sounds pretty good with a tubescreamer in front of it, but I wouldn't think it'd be that lifeless without one.


Edit;
Well, just as I suspected, the mid controls have gone out again. Guess I'll call the shop back when I can.

 

[dodger916]

Good and bad are subjective terms, so I'll just say this: I would not want an amp that sounds like that. I've heard Mark IIIs that sound much "better".

 

[SonicProvocateur]

No, something is wrong.

The Mark III being a heavy mid voiced amp, the mid knob is a pretty subtle control and doesn't add gain - but the treble knob does which in conjunction with the mid and pull shifts controls a very wide frequency band.

I have some difficulty recording my Mesa, moreso than other amps, and dodger is right; tone is subjective - but if you think something is up, than it is. When you dial in the Boogie lead tone, you KNOW it, and it shouldn't sound off.

 

[chipaudette]

Wow, you've got it really saturated out. The effect of the mid pot can be subtle, and with that much saturation, it's tough to hear any impact that the mid pot might have.

So, if you're concerned about the mid pot in particular, and if your mid pot happens to be working again, could you turn down the gain a bit (like to 2-3 on the lead drive) and then record a clip with the mids on zero, with the the mids on 5, and with the mids on full. I'd recommend that you play a couple of bar chords part-way up the neck (like A major on the 5th fret) and then maybe some slow single-note stuff (like maybe just up and down the A minor pentatonic box). Just make it slow, so that we can hear the attack separately from the sustain...that's where the mid pot most shows its effect (IMHO).

When in the lead channel, remember that all three of the tone control pots come before the distortion circuit. Therefore, they don't have as dramatic a sonic effect as some might expect. The Graphic EQ comes after the distortion circuit, which is why it has so much more authority over your tone compared to the Treble/Bass/Mid pots.

The mid pot and the bass pot do have some effect on the sound, but they really have more of an effect on the feel of the notes and chords. Depending on your settings and your guitar, the mid and bass pots can make your notes feel skinny and slahsing, or it can give them some girth and meet, or it can make them feel flabby and bloated. In my opinion, the mid pot is definitely a balancing act when at high gain...too much is bad for chords, too little is bad for single note leads (depending on your style).


Also, when you lose the mid pot, do your other tone controls stop working? Or does just the mid pot stop working while the Treble and Bass pot continue to work normally?

Chip

 

[Restless Rocks]

What Stripe is your MkIII? What tubes are you using? What speaker/s are you using?

 

[sduck]

I'm not an authority, but in addition to the above requests, before passing any kind of judgement I'd want to know exactly what guitar you're using, which pickups, what speakers are involved, etc. Also I'd want a recording with only a cord, no effects, volume and tone on the guitar full up, and would need to know how it was recorded. In other words, what you've presented so far might be as good as it gets depending on how it was recorded - no way of knowing.

 

[kwirk]

Wow, you've got it really saturated out. The effect of the mid pot can be subtle, and with that much saturation, it's tough to hear any impact that the mid pot might have.

So, if you're concerned about the mid pot in particular, and if your mid pot happens to be working again, could you turn down the gain a bit (like to 2-3 on the lead drive) and then record a clip with the mids on zero, with the the mids on 5, and with the mids on full. I'd recommend that you play a couple of bar chords part-way up the neck (like A major on the 5th fret) and then maybe some slow single-note stuff (like maybe just up and down the A minor pentatonic box). Just make it slow, so that we can hear the attack separately from the sustain...that's where the mid pot most shows its effect (IMHO).

When in the lead channel, remember that all three of the tone control pots come before the distortion circuit. Therefore, they don't have as dramatic a sonic effect as some might expect. The Graphic EQ comes after the distortion circuit, which is why it has so much more authority over your tone compared to the Treble/Bass/Mid pots.

The mid pot and the bass pot do have some effect on the sound, but they really have more of an effect on the feel of the notes and chords. Depending on your settings and your guitar, the mid and bass pots can make your notes feel skinny and slahsing, or it can give them some girth and meet, or it can make them feel flabby and bloated. In my opinion, the mid pot is definitely a balancing act when at high gain...too much is bad for chords, too little is bad for single note leads (depending on your style).


Also, when you lose the mid pot, do your other tone controls stop working? Or does just the mid pot stop working while the Treble and Bass pot continue to work normally?

Chip

I wasn't really using that much gain (before the tubescreamer). I've tried it with lower gain, different channels, etc, it just seems to increase volume/gain when I turn the mid pot up. Doesn't do anything to the mid range at all. The mid pot always 'works', it's the 750 slider that goes in and out. When it goes out, the other sliders still work.

It's a blue stripe. JJ 6L6GCs in the power section and JJ ECC83Ss in the preamp. Running it through a Mesa 2x12 horizontal Rectifier cab - V30s with an SM57 right in the center of one of the speakers. Stock Ibanez RG7421.

Anyway, I contacted the shop and they're going to take it back in and fix it up free of charge, since I specifically mentioned the problems with the mid slider/knob to the guy at the place and they obviously didn't do anything about it.

 

[kdorsey]

Post your specific knob settings, too. There are too many variables involved here to make a sound comment.

 

[Neptical]

Wow, yeah...that certainly doesn't sound like a Mark III. As mentioned above though, anything could be a factor ( crappy generic tubes, bad tubes in general, speakers,pickups,etc.). Although, according to your statement, doesn't sound like it's your guitar or your cab. I've found if you have some poor quality tubes in and use a V setting (especially bottoming out the 750hz slider) on the GEQ, it just makes everything sound 10x worse. Not a fan of the JJs, but it definitely shouldn't sound like that. Hmmm - curious. Give us the word when you find out.

 

[okgb]

I'm still there , I have a black stripe mkIII bought new in the 80's
thought it sounded good then but when i fired it after years of sitting around ,
pretty stinky , did the cap mods , psu , better but still un-inspiring ,
Either too thin , or then too bass heavy with a erratic sustain that dies out
too quickly on the lead channel .
I'd sell it if i could get anything reasonable for it , or trade for a triaxis

 

[Neptical]

I'm still there , I have a black stripe mkIII bought new in the 80's
thought it sounded good then but when i fired it after years of sitting around ,
pretty stinky , did the cap mods , psu , better but still un-inspiring ,
Either too thin , or then too bass heavy with a erratic sustain that dies out
too quickly on the lead channel .
I'd sell it if i could get anything reasonable for it , or trade for a triaxis

Something is definitely up. Sounds like it could use a nice new fresh set of tubes in both preamp and power section if you haven't done that already. Your description sure doesn't sound anything like I get out of my IIIs.

 

[okgb]

I've played around with the tubes a little , best so far is a telefunken in v1
and ditching the el 34's in the simul class , also having a friend come over with his
IIC+ and trying to match the sound , but
there's still something thats un nice about it , not really a smooth long sustain
on the lead drive , again I replaced the psu caps and did a few of the common mods
all improvements have been subtle