Mesa Quad and a solid state power amp

[Bobby Marshall]

I use the Studio Pre with a Peavey 50/50 and it sounds great. Can't imagine it would be much different with the Studio Pre's big sister the Quad.

They used to go for much less than a used Mesa stereo 50 watt or higher power amp but they do run off of 8 EL84 power tubes.

 

[Razor]

Yeah I have been considering this as well .Read some really nice reviews about the Peavey 50/50. Some say it is even better than 60/60. Much rounder and warmer tone, though some claim that 60/60 has more bottom end, probably cause of the 6L6 tubes, but on the other hand it's a little unpractical cause controls are on the back.

 

[Bobby Marshall]

Yeah I have been considering this as well .Read some really nice reviews about the Peavey 50/50. Some say it is even better than 60/60. Much rounder and warmer tone, though some claim that 60/60 has more bottom end, probably cause of the 6L6 tubes, but on the other hand it's a little unpractical cause controls are on the back.

Well I get pretty great lows but I am also using a Mesa halfback cab with EVM-12L speakers in the bottom with a closed back. The resonance control on the Peavey helps with the low end as well. You don't expect to get that kind of low end from an EL-84. I have seen people say an EL-84 gives better low end response than a 6V6 which is a fatter tube.

When I have had the Peavey 50/50 up to stage volume, it's like the scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark when they open the Ark . . . people are screaming and their faces are melting!!! :twisted:

 

[Razor]

Hehe that's a really wicked way to put it. :twisted:

Definitely getting that bad boy then. So I'm guessing it should work good with me quad eh?

Oh and another thing. Does the peavey have the tone sweetening effect or is it transparent. In other words how is the colorization of the tone?

 

[Razor]

I have been looking at a Peavey Valveking 112. It says that this amp can switch between Class A and Class A/B. I know this isn't exactly simulclass, though it sorta reminds me of it, but would this amp's power section work well with the Quad?

 

[TemporarilyStairs]

I <3 my Peavey 50/50. Well, actually, I <3ed it, until it got fried and I ditched it at the side of the road ;P

Really though, it's a great power amp with the Quad. It definitely colors the tone up like you would expect from a guitar tube power amp... just that sort of smoothing, and good chunk of natural compression, etc... I actually pretty much love EL84s, I guess. I absolutely loved my Quad ->Peavey 50/50 tone.

I started doing the road-warrior thing though, and the Peavey power amp was just not making much economical sense, particularly when you just have a little trailer and a van, and you get drunk at a lot of your shows. Not saying it's not a road-worthy unit, don't get me wrong, but after my power amp fried I switched to a QSC P/A Power Amp (though I might pick up an old Mosvalve and give it a shot when I get the opportunity) and actually, I still love the tone. Of course, the first show was brutal, but as time goes on I'm slowly dialing it in, re-EQing, and getting used to the new sound. I'm sure if I had a few hours to crank it up, alone, and tweak it I'd really love the sound. I still prefer the sound of my rig with the 50/50, but it's really differing manners of 'great.' The full-range PA power amp gives a kinda cool crispness to my dirty tones that I actually kinda like, but it sounded NASTY with my old settings ;P

I think the overall point I'd make is that with a great preamp like the Quad, and a style where the majority of your tone generation takes place before it hits the power amp, I'd consider the power section to be more of a flavoring type choice. Not that flavor is irrelevant: I know plenty of people who won't eat French Fries without Ketchup, but... I'm ranting now, and I'm going to stop. Peavey rules, solid state works pretty good with the Quad too, the Quad just rules. Done.

 

[daveyboogie]

Really though, it's a great power amp with the Quad. It definitely colors the tone up like you would expect from a guitar tube power amp... just that sort of smoothing, and good chunk of natural compression, etc... I actually pretty much love EL84s, I guess. I absolutely loved my Quad ->Peavey 50/50 tone.

Where am I going wrong???!!! I've got the same set-up: Quad into a Peavey Classic 50/50 just the same and I'm still just NOT QUITE THERE with the lead tone... This Quad was a wreck when I bought it:- new pots, caps, plate resistors and a total re-tube needed; improved the clarity and reliability but I'm still having a nightmare dialling in that killer tone, especially on Lead-1 where everyone else is screaming over it. I re-tubed the Quad will JJs (not NOS) and then later re-tubed the 50/50 with JJ EL34 power and Harma pre: two 12AX7s and two ECC81s. I find the 50/50 BLISTERINGLY loud, so I run it half power, but it is 'blisteringly' loud even now. I'm using two Marshall 4x12s (the AVT type not 1960s). The sound I'm after is really a hugely open crunch. I use a lot of big open chords so I want big, clear mids, tight bass and crispy smooth tops. Reading here and elsewhere about Quads and Studios made me think that this was where I should be going.

Don't get me wrong, this pre is NEARLY there ...and I just KNOW there's MY tone in there somewhere. There's a wonderfully fat 'urgency' to the sound I'm getting that feels like its slapping me in the face every time I crank it up. I'm getting close but I feel like I'm missing something here. The bass just isn't quite tight enough or the mids just aren't quite fluid enough: I don't know- I think I've got tone paranoia.

I'm toying with the idea of going 6L6 for the power.

Big, smooth mids. No chugging, just big chords. I haven't got another power amp to try against it other than solid state PA amps- not sure I want to do that just yet. In honesty, I have to say that my cabs have definately seen better days so mebbe a new 1960 might be the answer.

I'm not really looking for help, just posting my experiences so far. I'm going to continue with this thing because its much better than anything I've ever played into so far:- it's just frustrating to be so close to a massively sexy tone and not be able to quite touch it.

 

[TemporarilyStairs]

Maybe you just don't like it? ;P

Just keep trying to dial it in, I guess. I will mention though, that as soon as you said something about the lows not being tight enough, the first thing I thought of was actually something that I didn't stumble onto for a little while after owning the unit, and I didn't really like it until then. For my tastes, the Quad really isn't 'tight' enough with the lows anywhere above like, 1 or 2. For me, just dropping the low control down to almost nil while cranking the low end on the GEQ to compensate got me way closer to what I was hearing in my head. But of course, that's probably a bigger deal for 'chugging' type stuff, and you probably already tried it. Meh.

 

[daveyboogie]

Thanks for your thoughts!

Actually; rolling off the low control is one thing I haven't tried yet.

 

[dmt]

the type of tubes and the location and therefore function of the tube in the circuit affect the tone more than you will know. mine came tubed with mesa tubes and two new production tungsols, and i didnt like how it sounded. I felt that my soun was in there someplace i just didnt know where. I ended up using a mix a NOS tubes of various brands and types.

The end result is a good well balanced sound. I would recommend picking up some NOS or Used pream tubes off the bay, or through the tubestore.com or something. Get a few old RCA's for gain or Sylvania's, maybe a few European tubes as well and you can further fine tune your tone. This would allow you to take a lead tone that is "almost there" and tighten it up or fatten it with a different tube for that spot.

I spent a good few hours playing just with which tubes I wanted where. Then end result is worth the effort.

I would also recommend using a boost pedal to emphasize the tone you are going for, maybe push the mids and boost the level a bit etc and you can get a crunchier sound out of the amp. Also, the GEQ on the preamp is critical. The sliders are very much interlocked and depending on where they are set will change the characteristics of the distortion/overdrive. Generally Mesa GEQ's favor the treble sliders, make it the most power full.

Make sure you are not running out of the Recording outs, that can be a bit harsh, you can also try running the output of the quad into the "input" rather than the fx loop of the power amp, then you can have some control over the out tone in the preamp. this is key as well, on a tube poweramp you could adjust the output of the preamp and overdrive the power tubes for compression and additional overdrive clipping. and the EQ settings on the poweramp are essential as well... tube or not...

 

[daveyboogie]

Thanks for all your advice...

I'm watching a couple of used and NOS Mullards / Brimars on the fleabay at the moment. I'm astonished how much money they're fetching (especially the NOS) but I'm determined to go all the way with this thing regardless of cost. I saw a NOS Tesla ECC803 with a Buy-It-Now of $1250 from some Polish guy!!!

I'll look out for some RCA and Sylvanias too.

I'm sure a cab upgrade is also in order. Mesa 4x12 are tricky to get hold of over here, so its probably going to be another Marshall.

 

[Razor]

@DMT

As far as Tubes go, I got an email from Eddie at Eurotubes and here's what he said regarding retubing of the Quad.

ou are correct. We don’t have any retube kits for these amps at the moment. This means that if you would like to order online you will need to order the individual tubes you need. If you do this then just leave us a note on the check out page in the comments box. Let us know that the tubes are for your quad and then we can grade everything out appropriately and package the tubes up just like our kits. You can always call us and place an order as well.

The Mesa Quad preamps use eight 12AX7's and if you want the best of the best then I would use five of the ECC83S's that are matched and graded for high gain in V11, V12, V13, V21, and V23 which ads a bit of bite and a sharper dynamic but does not hurt the clean tone. These only have about 10% more distortion but the reason they are nice in these preamps is because they have a very fast filament rise time which makes them very articulate. For V14, V22 and V24 I would simply use standard ECC83S's

Five of the high gain JJ ECC83S's and three standards would run 101.00

This info might be quite useful for most people around here who own a quad.

By the way, about an EQ in the poweramp section. I am not familiar with many poweramps that Do have such an EQ, aside from the Mesa Satellite. Am I missing something here?