JAN Philips 12AX7

[domct203]

What does everyone think of this tube? Is it worth the $40 (US)?

I searched the forum but most seem to favor the GE version. What would be the differences between them (besides $$)?

Thanks,
Dom

 

[domct203]

Bump.....

Anyone have any opinion on this tube??

Dom

 

[phyrexia]

My GE is the best sounding 12ax7 I've heard, but it's so hot it's microphonic (but that's what you get when you ask for a 'high gain' tube)

 

[domct203]

My GE is the best sounding 12ax7 I've heard, but it's so hot it's microphonic (but that's what you get when you ask for a 'high gain' tube)

Thanks phyrexia. I think I'm just going to try both versions in V1, so I'll stay away from the "high gain" variety.

Dom

 

[Timbre Wolf]

I find the Philips ECG 12AX7WA to be a good choice for punchy/crunchy power chords. They've got bold, solid lows, low-mids are undefined (kinda blurry, but in a good way), and zingy highs that cut through. These are also notorious for microphonics, so get 'em well tested for use in V1.

JAN GE 12AX7WA can also have punchy lows, but have always had a more bland character, and relatively lifeless feel to me. Not to my taste.

- Thom

 

[Dreads]

I've used the JAN phillips 12ax7-wa for a while now and am quite happy with it. As far as Microphonics, the 1st one I popped in was microphonic in the Lonestar but not in the JCM 800... the second one worked fine in the Lonestar and has been in with no problems for close to 2 years. It has a great singing tone for Solos.

 

[212Mavguy]

No, it's not worth 40 bucks to a combo amp guitar player.. It is a relabeled Sylvania longplate 12ax7 with less gain than other versions of the same tube that they made. Not all military 12ax7's are resistant to microphonics, and that longplate Sylvania tends to have problems. The GE longplate 12ax7 has a nice blues tone, and because of a thicker bottle is more resistant to microphonics in circuit and their 12axa/7025 tube is designed to be even more resistant to microphonics and might well sound better than the Chinese Mesa tubes, which are ruggedly built with triple micas to resist microphonics. Long plate tubes do tend to be more microphonic than their shortplate cousins.

High power combo amps tend to destroy their tubes because the speakers vibrate them around too much at high sound pressure levels. The vibration is a big factor in causing microphonic behavior, probably more so than the normal expansion and contraction of plates and grids caused by heating and cooling during startup and shutdown, the other major cause. That is why Jim Marshall favored design of his early amps as heads. One way to help this is to damp the combo amp cabinet by placing something massive on top. Some Mesa amps like my 2 12 Maverick have a chassis mounted screw that is designed to be jammed against the cabinet top inside face to help prevent the long chassis from shaking. Mesa shockmounts their chassis in some of their combo amps. Still another way is to place 2 or three layers of 1 inch heatshrink tubing over the V1 12ax7 tube's side from 1/3 to halfway up from the pins to where it starts to curve in at the top. The hotter the heatshrink gets in operation the more rubbery it becomes, and it still absorbs a lot of the tube's heat as well. The tube may run a little hotter but that is OK when compared to running cooler and shaking around more.

My 12ax7 collection garnered in over 200 ebay buying transactions is extensive in variety, and I have experience with nearly any one ever made, euro or American...as well as impressions of tonal qualities for each brand. Peace. 8)

 

[domct203]

FWIW-

I've been running the JAN Philips 12AX7 in V2 of the Roadster (replacing a JJ ECC83S) for a few weeks now and really do like it there. Ch 3 Vintage is alot clearer, and feels more balanced tone-wise. I've backed off on the Gain & Presence and bumped up the Treble for some nice cutting lead tones w/ the band and she's still smooth. Ch 4 Modern gets the same EQ tweaks except I left the Treble alone and bumped up the mids instead. Dropped tunings sound much more articulate and don't get all "smeared up" in the low end. Overall Ch's 3 & 4 are alot smoother.

IMO with the Philips in V1 the amp was missing something in the "sizzle" department.

Here is my set-up:
V1 = Tung-Sol RI
V2 = JAN Philips 12AX7
V3 = Tung-Sol RI
V4 = Mesa Russian-2
V5 = Mesa Russian-2
V6 = Sovtek LPS

Power Tubes are SED =C= SV6L6GC.

I've ordered another JAN Philips and a JJ 803S to mess with as well.

Dom

 

[CaughtLikeFire]

I'm now running Philps in V1, V2 and my PI. For my Stilleto Ace, they're perfect. The brightness is no longer overbearing and the overdrive is very harmonically rich. I guess it's what other vendors would call a very "musical" tube.

If they last a long time, they'll definitely be worth the $40. time will tell

 

[Guitarzan]

Have you seen the prices of JAN spec stuff lately? A 5751 is almost $40 :shock:

 

[CaughtLikeFire]

Have you seen the prices of JAN spec stuff lately? A 5751 is almost $40 :shock:

dougs tubes only has balanced triode 12ax7s in stock right now but they're $42 ($40 for regular test but he's out of those). The 5751s are $19 regular test and $21 balanced I think.

 

[Anonymous]

Hey domct203, where'd you find both of those JAN Philips tubes? I'm in the processing of ordering new tubes for my Roadster (Based on the suggestions you gave me a few months ago) and I can only find a couple, but I dont think they're all the same. I've been looking mainly on tubedepot.com and right now I have the U.S. Made JAN Philips 5751 in my cart because I wasnt sure which to get. I'm probably gonna post a whole new thread about it tomorrow just to kind of clear everything up before I order but if anyone can help me out before then that would be much appreciated. Thanks, Marc

 

[Timbre Wolf]

I have experience with nearly any one ever made, euro or American...as well as impressions of tonal qualities for each brand. Peace. 8)

Hey Mav -

Ever try a short black-plate (square-getter) Sylvania 12AX7? They were made in 1957 - I find them to have the clarity of the earlier long black-plate, but with a thicker tonal character. And the bonus is that their short plates are not as microphonic. A very cool tube - if you've tried it, I'd love to hear your impressions.

- thom

 

[domct203]

Hey domct203, where'd you find both of those JAN Philips tubes? I'm in the processing of ordering new tubes for my Roadster (Based on the suggestions you gave me a few months ago) and I can only find a couple, but I dont think they're all the same. I've been looking mainly on tubedepot.com and right now I have the U.S. Made JAN Philips 5751 in my cart because I wasnt sure which to get. I'm probably gonna post a whole new thread about it tomorrow just to kind of clear everything up before I order but if anyone can help me out before then that would be much appreciated. Thanks, Marc

I got them from Doug's, but he is out of stock now.

The 5751 is not the same as the 12AX7. The 5751 has about 30% less gain.

Dom

 

[212Mavguy]

Hey Timbre Wolf,

I sure haven't tried the short black plate syl '57 12ax7, I have only seen one or two auctions of them on ebay and I would love to get my hands on a pair. I have several of the long black plate Sylvania JHS 12ax7 with the rectangular getter attached by one corner instead of sitting on a stem, and they are just about my favorite tube for blues tone, very similar in sound to the Raytheon long blackplate/rectangular geter that won the Vacuum Tube Valley 12ax7 shootout. Thanks for the good word. I get amazing tones from the Ray 5751 blackplate windmill getter and the red print Ray triple mica 12at7, all have a very similar "family" tonal character. the 12at7's sometimes can be had for fairly inexpensive prices. I've noticed that the lower the gain of the 12__7 type the less that microphonic behavior matters in an amp, too.

 

[Timbre Wolf]

I have several of the long black plate Sylvania JHS 12ax7 with the rectangular getter attached by one corner instead of sitting on a stem, and they are just about my favorite tube for blues tone, very similar in sound to the Raytheon long blackplate/rectangular geter that won the Vacuum Tube Valley 12ax7 shootout.

I love the bright clarity and liveliness of the long black-plate Sylvania 12AX7. I use Sylvania's 12AU7 of the same design era (my favorite out of all the many I've tried) for my tweed Bandmaster V1.

I also love the Raytheon, but find it breaks up much sooner. In my experience, there is no difference in sonic performance between the square-getter Raytheon and the round-getter version - just a significant price difference.

The short black-plate Sylvania 12AX7 has the clarity and dynamics of the long black-plate, but has thicker lows, and breaks up early. Like a Raytheon black-plate, but fatter. I've replaced my Triaxis V1 Raytheon with short black-plate Sylvania 12AX7.

Good luck with the tubehunting!

- Thom

 

[212Mavguy]

Hey Timbre Wolf,

Feel free to spam me if you see any of those Syl 12ax7 short bp's on ebay, [email protected]. On the Ray rectangular getter long bp /round getter long bp, I do hear a difference, the rectangular is fatter on bottom, and the round getter has more of an upper mid spike in it's tone. Both are very sweet and gorgeous to my ears, my preference is for the rectangular getter unit. Have a few of both types.

It sure is fun to roll tubes, and on the 12au7 type, have you tried a 6085/e80cc? Similar gain. They are built very well, very non microphonic, and sound amazing. If you hit a 6085 with a clean boost the edge on their dirty tone is smoother, nice balance and complex musical harmonics. Their clean tone would do your Fender proud. They are too long in the bottle to fit under a 12ax7 tube shield, but no big deal. Glad to hear from a fellow vintage tube enjoyer!

 

[Timbre Wolf]

Glad to hear from a fellow vintage tube enjoyer!

Me too!

I've not got any E80CC, but I've used E180CC (& 12BH7 and 12BZ7) - those tall bottles with long plates have superior clarity, if you can find non-microphonic ones.

I'll drop you a line if I ever see the s-b-p Sylvania 12AX7 around. New Years cheers to you!

- Thom