Potential New JP2C Owner

[rarebitusa]

On a side note, now that I have this for myself, I may research four-cable method and midi control for the channels with my Fractal FM9.

FWIW I run 4CM with all my Mesas and a midi controller upfront to control multiple devices. Can't live without it now.

 

[ntotoro]

FWIW I run 4CM with all my Mesas and a midi controller upfront to control multiple devices. Can't live without it now.

Sweet!!! Can the FM9 itself function as a controller?

 

[rarebitusa]

Sweet!!! Can the FM9 itself function as a controller?

I currently have the Boss GT-1k Core, a GT-100 before that, never went down the Fractal rabbit hole even though they are great solutions. In the Boss case they are really not designed to be a flexible midi controller, the options for sending midi is limited but perhaps the fractal is more versatile in that regard. dunno.

If all you need is to send midi commands to the JP2C would think that should be possible. I had a need to send commands to 3 midi devices so an FCB1010 worked well. YMMV

 

[ntotoro]

I've been using the FM9 a few years for home recording and gigs where I just need a quick setup... like really quick. Thinking it would make a nice "backup" solution or using a bank of presets just for controlling the JP2C and replacing a few of my pedals.

Do the 2x12 cabs sound considerably different from the Recto 1x12?

 

[rarebitusa]

Do the 2x12 cabs sound considerably different from the Recto 1x12?

From my experience.. some of it depends on the cab. I have a custom vertical 2x12 that sounds very different then my Std Recto 2x12. The vert has a big sound, deep with major presence but it's a bigger enclosure. Personally the closed back Recto 2x12 with v30s, while punchy and focused lacked alot of the depth I want in a cab. In comparison my WB 1x12 has more depth and resonance then the Recto 2x12 and even rivals the vert cab.

I think you mentioned the slant 1x12 with a v30. It's a pretty shallow cab @ 11" which may be a reason it's boxy?? dunno. But for sure that v30 has to get broken in well.

 

[ntotoro]

From my experience.. some of it depends on the cab. I have a custom vertical 2x12 that sounds very different then my Std Recto 2x12. The vert has a big sound, deep with major presence but it's a bigger enclosure. Personally the closed back Recto 2x12 with v30s, while punchy and focused lacked alot of the depth I want in a cab. In comparison my WB 1x12 has more depth and resonance then the Recto 2x12 and even rivals the vert cab.

I think you mentioned the slant 1x12 with a v30. It's a pretty shallow cab @ 11" which may be a reason it's boxy?? dunno. But for sure that v30 has to get broken in well.

It's been a minute since I've broken in a V30, but I do remember they need TLC. This won't be a performance cab, just for home use... but I'd still like to optimize it LOL! Missed a great deal locally on a vertical 2x12, which has always intrigued me.

Edit: And just like that, that cab is available again LOL!

 

[Doug Doppler]

So far... clean channel is the clean channel. That was the one thing I knew for certain I could make work for me. In-between positions on my Suhr Classic S's, in particular, work really well. I worried at first that the crystal clear cleans wouldn't be my thing, but these sound good... they're not Rockman cleans LOL! Just a little tweaking and away we go!

On a side note, now that I have this for myself, I may research four-cable method and midi control for the channels with my Fractal FM9. It has balanced outputs, so I can even ditch my Analogman buffer!

Channel 2, I set up initially on JP's specs and went from there. Didn't tweak a ton just yet, just fine tuning. The Mark sound is definitely in my favor here!!! It has a thick, almost layered sound, but doesn't overpower the characteristic of any guitar. My Suhr's all have different pickups... V70's, V60LP's, ML Standards, Thornbucker+'s, Woodsheds and the Hots in my Modern 7... which we'll get too later LOL! None of them were overpowered by the amp, which is frequently the case with the Shiva.

All of them shined in their own ways, which was a very pleasant surprise! The V70's had never sounded better!!! These are pickups that, in the Helios, would rip your ears off (they're in a roasted alder Classic S), but here... they sing. All the pickups shine and it feels like you can tweak to your heart's delight!

The Thornbucker+ can take all the gain the amp has and never loses its growl. This was when I realized how much JP's guitars were really tweaked for his wants and needs. His sound is darker and thicker, even with his settings. I did mess with the mid-mids a lot on the GEQ and found a good sweet spot, which was a whisker higher than JP's settings.

The Modern 7 with Suhr Hots, definitely that darker, thicker sound. Never loses definition, but a little dark for me at bedroom volume until I turned on shred mode. Didn't need it as I turned up the volume, but it made a gigantic difference. It really wasn't THAT dark without it, just different to me and made me thankful that all my guitars were different from one another. That was both the bridge and neck pickups on that guitar. Maybe I'll consider something less hot, but it's different than my "usual" sound and suits that guitar.

Channel 3 was set up for leads, gain cranked... and never lost clarity. I wouldn't use it as my rhythm sound, but man... glorious for leads! They sang with every guitar definitely set up for leads, not my rhythm sounds, but worked with every guitar.

My little Recto 1x12 may be a hair boxy, but also doesn't have a whole lot of hours on it. Certainly not compared to my Bogner. Do these change a ton after break-in? Are the 2x12's better suited?

In reading back, it looks like you've got the Mini Rectifier 1x12 angled cab. I'm all about the tall boy recto 4x12 cabs, but own a pair of the 1x12 Rectifier cabinets as well, and noting that John was using them before this amp and that they were in his last touring rig, be it size and or price that would be a worthy option, be it stacked or spread. The other great match would be the Vertical Rectifier 2x12 cab as it helps you stay on axis better with your tone. I have the Horizontal 2x12 and it's a great and very popular cabinet, but since they tend to 'live' on the floor, you missed the reality of what the amp is saying that can be troublesome in mixes, be they live or otherwise. Being on axis with your top speakers is IMHO the BEST way to know your tone and it will aid in right hand articulation for pretty everything you play. The Mini Recto is great, but you'll miss out on some of the big-ness this amp has to deliver.

 

[ntotoro]

In reading back, it looks like you've got the Mini Rectifier 1x12 angled cab. I'm all about the tall boy recto 4x12 cabs, but own a pair of the 1x12 Rectifier cabinets as well, and noting that John was using them before this amp and that they were in his last touring rig, be it size and or price that would be a worthy option, be it stacked or spread. The other great match would be the Vertical Rectifier 2x12 cab as it helps you stay on axis better with your tone. I have the Horizontal 2x12 and it's a great and very popular cabinet, but since they tend to 'live' on the floor, you missed the reality of what the amp is saying that can be troublesome in mixes, be they live or otherwise. Being on axis with your top speakers is IMHO the BEST way to know your tone and it will aid in right hand articulation for pretty everything you play. The Mini Recto is great, but you'll miss out on some of the big-ness this amp has to deliver.

Sweet, thanks!!! I'll definitely be OTL for that local vertical cab!!!! You do miss so much when you can't discern your pick attack or even your legato.

 

[bandit2013]

I never tried a V30 as a single speaker in a small box before. I found most Celestion speakers as a unitary sound source can be well, not all that great. the Redback held up at 100W pushing gig level volumes. EV is the king as a single speaker or in a quad. Too bad they do not have 16 ohm versions as I would have converted on of my V212 by now.

I would assume you are running the amp at 60W? I did notice the was a tonal shift. Mesa states in the manual when using the 60W power mode to run the 8 ohm speaker in the 4 ohm jack. The issue with running a single 12 inch, you tend to push the amp harder to get the volume level where you want it. That may be pushing the speaker past its safe operating point, depends, if using the 60W into a 60W speaker, that should be fine.

As for the break-in? I am sure there is one, but I never really noticed it with the V30 loaded cabinets. If there is any shift in tone or performance, it is so gradual. I have compared a new V212 I got this year to one I had since 2016. Not much of a difference, at least to me anyways.

 

[ntotoro]

@bandit2013

Neither have I, that's what makes me curious. My Bogner cab is almost 20 years old with thousands of hours on it at this point. It's nice and broken in LOL!

I've been running it at 100 watts at 8ohm, but not terribly loudly. Looks like I have the wrong cab for my needs and that the vertical 2x12 may be better for even my home needs! Found one locally for $600.

 

[ntotoro]

Zombie updates... just to avoid putting stuff needlessly in a new thread.

Finally had the first band rehearsal with the JP2C into my Bogner OS 2x12. I've had that cab for almost 20 years and it has thousands of hours on it at band volume. It's V30's are well broken-in.

It just didn't get along well with the JP2C. I don't know if it was the V30's Reinhold uses or the cab itself. Thinned out the amp, made the unwound strings sound thinner, definitely not the same richness I was even getting from my small Recto 1x12, which moves a fraction of the air volume.

Guessing it's the cab itself... ? Or is it the Bogner V30's vs the Mesa V30's... ?

 

[rarebitusa]

It just didn't get along well with the JP2C. I don't know if it was the V30's Reinhold uses or the cab itself. Thinned out the amp, made the unwound strings sound thinner, definitely not the same richness I was even getting from my small Recto 1x12, which moves a fraction of the air volume.

I do believe the Mesa v30s are different. Is the Bogner a 4 ohm or 8 ohm cab?

 

[ntotoro]

I do believe the Mesa v30s are different. Is the Bogner a 4 ohm or 8 ohm cab?

8ohm, just like my Mesa cab. I know I'm comparing a Mesa 1x12 to a Bogner oversized 2x12, but there should be a similar quality with the same speaker. The Mesa cab is just more "syrupy," if that makes sense.

 

[rarebitusa]

It does. Full disclosure... I'm not a v30 fan, not a hater, just not a huge fan of an all v30s cab. I don't have a JP2C but do have a IIC+ HR with basically the same power section config. I always felt that there was a "thinness, lack of depth" in my Recto Hor 2x12 with the IIC+. It was punchy but not "rich or full sounding", mixing the v30 with something else was the eventual solution.

That said... and this is not helpful at all.... but it certainly could be the speakers or cab or the mix of both with the amp and it's settings. Have you tried running the cab on the 4 ohm out? Safe mismatch and that tends to darken up the cab a bit.

 

[ntotoro]

It does. Full disclosure... I'm not a v30 fan, not a hater, just not a huge fan of an all v30s cab. I don't have a JP2C but do have a IIC+ HR with basically the same power section config. I always felt that there was a "thinness, lack of depth" in my Recto Hor 2x12 with the IIC+. It was punchy but not "rich or full sounding", mixing the v30 with something else was the eventual solution.

That said... and this is not helpful at all.... but it certainly could be the speakers or cab or the mix of both with the amp and it's settings. Have you tried running the cab on the 4 ohm out? Safe mismatch and that tends to darken up the cab a bit.

No, I was never sure what the safe mismatch was LOL!!!! My drummer does have an old metal-front Mesa 4x12 that I'll try out next time we rehearse. He had his old master-volume JMP with a Friedman pedal running into it that sounded pretty sweet! I've run it with my Shiva years ago and actually preferred it to the same Bogner cab then. Not sure what speakers that cab has.

The sound you're describing is exactly what I'm hearing!!! Very punchy, no breadth or depth, whether alone or in the band mix. Wished I knew what his Mesa cab had in it, but I'll try it next time.

 

[rarebitusa]

No, I was never sure what the safe mismatch was LOL!!!! My drummer does have an old metal-front Mesa 4x12 that I'll try out next time we rehearse. He had his old master-volume JMP with a Friedman pedal running into it that sounded pretty sweet! I've run it with my Shiva years ago and actually preferred it to the same Bogner cab then. Not sure what speakers that cab has.

The sound you're describing is exactly what I'm hearing!!! Very punchy, no breadth or depth, whether alone or in the band mix. Wished I knew what his Mesa cab had in it, but I'll try it next time.

Is the Bogner a closed back cab?

 

[ntotoro]

Is the Bogner a closed back cab?

Closed.