Midi Rack NOOB

[Stroked]

Ok I have searched around the site. But I need a specific answer on something.

I have a RKII and recently decided to build a midi rig. I think I have decided on a GMajor for my effects, but will also have a few stomp boxes on the floor....I know the Gmajor with a Ground Control will help things out....BUT
Lets say I want chorus and some delay on my CH1 of my road king. So now I have this nice clean tone, but now the song calls for my CH3 with some heavy chorus.....Can I get the right gear that will let me have this all happen with the push of one button on the Ground Control?
I am confused how I can save patches in a digital format, but also have that change the channel of my Road King. I have studied Petrucci's rig....I need that capability but OBVIOUSLY not to that extreme.

So My Road King II, a Gmajor, and the Ground Control. What am I missing to have FULL control over the amp and all effects? Is a Data Dump needed?

Sorry for the Noob questions here....but its all new to me.

 

[BILLIAM666]

I have a RJM Amp Gizmo in my rack with my G Major and Mesa Roadster head. The Amp Gizmo lets all the amps functions (channels, solo boost, loop, reverb, ect...) controlled with a midi foot controller so when used along with the G major it will switch all effects at the same time doing exactly what you want with 1 foot stomp. Works perfect.

There is just the one custom cable to hook up, one end to the Amp Gizmo and the other to the footswitch jack the amp head.

 

[joe web]

I have a RJM Amp Gizmo in my rack with my G Major and Mesa Roadster head. The Amp Gizmo lets all the amps functions (channels, solo boost, loop, reverb, ect...) controlled with a midi foot controller so when used along with the G major it will switch all effects at the same time doing exactly what you want with 1 foot stomp. Works perfect.

There is just the one custom cable to hook up, one end to the Amp Gizmo and the other to the footswitch jack the amp head.

word! the RJM products work perfect!

i use a RG-16 looper/switcher, which is an ampgizmo with two switching outlets plus 8 mono loops.
the RG-16 switches my both amps, dual recto and roadster. due to the reason of one 3 channel and one 4 channel amp, i asked ron from rjmmusic to build me a specialcable for my dual recto, which recalls the channels matching to the roadster.
he made one to my specs and didn´t charge my an extra fee for it, just the normal price for the roadster cable. thumbs up for that!

as for multieffects unit i use a g-major as well plus an old digitech ips33b for harmonizer and whammy effects.
everything is controlled by a behringer fcb1010 floorboard with the UnO Eprom upgrade.
with the UnO firmware, you are able to use the upper 6 switches as real stompboxes. so i can switch in and out e.x. my MXR phaser and flanger pedals hoocked up in the loops of the RG-16.

you can programm any combination of amp channels, preamps, stompboxes and other effects of the g-major and recall this patch by step on one button of the fcb1010, plus the option of switching in and out an extra effekt or use the two expression pedals to controll the amount of delay or volume or any parameter you like to control in realtime.

after using the fcb1010 now for over 3 years, i need more control over my rig (i need more than 6 instant access switches) i ordered a rocktron all access. but the fcb1010 does a great job and worked perfect with all the other gear.

 

[BTC-Ax20]

I'll throw in my vote as well for RJM products. I'm currently building my rig around my 3Ch. Dual Rec. I've got the RJM Amp Gizmo for channel switching the amp, a Rocktron midimate foot board, and the TC G-Major is on the way. I guess we're in the same boat. Except, that your RKII is going to require several more ext. switches than mine, depending on what you want to control. The first thing you'll have to figure out is what you will all want to control. I chose the specific pieces with a few questions in mind.
#1 I wanted to minimize tap-dancing. Thus a one-step patch system is what I need. That means I need something that will take all of the channels and functions of the Mesa and MIDI-fy them, so it's controllable by other means. The DR has 5-external switching jacks (technically you only use 4 since you set the channel to default to Ch.2 and switch the 1 and 3) But for the Road King, you'll need 8-9 switchable functions. I think the Amp Gizmo might be able to handle that many, but that's pushing it. I considered the Access Electronics CFX4, but it only has 4 switches, so you'd need more than 1 in a series and it looked like the Amp Gizmo was easier to program. This is the case, it is super easy to work with.

#2 How are do you want to control it all? There are several MIDI boards that will do the trick, cost wise you're looking at $100-$1000, depending on the level of control. I chose the Rocktron Midimate over the FCB1010, because it had a few features I preferred. The Midimate allows you to name patches because it has an 8 character LED display. The FCB1010 and several others only have a patch number display, so you have to remember or somehow note, what patch is what. Although the FCB1010 does have advantages as well. It has it's own ext. switches and maybe some loop abillities to control stuff independantly. It also has 2 built in exp. pedals which are programmable. I had to buy separate expression pedals. Both are cost effective alternatives. Check out stuff by Roland or the Rocktron All Access as well for some more options.

#3 What type of effects do you want to run? Using the G-Major will probably give bang for the buck in terms of effects verstility. If you want additional specific stompboxes, you need to figure out how you want to control them. Are these stomp boxes MIDI controllable, and will they go in the MIDI chain? The answer is probably not, so they need to be in line with you guitar, or in the loop with the G-major. This method means you have to stomp it separately from the other patch changes. The only other solution is to have a MIDI loop switcher. That means putting the pedal in a separate controllable loop and leaving it on. Patch changes would activate the loop in the chain. This is why the RJM RG-16 for the Voodoo Lab GCX Audio switcher might be what you need.

http://www.rjmmusic.com/rg16.php
http://www.voodoolab.com/gcx.htm

Both of these have switchable loops that turn on/off individual pedals loops on a patch type set-up. They also make special cables for you particular amp's footswitch jack to eliminate the 1/4" cables for the ext. switch jacks. They are not cheap, probably around $500-700 just for the switcher, but they will act as the main hub of your rig. I can speak RJM's customer service. I was deciding on whether to buy it and write the company an email with some set-up questions. Ron (the founder) wrote me back within hours on how it should with my amp. So that shows me that they take customer service seriously.

I still don't have it all set-up yet, but I'll post on my progress.
Good luck, and feel free to post with any more questions.

 

[jdurso]

just wanted to throw in my .02

i bought the rjm rg16 a little over a month ago and it was the best purchase ive made other than the roadster. it controls all my channels, switches in and out my OCD, Maxon EQ, ISP Decimator and my Timefactor. It also controls the patch on my Timefactor and will do the say for the reverb unit im after. for the time being im using a rocktron midi xchange as my controller but im gonna get the new rjm footswitch when i have the dime. the best part is its so easy to program... you select a channel on your controller and hold down the write switch, press the buttons for the channel/functions/fx you want to use and the patch on any midi gear (timefactor for me), then hold the write switch again till the leds blink and your done. no more tap dances, no more setup hassles as you can keep all your pedals in a rack with any other gear. wish they had this thing years ago. and for $599 new or $499 referbed on ebay, its a steal. plus its cheaper than alternatives with the same functionality

 

[MetalMatt]

Hijack! I too need some help, please

I have friends coming over all the time wanting to jam and most of the time they don't bring their gear!... I guess they prefer mine :lol:. Also I'm plain tired of tap dancing. It's at the point where I'm trying to maximize my taping effectiveness and not my playing. Anyways!.... Here is my question and the confusing part. I would like two separate rigs. A Road King rig, a Quad rig, and when I feel like it :twisted: ... a put them together rig.
I have my eye on the RG-16 as it seems to be the best bang for the buck. No matter how I do this I'm always going to need two RG-16 units, one for each rig. Now before I start buying all this stuff is this even possible (the put them together part)?

Oh! another Q. Is it the foot controllers that "save" the presets? Or the RG-16?

An expensive journey I'm heading down :lol:
Thanks in advance.

 

[BTC-Ax20]

Hijack! I too need some help, please

I have friends coming over all the time wanting to jam and most of the time they don't bring their gear!... I guess they prefer mine :lol:. Also I'm plain tired of tap dancing. It's at the point where I'm trying to maximize my taping effectiveness and not my playing. Anyways!.... Here is my question and the confusing part. I would like two separate rigs. A Road King rig, a Quad rig, and when I feel like it :twisted: ... a put them together rig.
I have my eye on the RG-16 as it seems to be the best bang for the buck. No matter how I do this I'm always going to need two RG-16 units, one for each rig. Now before I start buying all this stuff is this even possible (the put them together part)?

Oh! another Q. Is it the foot controllers that "save" the presets? Or the RG-16?

An expensive journey I'm heading down :lol:
Thanks in advance.

Hmm. you're right that's a lot of stuff to control. I'm not as familiar with the Quad, so I don't know how many switches/channels that need to be controlled. But, the Road King (depending the series you get) will have at least 8 or 9 switches to control. Now, you may not actually need to control all of them, depending on how you run the f/x loops, but it is still going to make for a complicated schematic. I'd recommend watching the tutorial videos on RJM's website, they are great starting point. I'm not sure if you'd another RG16 or not, because they do make a special cables that work with the RK and Quad footswitch jacks. The cables should be able to handle all of the switching functions for the amps except that the RK one can't handle the external trigger or tuner mute (you probably wouldn't need these anyway with the set-up you're describing). Are you planning on introducing an effect processor into the set-up or maybe some pedals as well? The RG16 is going to ideal for getting these pieces to work with each amp on a preset basis.

The RG16 does store "presets"/states for the devices to controls (i.e. the amp switches and and pedal loops), but you still need and interface to recall them in one button, i.e. a MIDI foot controller. If you have an effects processor in the mix, the RG16 will just switch it in and out of the mix. It won't actually switch, store, or recall presets on a processor, that will be handled by the MIDI foot controller. You could use the RG16 to phantom power a MIDI F.C. with a 7-pin cable and that will run the signal thru the RG16 and on down the line to the processor. The RG16 will act as the middle man controlling things but the MIDI F.C. will be the brains. Hope that helps. Maybe drop RJM music a line if you're serious about the RG16, Ron (the owner) was very responsive to my questions regarding setups.

Good luck 8)

 

[joe web]

@MetalMatt:
do you wanna use both preamp-sections at once or only one at a time?
do you wanna use a 19" multieffect unit with it?
all those things are important.
i made a grafic for a friend of mine, who uses a TC g-force with two preamps.

the red strings go to the inputs of the preamps, the blue and orange strings are from the outputs of the preamps

or you use the buffer after the loops 1-4 and use buffer out for preamp one and the tuner out (which delivers the same signal as the buffer out!) for preamp 2.

also i detached a grafic of my setup.

very improtant is, that you´ll have to isolate one of the amps. by using a racksetup with a preamp and an external head, you´ll get hum problems.

 

[MetalMatt]

Ultimately I would like two separate/isolated rigs, with the option to run them together (kind of like stereo). I'm not looking for a refrigerator sized rig and I'm sure it wont come to that. So far I plan on buying almost two of everything, so yes, I plan on getting a rack multi effects unit or units.
The only problem I see with the RG-16 is that it doesn't have separate amp switching/control, and I won't be able to mix and match channels from both amps, if I use one RG-16 (Just for the channels)... Ok, let say I plug the Road King into "Amp1" on the back of the RG-16 and the Quad pre into "Amp2". Now If I want CH1 on the Road King, and L2 on the Quad, from what I have read thats not possible. It will give me the Road Kings clean channel along with the Quad's clean channel. Confusing. :?

Overall. If I am going to use ALL the options from both the Road King and the Quad Pre I'm looking at 16 External switching jacks. The Road King has eight jacks (CH1, CH2, CH3, CH4, Loop1, Loop 2, Reverb and Solo). The Quad has eight also (R1, R2, L1, L2, EQ1, EQ2, Reverb cancel, Reverb Boost). This all depends on what I really need to use and what I want to use.

The reason I ask about what "saves the presets" is because I wondering If I need a third foot controller. One for each rig.

Anyhoo, I still have LOTS of researching and understanding to do. Again, this may not even be possible, but this does help. I will try and pry Ron's brain a bit.

Thanks

 

[joe web]

depending on your programming, would could manage and controll everything with just one midiboard.
you could splitt the banks in 3. so that you use bank 1-3 for the RK setup, bank 4-6 for the quad setup and bank 7-9 for the mixed setup for example.

ampswitches:
yes, both switching outlets sent the same signal. they are parallel wired.
if you know exactly, which chanal on wich preamp should be active, you can drop Ron a mail for making you a custom cable.
he built one for me, for my dual recto. my switching is:
roadster green + recto green, roadster yellow + recto green, roadster orange + recto red, roadster red + recto orange - that´s how i need it and he made it possible.

the other option would be to use the TRS-plug cable with Y-adaption to have 8 mono trs plugs on one of the cables and put this plugs into the chanalswitches you need.

but you can´t switch both preamps individually with one RG-16, that´s right.

for the total setup:
to run it in stereo with A/B switching between the preamps wouldn´t be that problem, but if you want to have both preamps at the same time running and a stereo output with more than one multieffects unite, this will be not be so easy. especially with the option of using both rigs as a single unite as well.

i´ll think about it a bit, maybe i´ll have a wiring suggestion in a few days.