Mesa Royal Atlantic v Electra Dyne video up ...

[BostonRedSox]

What do you guys think, which amp is the winner? For me, it just further exemplifies why I love the RA a bit more than the ED. The ED's bottom end is great for cleans, but not so great for dirt and sounds too flabby to my ears. I mean, the amp can be set to not sound too bass heavy but the single channel format leaves your cleans sounding not as great with the diminished bass.

What Don from Haggerty didn't show was how much low end the RA's independent clean channel CAN have. It can get extremely rich sounding, with nice low end as well. Just turn down the treble down some, raise the gain to just past noon, and keep the bass around 1-2 o'clock.

To each their own of course. Styles of music, ability, guitars, and numerous other factors will make each amp more ideal for different players. They are both amazing sounding, that much is sure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYRvBnFIWnc

 

[J.J]

Thats another good video.

With my ED bias cap off, I don't think you can pick a winner. It depends what you are trying to achieve. If we are just talking about that video then I'd have to say the RA sounds better for overdrive, but not as good on the clean side.

For clapton Beano tone I'd bet the ED would win, but I'll have to wait and see as I have not heard anyone playing those tunes yet.

At this time it seems that the ED does the older Marshall stuff well and the RA is more JCM era.

The ED did seem almost scooped in comparison, do those two amps have the same speaker setup, V30 V V30 ?

I'd also like to know how things would change if the output tubes were swapped around (ED with El34 and RA with 6L6)

 

[YellowJacket]

OK, that is kind of surprising now similar they both sound.

As far as I can tell, the Electra Dyne sounds like a 1 x 12 combo with a c90 while the Royal Atlantic is a 2 x 12 combo with a v30 and c90? If you listen to the Mark V v30 + c90 comparison you will be able to hear that v30s add midrange punch and bite / brilliance to the tone. This is partially speaker dependent.

That being said, both amps sound fantastic. The Electra Dyne is darker and more scooped which is a tone that I have a lot more preference for. It works much better with Gibson guitars, which have a round and ballsy midrange roar with less emphasis on the highs and lows. I think I'd be equally happy with either amp though...

[edit] Oh, no WONDER the ED sounds so scooped. He has the mids pulled way back for the red channel demo. You pull the mids forward and there will be a lot more crunch / bark to the tone.

 

[J.J]

Yeah, it sounded more like a C90 vs V30 demo to me :lol:

 

[screamingdaisy]

The RA sounds more immediate and a bit more aggressive while the ED seems to have a bit more of a vintage sag with a thinner/reedy quality to the top end.

Beyond that, what I hear a lot of are the overtones I associate with 6L6 vs EL34. I'd be really interested in playing an RA in person, since it's hard to judge things like feel and response through a YouTube clip.

 

[BostonRedSox]

It is difficult to tell if the cabs are mic'd behind Don. I wouldn't be surprised if he had them both running through the same cabinet. He usually does that for comparison and contrast videos I believe ...

 

[BostonRedSox]

Yeah, it sounded more like a C90 vs V30 demo to me :lol:

Yeah, the cabs in the video aren't mic'd. I think the two amps are running through the same cab honestly. Can you see a mic on the cabs behind him?

If the ED was a 1x12 cab as some have stated it sounded like, then we'd definitely see the mic in the video. All evidence seems to suggest that Don has them both fed into the same cab. Which also would keep in line with how Don usually does comparison and contrast vids. :lol:

 

[screamingdaisy]

Yeah, the cabs in the video aren't mic'd. I think the two amps are running through the same cab honestly. Can you see a mic on the cabs behind him?

If the ED was a 1x12 cab as some have stated it sounded like, then we'd definitely see the mic in the video. All evidence seems to suggest that Don has them both fed into the same cab. Which also would keep in line with how Don usually does comparison and contrast vids. :lol:

Aren't the ED and RA combo shells basically the same (1x12, 3/4 back cabs)?

If so, it'd make sense if he simply mic'd a 3rd off camera.

I wonder when he'll chime in with the details?

 

[primal]

Nice vid, but the way he dropped the mids for the Hi channel on the ED really messed up the comparison.

I play my Mids around 2 o'clock. As Yellowjacket correctly points out, the mids are where the ED crunch lives.

By dropping the mids like that, he dialed the crunch tone out of it.

In many amps higher mids muddy up the amp. Not so with the ED. I suspect the mid control is in the 2khz range

Going by that comparison for the high, I thought the RA-100 sounded better. But knowing how much better the ED sounds with the mids turned up, I don't think the comparison was fair.

While I certainly agree the ED has tons of low end, I would disagree that is flabby. I have always been very impressed with how tight it remained while turned up. Course I had a Mark IV prior to the ED, and I can tell you if you turned the bass beyond 4, that was flabby. Roadking I owned before the Mark IV was very flabby as well at times. So maybe it is just perspective.

Plus if you don't like low end dropping the bass to 10:00 or below will dial it out.

RA- sounded excellent BTW

 

[primal]

Beyond that, what I hear a lot of are the overtones I associate with 6L6 vs EL34.

Very good point.

Now I am dying to throw some EL34 in my ED. Especially since that is the tone I gravitate to anyway

 

[BostonRedSox]

Yeah, the cabs in the video aren't mic'd. I think the two amps are running through the same cab honestly. Can you see a mic on the cabs behind him?

If the ED was a 1x12 cab as some have stated it sounded like, then we'd definitely see the mic in the video. All evidence seems to suggest that Don has them both fed into the same cab. Which also would keep in line with how Don usually does comparison and contrast vids. :lol:

Aren't the ED and RA combo shells basically the same (1x12, 3/4 back cabs)?

If so, it'd make sense if he simply mic'd a 3rd off camera.

I wonder when he'll chime in with the details?

The RA only comes in a 212 option for the combo. I believe both amp combos do share the 3/4 back design as you mentioned. I don't know if all the RA's are shipped with the V-30/C-90 speaker combination though. That is how my combo came. That might just be an addition they made however since my combo is a customized one.

I can't wait to receive my custom ED. I will definitely be running the ED as my wet amp. The cleans have nice balance and would work well for the delay/modulation tones I am currently writing.

 

[YellowJacket]

You're running both an RA and an ED?? What manner of sinful indulgence is this? You'll get both your cakes and get to eat them too!?

 

[BostonRedSox]

You're running both an RA and an ED?? What manner of sinful indulgence is this? You'll get both your cakes and get to eat them too!?

I went forever running a Roadster. I loved that amp, but needed something different. After contemplating going with a Fender/Vox setup, or a Goldfinger/Vox setup, I've settled on the ED/RA setup. I wanted the ED more than anything, but felt like I couldn't mix it with a Vox. The sounds are just way too different. The ED and RA seem to compliment each other really well. The one thing I didn't want was to have two amps, and switch between the two amps and have the sound be drastically different. If I could get the flexibility of the Roadster, in two Mesa amps with Mesa's known reliability, I think I will be really happy.

It is sort of a risk too. That means no more new stuff for a long time. There goes my Gibson ES 336 ...

Talk is cheap though. I'll have to post pics of my RA/ED rig when I get my ED in.

 

[HaggertysMusic]

Wow, you guys got to see the new video before I did! That's a little scary for me! :lol:

I'm so glad you're enjoying them and hopefully finding them useful. I'll try to answer some of the questions here.

What Don from Haggerty didn't show was how much low end the RA's independent clean channel CAN have. It can get extremely rich sounding, with nice low end as well. Just turn down the treble down some, raise the gain to just past noon, and keep the bass around 1-2 o'clock.

This is a good point. The RA clean channel can absolutely slam you in the gut! No one should have to worry about the clean channel not having enough bottom end punch.

The ED did seem almost scooped in comparison, do those two amps have the same speaker setup, V30 V V30 ?

I think that's a pretty accurate assessment. The ED is more scooped in the mids with more buzz on the top end.

The speakers and mic placement were absolutely the same. The combo amps were sitting on top of a 2x12 cabinet, you just can't see it on the video. We used the road king 2x12, close mic'ed on the vintage 30.

I'd also like to know how things would change if the output tubes were swapped around (ED with El34 and RA with 6L6)

This has my wheels turning for a pt.2 video!

 

[J.J]

Hi Don, thanks for clearing things up.

Would love to hear what happens with EL34 Vs 6L6, even if it is just a quick demo.

 

[YellowJacket]

I think that's a pretty accurate assessment. The ED is more scooped in the mids with more buzz on the top end.

The speakers and mic placement were absolutely the same. The combo amps were sitting on top of a 2x12 cabinet, you just can't see it on the video. We used the road king 2x12, close mic'ed on the vintage 30.

Hmmm. So the Electra Dyne has less mids than the Royal Atlantic then? The video just threw me because when you dial up the mids to about 1:00, the amp really starts to crunch and roar. You can even dial out the top end sizzle by making suitable adjustments to the presence. I think overall, Mesa was thinking about the Electra Dyne when they designed the Royal Atlantic. I can see how there is a huge similarity between the blue channels. Great job on the vid, btw.

I'd also like to know how things would change if the output tubes were swapped around (ED with El34 and RA with 6L6)

This has my wheels turning for a pt.2 video!

This will be VERY interesting!!

 

[primal]

I think that's a pretty accurate assessment. The ED is more scooped in the mids with more buzz on the top end.

I guess it is hard for me to disagree with "more" since it is relative and I have not had the pleasure of playing the RA yet (I will the moment my local boogie dealer gets one, that is for sure), but in the video it seems you have scooped the mids with your settings.

Don't misunderstand, you guys with out a doubt in my mind do the best demo's on the web.

But I guess the ED is not and amp I ever would have considered scooped. Probably because I run my mids around 2 o'clock.

I also came from a Mark IV and Recto which are notorious for scooped mids.

I think the ED is an amp that sounds best in the upper mid range. If you do another video with EL34's, my request would be you try to EQ it to get the most out of the upper midrange in the hi setting.

Using my S4 my settings I stay on are typically
Volume 3-4 o'clock
Bass 10 o'clock
Mid 2 o'clock
treble 2 o'clock
Presence Noon - 2 o'clock (this one, along with the bass, really depends on the room I am in)

I typically go through my 1x12 combo speaker, the C90.

Really got to start getting close to drummer volume to get the best sound out of it.

 

[jeffp]

For what it`s worth, I think they both sounded very good......But I think the ED stole the show!jeffp

 

[Birdy]

Great vid Don !

Love my ED (and yours)....I got mine due to the tone and simplicity and have
no desire for an RA, but it sounds killer.

 

[YellowJacket]

For what it`s worth, I think they both sounded very good......But I think the ED stole the show!jeffp

It is a fantastic amp, non? I actually found the Electra Dyne to have a lot of mids compared to my recto. I can imagine that the added midrange of the RA would begin to annoy me as well. What Don's vid shows extremely well is the tonal difference between the Electra Dyne red channel and the RA red channel. I bet if the mids were at 1:00 on both clips, the RA would be prohibitively mid heavy while the ED would be REALLY starting to crunch.