Mark V Settings Questions

[Monsta-Tone]

I have channel 2 just singing! It's thick, crunchy, and articulate with lots of sustain and controlled feedback! I really like it.
I've been playing it through a 1x12 Rectoverb (just using the speaker and cab with the V) with a C-90 in it.
I will most likely convert the V to a combo. I know that there is a little loss of versatility and bass, but it's sort of a must for my situation.

I'm looking for the following though:
1. Great Fender clean tone out of channel 1 - I haven't dialed it in quite right yet. We play lots of melodic cleans, funky cleans, and Reggae/skanky cleans. I have grown so used to my Rivera's clean channel that I just have to have a Fender-y tone

2. I need to figure out what to do with channel 3. I do not like how tight and uptight it sounds. I know that this is what channel 3 is all about. I've owned 3 Mark IV's over the years and loved the lead channels on them but hated R2. Now, I can't get used to it.
I am wondering if I should just use it for a crunchy rhythm tone for medium gain stuff. Seems counter intuitive though since it is the highest gain of the 3 channels.
Does anyone have any settings that will give me a dark, crunchy, mean liquid lead tone that is not so trebly and bright? I have the treble and presence dialed in at around 9:00 and this is sort of helping, but steals a lot of harmonics and gain away......
My settings for now are:
Gain - 3:00
Master - 10:00
Pres - 9:30
Treble - 9:00
Mids - 9:00
Bass - 9:00
If I set the treble, mids, or presence above these settings, I end up with an ear ache. It just seems that there is way too much mid hump and upper treble. Even with the GEQ I have a hard time dialing it out.
I know that a lot of guys who use the V have tones that are designed to cut through a huge band mix. I play in a 3 piece though and need a little more oommph to my tone.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I feel like the tones I'm looking for are in the amp, I just haven't found them yet.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

Guess I should clarify a little more.......

For channel 3, I am looking for a darker, more crunchy tone with lots of sustain and controlled feedback.
I know it's not a great comparison, but I really tend to lean more toward Michael Shenker (sp?) & Santana (Santana Brothers, Supernatural, etc.) tones than Dream Theater. I guess I always went with a DC over a Mark IV because it sounded a bit more raw and uncompressed.
I am in no way looking for a Metallica like tone, which is all I have been able to come up with so far.

So....great rock crunch that almost gets into metal territory but is still controllable for open chords, feedback, etc..

 

[mesa metal]

Guess I should clarify a little more.......

For channel 3, I am looking for a darker, more crunchy tone with lots of sustain and controlled feedback.
I know it's not a great comparison, but I really tend to lean more toward Michael Shenker (sp?) & Santana (Santana Brothers, Supernatural, etc.) tones than Dream Theater. I guess I always went with a DC over a Mark IV because it sounded a bit more raw and uncompressed.
I am in no way looking for a Metallica like tone, which is all I have been able to come up with so far.

So....great rock crunch that almost gets into metal territory but is still controllable for open chords, feedback, etc..

have you swapped out your preamp tubes yet .....try V1 first and go from there...i have an awesome metal tone in channel3 totally brutal :wink:
alot has to do with the eq settings,,,less is more in some cases..

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I haven't yet. I have to remove the chassis from the head cab to do it.
I did swap V6 yesterday because the loop stopped working. It didn't help, still no loop.

I'm pulling the chassis today to figure it all out and swap in some new tubes.

Would you mind sharing your settings for channel 3?
Last night I found a great crunchy rhythm tone on channel 3 that will work really well for my band. I have the gain around 11:00. Kind of bummed though, I was looking forward to incredible liquid sustain.....

 

[screamingdaisy]

Do you have the ability to totally dedicate channel 3 to lead work?

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I don't really do enough leads to justify it.

I was having issues with the loop. It would not come back on after I bypassed it.
I swapped V6, checked all connections, disconnected the footswitch & cable, nothing worked.
I pulled the chassis and couldn't find anything wrong. 1st amp that has ever intimidated me with it's complexity!

I changed V1 and the loop started working again. Probably just coincidence. I unplugged and plugged the ribbon cables back in. I also put the original V6 back in.
The loop seems to be working fine, but I don't want to touch the bypass switch again.....

Changing V1 really helped the clean channel and channel 3. Cleans are much warmer and channel 3 is a little bit crunchier now!
I'll have to swap the rest of them out tomorrow.
The tubes in the amp are the originals. Judging by the condition of the amp, it hasn't been played very much at all. There is no dust inside the cab, not a scratch on the tolex, faceplate, footswitch, etc..
Low serial number, 601.
It looks like it just sat under it's cover for years.
Bummer the tubes are already crapping out.......

 

[bandit2013]

Yep, been there done that.... I found the stock tubes to be rather harsh. Could not dial out treble or even adjust the gain settings to make a difference. Also if the amp has not been used all that much, it needs to be broken in. I have owned my Mark V for nearly 6 months and it is finally sounding really good. Power tubes and preamp tubes will make a difference.

If you desire deep tones, try a TungSol in V1. Middle of the road with well balance, use EH 12ax7 in V1-V6 and Sovetek LPS in V7. I discovered the EH tubes provide pleasant tones, not brittle or grainy like the Mesa 12ax7a tube. I started off with a JAN GE 5751 in V1, at that time I was using Tung Sol 7581 power tubes. (they are as bright at the stock Mesa STR440). The NOS 5751 allowed me to dial in gain, treble and presence that was noticeable and not over the top. Before, they were useless in CH3. I also had similar problems with the effects loop. I could not get it to switch (discovered I had a 7 pin cable, not the required 8 pin). I also had the effects loop die on me while in use. At the time I did not realize the stock tubes were red plating. 7581 did not last long, went flat in a short time. Now using Groove Tubes. Now very happy with all 3 channels.

What I have discovered thus far, and many others, SED wing = C= tubes will generate a full tone. Full meaning well defined bass response, moderate mids and highs. After several months of use, different tubes, I can now dial in almost any tone. I did sample the Doug's tube tone kit for a 7tube amp. It was worth a try. There are only two tubes I kept in the mix, the LPS and the Ruby HG which now resides in V1. EH for all the others. I was able to get a matched quad of NOS GT6L6R-2 which are old Svetlana's (same tube now refered to as SED wing C). As a comparison, I also have Svetlana 6L6GC which are close in sound quality as the SED's (not as much bass).

I do not play much in the Heavy Metal category as it is defined today. Perhaps the 80's definition is what I prefer, now called hair bands. I favor the late 60's to the 70' rock. I have become a LED Zep fan late in life. Favorite bands: Scorpions ( including the earlier Lonesome Crow, and Tokio Tapes). Pink Floyd, Dokken, White Snake, Van Halen. Boston, Kansas, Judas Priest, Styxx, Rush, and many others. I also like the Blues and Jazz but lack talent to do Jazz any justice.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

Right on, thanks!
I used a JJ high gain for V1.
I have a 5 tube set of Doug's mixture that I got for a Rectoverb that I had briefly. I'll give it a whirl.
I have lots of JJ high gains too.

For power tubes, I have one duet of JJ 6L6, and one duet of modern Svetlana. I'll figure out which set sounds better for the 45 watt setting.

I thought the Mark III, and IV were hard to change tubes in, this thing is a nightmare! That's the main reason I swapped V1 yesterday. I knew I would never get my hands in there once the chassis was back in the head cab.

 

[SteveO]

I thought the Mark III, and IV were hard to change tubes in, this thing is a nightmare! That's the main reason I swapped V1 yesterday. I knew I would never get my hands in there once the chassis was back in the head cab.

If you pull the reverb tank, it's not too bad at all to go through the big hole in the bottom of the head shell.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I'll give it a shot, thanks!

 

[mesa metal]

++1 on bandits post....both of us have had our mkVs for about the same lengh of time,,bought mine used that sat in a guys room for about 21/2 years
and almost never played,,i actually think my amp isnt quite broken in yet,,but in that amount of time ive done many tube rolls to see what this amp likes,,tung sol in V1 is a very nice tube .,,different preamp tubes along with the sed c powertubes make all the difference in the world.you just have to switch around to see what suits your needs musically(also the gain ratings of the preamp tubes seem to impact the tone as well).....i have my gain knob on channel3 mkiv mode(pentode 90watt)just slightly past 3oclock,,treble and mid are about 12;30,,bass is about 1oclock,presence at 12.. eq is set at the v curve but i have the end sliders cut back not to have to boomy a bass or too much treble...the tubes take care of that,,,as i stated in another post i will be experementing with all nos tubes.....
i have also experenced the "earache"not fun at all...
also keep in mind the guitar woods,pickups,speakers,neckthru or bolt on,,have a big impact on all of our end results,,,
bandit::: rush is still my allllll time fave!!!love the hair bands i grew up with and have seen all of them live at one time or another..
my musical tastes change every week as per my fave bands in my sig..
that is why i like the MKV so much,,,i can get all of those tones and more,,,,,,,,,rock on
cheers...

 

[bandit2013]

I did not mean to hijack so I will keep out tube talk at this time. However that being said, just a few things to point out probably well known, already stated, etc.... Many characteristics will effect the perceived tone of the amp. As stated by Mesa Metal, the guitar would be the primary. The variable would be the type of room the amp is played in. For a typical room, and neck through hard wood guitar with active tone controls, two humbucker PU, typical GHS lights 10-46, string through body with brass tune-o-matic bridge, the Mark V settings I use are as follows:
Power switch set to Variac
CH1: Fat, EQFS, 45W or 90W. Gain 9:00, Master 10:00, Presence 2:00, Treble 11:00, Mid 12:00, Bass 11:00. Global switch set to bold. Rectifier type tube. (automatically becomes diode in 90W mode)

CH2: Edge, EQFS, 90W. Gain 12:00, Master 11:00, Presence 10:00, Treble 11:00, Mid 10:00, Bass 12:00, Rectifier type tube. (I sometimes use the 45W mode with different settings and like the spongy response of the tube diode)

CH3: IV, EQFS, 45W or 90W. Gain 11:00, Master 10:00, Presence 10:00, Treble 10:00, Mid 11:00, Bass 11:00, global switch set to bright. Power tube gain set to Pentode mode.

EQ settings: CH1 preset set to 12:00, CH2 preset set to 2:00, CH 3 sliders: 80=100%, 240=60%, 750=40%, 2200=55%, 6600=80%.

Loop active: Master Volume 10:00, Solo 11:00.

I vary the master volume and power settings, depends on time of day etc... What I like about the EVM12L is that you can drive them hard and they perform well.

 

[bandit2013]

++1 on bandits post....both of us have had our mkVs for about the same lengh of time,,bought mine used that sat in a guys room for about 21/2 years
and almost never played,,i actually think my amp isnt quite broken in yet,,but in that amount of time ive done many tube rolls to see what this amp likes,,tung sol in V1 is a very nice tube .,,different preamp tubes along with the sed c powertubes make all the difference in the world.you just have to switch around to see what suits your needs musically(also the gain ratings of the preamp tubes seem to impact the tone as well).....i have my gain knob on channel3 mkiv mode(pentode 90watt)just slightly past 3oclock,,treble and mid are about 12;30,,bass is about 1oclock,presence at 12.. eq is set at the v curve but i have the end sliders cut back not to have to boomy a bass or too much treble...the tubes take care of that,,,as i stated in another post i will be experementing with all nos tubes.....
i have also experenced the "earache"not fun at all...
also keep in mind the guitar woods,pickups,speakers,neckthru or bolt on,,have a big impact on all of our end results,,,
bandit::: rush is still my allllll time fave!!!love the hair bands i grew up with and have seen all of them live at one time or another..
my musical tastes change every week as per my fave bands in my sig..
that is why i like the MKV so much,,,i can get all of those tones and more,,,,,,,,,rock on
cheers...

I feel like a total fool ! I was talking to my neighbor who heard me playing. He had an extra ticket for RUSH and asked if I would like to go. It was too short of notice for which I had to decline. I should have gone! I saw the tour on TV, as well as their indictment into the Hall of Fame on HBO. 39 years and still packing each event.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

Not hijacking at all if it helps me get better tone!

That sucks about the Rush tickets. I was lucky enough to see the Counterparts tour. Not that I like that particular CD, but I was lucky enough to see them at that time.
Living in HI, not too many big name acts come here. The ones that do charge an arm and a leg for tickets, and usually the big names only play on Oahu. By the time I got 2 tickets, airfare for my wife and myself, hotel room, food, rental car, etc., I would be out over $1,000! Screw that. That's another amp or guitar or......7 great dinners with the wife, lots of trips to the aquarium with the kids.........

 

[bandit2013]

Another thing to consider, if you feel there is too much treble that you cannot tame with the tone controls or EQ, there is another option for power tubes, EL34. They have a softer high frequency response than the 6L6 which is more bell tone or sharp on the high frequencies. I have not experimented with EL34 in the Mark V but it was my next approach to reduce the high frequency drilling I was getting from the original tubes. I have not used them in a long time since the Mark III days.

I am sure many in the forums would be willing to share their thoughts on the EL34 option in the Mark V. Not sure on longevity, from what I remember when I used them in the Mark III, they did not last long when compared to 6L6GC.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I always go back to 6L6. I keep experimenting with power tubes in all of my amps, but the 6L6 just has incredible thump and super warm cleans.

EL34's have a weird mid hump that I can't seem to get along with.
That being said, I'm kind of sad that there isn't a 6V6 option with the Mark V. I used to run my Heartbreaker, and my last Mark IV with 6V's and really liked it. I have to admit that the 10 watt setting is really cool on the V though!

I'm making up some cables right now to allow me to use my GCX for switching.

 

[bandit2013]

Not hijacking at all if it helps me get better tone!

That sucks about the Rush tickets. I was lucky enough to see the Counterparts tour. Not that I like that particular CD, but I was lucky enough to see them at that time.
Living in HI, not too many big name acts come here. The ones that do charge an arm and a leg for tickets, and usually the big names only play on Oahu. By the time I got 2 tickets, airfare for my wife and myself, hotel room, food, rental car, etc., I would be out over $1,000! Screw that. That's another amp or guitar or......7 great dinners with the wife, lots of trips to the aquarium with the kids.........

I did not realize you were in Hawaii. I was in Lahaina for a week in Maui, followed by Kauai for another week in 1997. I can understand the expense. Island hopping is not cheap.

I would have enjoyed it seeing RUSH. I am not sure if it was VH1 or one of the music channels: they featured one of the tours from RUSH. That was good enough.