Hi everybody! I've been lurking on this board for a while but this is my first post. I currently have a Mark IV short head that I bought new about a year and a half ago new. I gig regularly at casinos playing anything from Hole to disco( I know disco sucks but it pays!) I'll tell you I've been tweaking that **** Mark IV for the full year and a half & it's driving me nuts! I've been to grail tone for settings, harmony central for settings, & even this board for settings. I changed to 6v6 tubes & they are very cool but I can't seem to get what I'm looking for. What I am looking for is Keith's tone on the live CD Forty Licks. I know, I know, get a fender & use pedals for lead. I have tried the Lone Star Special & the Lone Star Classic. I prefer the classic but haven't spent a great deal of time with it. So to be specific I want Keith's rhytmn tone, breakup & all, and a great lead tone. The Mark IV is a versatile amp but I'm VERY picky about tones & I feel the Mark IV does a lot of things very good but I'm looking for an amp that will do 2 things great(aren't we all?) Is the Lone Star Classic it?
Mark IV or Lone Star?
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mojo
Member
Call Mesa,
They will help you dial in the tones you want. Try Chris at Mesa Ext: 382. Great guy, has hepled me with what ever I have needed. Leave a message if you are unable to connect with him, they always return calls. Mk's can be difficult to dial in which is why I bought the LSC. The MK is more versitile though and once you have your settings I hear they're killer amps which are capable of reproducing just about any tone. You have one of the finest amps on the planet. Be patient, you'll get it.
They will help you dial in the tones you want. Try Chris at Mesa Ext: 382. Great guy, has hepled me with what ever I have needed. Leave a message if you are unable to connect with him, they always return calls. Mk's can be difficult to dial in which is why I bought the LSC. The MK is more versitile though and once you have your settings I hear they're killer amps which are capable of reproducing just about any tone. You have one of the finest amps on the planet. Be patient, you'll get it.
Thanks mojo. I'll call mesa. Like I said, I can dial in some very good tones, but I'm having a hell of a time getting the great ones. I guess I'm longing for a great plug & play amp. Thanks again. Anyone else?
no soul
Well-known member
ouch, chasing specific tones of other players can be pretty misleading, since nothing is going to make up for the fact that you arent (insert famous player here).
But it just sounds like the MkIV isnt for you.
It is a great amp, and it does take a long time to learn, but you should have had it licked after a year and a half, which to me sends up a flag saying that it just aint the amp for you.
Even if you didnt mention it, Id say a Lonestar is definitely going to be a lot closer to what you want than a MkIV.
good luck!
But it just sounds like the MkIV isnt for you.
It is a great amp, and it does take a long time to learn, but you should have had it licked after a year and a half, which to me sends up a flag saying that it just aint the amp for you.
Even if you didnt mention it, Id say a Lonestar is definitely going to be a lot closer to what you want than a MkIV.
good luck!
It just so happens I own both.
Yes the Lonestar is a much easier amp to tweak. You really can set all the knobs at 12:00 and get great sounds just by moving the knobs a little one way or the other. Thats not the only way to get sounds though. There is still a tweaky aspect to the Lonestar once you branch out and go beyond the 12:00 method. Than again what Mesa amp is'nt tweaky to some degree.
The kind of gain the Lonestar gets is more old school than the MKIV even though its a fairly new amp. The main difference between the two amps is the Lonestar has this big wide low end thats really appealing to some guys. The MKIV gets much more heavy distortion and a certain tightness and focus to its sound. Both amps are loud as hell if that matters.
I would think the Lonestar would be perfect for the sounds you want to make. IMHO.
Yes the Lonestar is a much easier amp to tweak. You really can set all the knobs at 12:00 and get great sounds just by moving the knobs a little one way or the other. Thats not the only way to get sounds though. There is still a tweaky aspect to the Lonestar once you branch out and go beyond the 12:00 method. Than again what Mesa amp is'nt tweaky to some degree.
The kind of gain the Lonestar gets is more old school than the MKIV even though its a fairly new amp. The main difference between the two amps is the Lonestar has this big wide low end thats really appealing to some guys. The MKIV gets much more heavy distortion and a certain tightness and focus to its sound. Both amps are loud as hell if that matters.
I would think the Lonestar would be perfect for the sounds you want to make. IMHO.
Hi no soul. Yeah I know chasing someones elses tone is a dead end. I've done it before & actually got it but what then? It's their tone not mine. I was was using Keith's tone as more of a reference as to the clean/breakup sound I'm looking for. And thanks AMG1 for the info. I appreciate all of you taking your time to help me.
Ok, here's an update. I've been working with this **** Mark IV even more since I started this thread. Let me first say I run it thru a 2x12 carvin Legacy cab(I know, I know!) I just always figured the're celestion 30s so it should work out ok. Also I always used it as a closed back. Anyway, I was beating my brains out as usual trying to get a sound out of the thing & sitting right next to it is my '63 Vox AC30 with blue's. Hmmm, wonder what it would sound like thru those? **** good is how it sounded. We'll could it be this Carvin cab I ask myself? So I removed the closed back portion of my legacy cab, plugged my Mark back in & what a difference! Not night & day but for right now the sound is much closer to what I'm looking for. It removed the woofy, mushy sound in channel 2. So maybe I should invest in the best speaker cab I can afford & apparently I like the sound of open back cabs. Any suggestions?
The best thing would be to take your head around and try different cabs until you find the right one.
I have a wide body combo. I've plugged it into a closed back Marshall 1922 cab and did'nt think it sounded has good as the combo speaker by itself. The combo is a Blackshadaw C-90. I though about changing the 1922 speakers with C-90's. I dont know. Also you might want to check out Avatar and see if they have a half back 2 x 12. I use thier bass cabs and think they sound great.
I have a wide body combo. I've plugged it into a closed back Marshall 1922 cab and did'nt think it sounded has good as the combo speaker by itself. The combo is a Blackshadaw C-90. I though about changing the 1922 speakers with C-90's. I dont know. Also you might want to check out Avatar and see if they have a half back 2 x 12. I use thier bass cabs and think they sound great.
Thanks AMG1. I went to the Avatar website & was checking out their 2x12 cab with celestion blues. I wonder if they can handle the wattage of a Mark IV with 6v6s. Anyone know? BTW I'm think of trying eurotubes 6v6 upgrade. I currently am using all Boogie tubes. Take care.
I'm going in to try a LSS and a Mark IV and frantically reading manuals or both to try to get a handle on running them both before I do. I'm getting totally mixed information regarding these two units. Some on here are saying that the LSS & LSC are retro sounding.... that the high gain is old school and that there isn't enough of it yet I'm hearing from others that the MKIV is chainsaw distortion and that the LS series is smooth buttery high gain. I guess I'm going to go nuts until I can try myself... From what I can tell though is the cleans on the LS series are way better than the MKIV cleans and the high gain of the MKIV is growly (honky) as opposed to a smooth tame high gain on the LS.
Hearing must be believing and will always be the final determination of amp selection... I tried the Rect-o-verb and I absolutely hated the harshness of the amp... I know some love it but for me...nope... it lacks tone to my ears ...Sorry... not meant to disrespect anyone who owns one... I'm just wanting helpful advice on this and some insite before I go try the MKIV and LSS out. I'm into smooth but blistering high gain. I absolutely love Eric Johnsons sound and Steve Vai bluesy high gain sound... these are the two players that have influenced me the most. Holdsworth is a biggie as well and the leggato smoothness I like as well... but the girth and subties of Vai and the tone of Johnson are the qualities I'm looking for... I am not looking for the exact sounds...I'm looking for range and capabilities of these qualities. So anyone who has an opinion on the best choice... My ears will be the final judge but I would appreciate some input before I try them out. Thanks
Hearing must be believing and will always be the final determination of amp selection... I tried the Rect-o-verb and I absolutely hated the harshness of the amp... I know some love it but for me...nope... it lacks tone to my ears ...Sorry... not meant to disrespect anyone who owns one... I'm just wanting helpful advice on this and some insite before I go try the MKIV and LSS out. I'm into smooth but blistering high gain. I absolutely love Eric Johnsons sound and Steve Vai bluesy high gain sound... these are the two players that have influenced me the most. Holdsworth is a biggie as well and the leggato smoothness I like as well... but the girth and subties of Vai and the tone of Johnson are the qualities I'm looking for... I am not looking for the exact sounds...I'm looking for range and capabilities of these qualities. So anyone who has an opinion on the best choice... My ears will be the final judge but I would appreciate some input before I try them out. Thanks
SabuJSE
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I think a LSS and maybe a Fuzzface, screamer, or the like will give you the tone you are looking for. I feel like I get that tone without the addin pedal and then I use the "Fuzz Pi" stomp on my Pod XTL and I'm all there.
Your mileage may vary.
Your mileage may vary.
The first time I used an LSC it sounded terrible and I could not get a decent sound out of it. A few months later at a different shop I saw the LSC and LSS, but didn't play them because of my previous experience, yet the amps looked cool and different for Mesa, so I went to the web site and started to read the manuals on them. The next weekend I went in and set the 2 channels where I thought I'd get the tone I wanted and was amazed at how Mesa had improved those amps in just a few months! 
From what you've said, I think the LSC is what you are looking for. You've already hit on a key ingredient - the speaker box. I really like the stock 2x12 LSC I have, but have used some Weber Silver Bells and they smoothed the sound out just right for my ear. The ones I had were mismatched on the power, so I am ordering the right setup, but people don't think about the speaker characteristics too often.
I think the 50/100 (33/77 in tweed) will give you the blistering sounds you want. You can keep channel one in a nice clean state and set channel 2 so that it just urges some crunch from the amp. If you want to knock it up a bit, you can flick the drive ckt in and change the thickness and you'll be in a great overdrive sound. Here is where I think (totally personal opinion) the LSC sounds a bit better than the LSS. I just am not a big fan of el84s when they are really overdriven - again just my opinion. I did have an LSS for 1 month before I swapped it for the LSC and the difference was in the drive. They are both great amps, though.
Good luck. Keep a little notebood with you to take notes on settings and your impressions. If you can walk around and listen from several angles that'll help too.
From what you've said, I think the LSC is what you are looking for. You've already hit on a key ingredient - the speaker box. I really like the stock 2x12 LSC I have, but have used some Weber Silver Bells and they smoothed the sound out just right for my ear. The ones I had were mismatched on the power, so I am ordering the right setup, but people don't think about the speaker characteristics too often.
I think the 50/100 (33/77 in tweed) will give you the blistering sounds you want. You can keep channel one in a nice clean state and set channel 2 so that it just urges some crunch from the amp. If you want to knock it up a bit, you can flick the drive ckt in and change the thickness and you'll be in a great overdrive sound. Here is where I think (totally personal opinion) the LSC sounds a bit better than the LSS. I just am not a big fan of el84s when they are really overdriven - again just my opinion. I did have an LSS for 1 month before I swapped it for the LSC and the difference was in the drive. They are both great amps, though.
Good luck. Keep a little notebood with you to take notes on settings and your impressions. If you can walk around and listen from several angles that'll help too.
Wow! I guess I should check my posts more often! I'm glad to have sparked an interest in this subject. Here's my take on it at this point, of course my opinion only. The Mark IV with the right speakers(subjective) will do most anything you want. I tried the LSS & the LSC. I didn't care for the LSS but was impressed by the LSC. I must say that I own a 1963 red panel nonTB Vox AC30 so it would probably be hard to impress me with an el84 amp! Anyway, I used my Mark IV at a gig a week ago with my carvin legacy cab(v30's) as an open back and I got to say when that thing sounds good it sounds REALLY good! I'm FINALLY getting used to tweaking the amp & got most of the sounds I want. I don't think anyone could go wrong with the LSC or Mark IV. If I had to do it over again I'd probably go with a LSC head. It's simpler to use, sounds great(thick!) & has a solo boost for both channels! This is a great feature for any gigging musician. The reason I'm staying with my Mark IV at this point is 1) it's paid for! 2) I've finally started to figure it out & 3) it's paid for! take care............
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