Is the Express a stripped version of the Mark V?
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EtherealWidow
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Ahhhh man..... I'm so high right now. It's like... everything in the universe is just.... an expanded version of itself... Like.... God.... is just... an expanded version of ourselves.... Like.... we could be God if we could just.... expand.... You know?MrMarkIII said:
TimeSignature
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matt! said:
I consider the Express series the Mark Jr's.
giorikas81
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I guess it depends on the use intended. Mesa character can be found in all of mesa's cheap lines. And every dc owner or f owner or .50+ owner can pop up and say WOW I've got a simpler mark how cool is that. Then you play a famous mark-based riff and sounds cool and there it is!
Being "based" on fender amps in a way maybe means, that when adjusted properly and for sounds that both amps can coax they will be alike.
But in no way an express is a mark or mark jr in any section. Not the power section, certainly not the preamp section. This is not a bad thing. Maybe it fulfils the need for mark-ish sounds for its owner but, it differs way too much in circuit design anyway.
Still for heavy gain I have yet to hear any clip from the express line that resembles the tightness or aggresiveness of previous mesa lines and surely the mark series. For cleans or blues or high rock, I think that the express can hold its own anyway? Some prefer its cleans to any amp. Any thoughts?
Being "based" on fender amps in a way maybe means, that when adjusted properly and for sounds that both amps can coax they will be alike.
But in no way an express is a mark or mark jr in any section. Not the power section, certainly not the preamp section. This is not a bad thing. Maybe it fulfils the need for mark-ish sounds for its owner but, it differs way too much in circuit design anyway.
Still for heavy gain I have yet to hear any clip from the express line that resembles the tightness or aggresiveness of previous mesa lines and surely the mark series. For cleans or blues or high rock, I think that the express can hold its own anyway? Some prefer its cleans to any amp. Any thoughts?
TimeSignature
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giorikas81 said:
Is it a Mark IV lead channel OR an Express 5:50 burn channel (gain maxed) with some sort of boost in front - You would fail a blindfolded listening test .
Heritage Softail
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The Express series is a response to a customer need. Marketing a pretty good gain amp, good cleans/blues, very low priced comparatively, light weight, good low volume but can do small places minum king kong drummer.
It will probably get lots of new people considering a boogie. It is a nice little amp. I will definitely look for one next year on the used market. I am thinking my AC Boost will get it in a foul mood. The jury is still out on buying a Wampler Triple Wreck. That definitely transforms a little pup into a near rectifier.
That person getting an Express and adding a few pedals over a year or two will probably buy a 'full sized' Boogie in the future. I think the Express is the gateway drug to get you hooked on Boogie....
It will probably get lots of new people considering a boogie. It is a nice little amp. I will definitely look for one next year on the used market. I am thinking my AC Boost will get it in a foul mood. The jury is still out on buying a Wampler Triple Wreck. That definitely transforms a little pup into a near rectifier.
That person getting an Express and adding a few pedals over a year or two will probably buy a 'full sized' Boogie in the future. I think the Express is the gateway drug to get you hooked on Boogie....
TimeSignature
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Heritage Softail said:
Gateway drug? LOL. Good analogy.
I actually own a Mark IV and a DC10... but reeeaally want an express 5:50!
giorikas81
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TimeSignature said:
I don't doubt that but I still think you can actually adjust the mark IV's lead channel to give you sounds the express can't touch, plus, it is unboosted. I know one cannot use a crazy amount of gain anyway. But even from my studio preamp and triaxis I am getting sounds that no other mesa can touch (from the studio-dc-f-express line) or gives me exactly.
Of course as I mentioned, I trully think that you can bring these amps very close and for some people it will be more than close enough. For example the way I set up my sound gives a similar result in the f-30 and the triaxis through power amps and maybe these means that the sound I like, they both give. Maybe I don't need a more expensive boogie after all!!!
But even if the sound is similar, is it the feel of these two amps (express boosted and mark IV unboosted) the same? Is the graphic eq and the predistortion tone stack combination able to put out tight metal rythm ??? Does the express counteract it? You got em, tell us!
I never saw the express line or its relatives as cost cutting boogie line and I don't think randall smith ever did. It is still a very expensive amp. The components are supposed to be of the high quality mesa uses. The cabinet on the 5:50 is bigger than the smallbody 112 combo format of older marks "full sized boogies?".
Their power sections maybe simpler but still efficient for live use. Even petrucci used an f-50 for clean and this alone says a-lot.
By the way. Mike B and co designed much of the later mark series. I only see smith getting to design (?) these lines? Maybe it is his to play and fool around? The others (mark recto) are pretty much classics and hard to change and mess up their thing.
Don
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The Express is a great "working man's" amp. Tha fact that it drew in a player like me- I've played electric blues for the past 30 years and play ing a classic rock band and a blues band- says a lot.
Previously, I was using a '66 Vibrolux Reverb, a '68 Princeton Reverb (which I sold to buy my Express 5:50 1x12 combo) and a tweed Deluxe 5E3 clone. I still use the Deluxe clone but barely touch the VR. The Express covers a lot of ground. I love that I can carry it (I'm too old to carry a Mark combo) into a blues jam and have a great clean sound, dirty sound and almost fuzz type of sound straight from the amp.
The amp did it's job. I've been converted!
BTW, I do my own amp repairs (except on my Express which is under warranty) and noticed that this amp is built WAY better and uses much better components than any comparable recent Fender or Marshall amps. The difference is incredible! It's a joy to open it up and take a look inside!
Previously, I was using a '66 Vibrolux Reverb, a '68 Princeton Reverb (which I sold to buy my Express 5:50 1x12 combo) and a tweed Deluxe 5E3 clone. I still use the Deluxe clone but barely touch the VR. The Express covers a lot of ground. I love that I can carry it (I'm too old to carry a Mark combo) into a blues jam and have a great clean sound, dirty sound and almost fuzz type of sound straight from the amp.
The amp did it's job. I've been converted!
BTW, I do my own amp repairs (except on my Express which is under warranty) and noticed that this amp is built WAY better and uses much better components than any comparable recent Fender or Marshall amps. The difference is incredible! It's a joy to open it up and take a look inside!
TimeSignature
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I never meant to imply that the Express was Mesa's way of cost cutting [from the Mark series...]
Don
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Mesa does things the old fashioned way. Like Gibson did with the Les Paul Jr in the '50s, the Express is made in the same plant, by the same people, with basically the same materials, and just has less content than the higher priced models.
I hope they never change that.
I hope they never change that.
Newysurfer
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MrMarkIII said:
Maybe.....
I always thought the Express amps were a higher gain version of the Lonestars.
but now I'm not so sure
It's a chicken and egg kinda thing.
They're all Mesa's but - pretty sure about that :mrgreen:
TimeSignature
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Id say it was a stripped down Mark IV ... since the Mark V didnt exist when the Express series came out.
Silly I know. lol
Silly I know. lol
I agree with the the Express being much more like a LoneStar than a Mark. It's like a LSS, but with more gain. Great cleans, stellar semi-cleans, and more saturated OD than an LSS (dunno about the LSC, though).
Edward
Edward
EtherealWidow
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That's actually what Mark (you know, the one with all the demo videos) told me. More like a High Gain Lonestar.edward said:
Marcus71
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I know I am late to this thread but....
I am a huge Mesa fan. I had a 2 and 3 channel Dual Recto. I also had a Mark IV combo and a Road King II head. Eventually, however, my ears fell out of love with the Recto high gain sound. When I started playing again a couple of months back, I bought a very early Mark III. Unfortunately, I didn't know how to use it properly. I loved the clean channel but couldn't get the gain side where I wanted it. It was always there. I just didn't know the amp. But I gave up and went through a number of other amps and played around 50 or so.
I bought a Mark V combo. And while there are some great tones in that amp, I returned it because it's too complicated. The older I get, the less switches and knobs I want on gear. I was lucky enough to buy a Mark III blue stripe at a reasonable price. Once I learned how to set the amp up, I fell in love with it. And I really like it plugged into a 2X12 cab I have with Greenbacks. The sound is incredible.
Of course I wanted another amp, but something simpler than the Mark V. I played all of the Lonestar amps, the Stilettos, and Electrodyne, and the Express. I really like the Lonestar Special combo's clean channel. But I couldn't get the gain where I wanted it in channel 2. The Stiletto combo I didn't care for the the new Deuce head was too bright. The ED I love. And the same with the Express.
I bought an Express 5:50 instead of an ED 2X12 mostly due to size and weight. I found their tone very comparable (in the store at least). But I think the Express is a little more versatile.
Last Thursday I took my Express to band practice and the thing simply smoked. I do not use distortion or overdrive pedals. I never have. What I like the both the ED and the Express is that neither sound like a Recto. The gain never gets super fuzzy and brittle. And I also locked in great tone in about 2 minutes. For a Mesa amp, that's amazing. Given the small number of knobs, I am sure the ED is the same way.
Mesa amps are superior engineered. But sometimes, I think there's too **** much. I am all for versatility, but these days I want simplicity. Look at old Marshalls and Fenders. How many knobs? 5? 6?
As to the original question: is the Express a stripped Mark V? I don't know. But I do know, the Express will get a lot of the same tones a Mark V will with much less work. The Mark V may have more gain in channel 3, but I never dime the gain anyway, so it's gain I would never use. For my money, however, I don't think the price difference between a Mark V combo and an Express combo is worth it....but based on my needs though. YMMV.
I may end up buying a 5:25 too, or I may buy an ED 1X12. Or even a Transatlantic. :lol:
I am a huge Mesa fan. I had a 2 and 3 channel Dual Recto. I also had a Mark IV combo and a Road King II head. Eventually, however, my ears fell out of love with the Recto high gain sound. When I started playing again a couple of months back, I bought a very early Mark III. Unfortunately, I didn't know how to use it properly. I loved the clean channel but couldn't get the gain side where I wanted it. It was always there. I just didn't know the amp. But I gave up and went through a number of other amps and played around 50 or so.
I bought a Mark V combo. And while there are some great tones in that amp, I returned it because it's too complicated. The older I get, the less switches and knobs I want on gear. I was lucky enough to buy a Mark III blue stripe at a reasonable price. Once I learned how to set the amp up, I fell in love with it. And I really like it plugged into a 2X12 cab I have with Greenbacks. The sound is incredible.
Of course I wanted another amp, but something simpler than the Mark V. I played all of the Lonestar amps, the Stilettos, and Electrodyne, and the Express. I really like the Lonestar Special combo's clean channel. But I couldn't get the gain where I wanted it in channel 2. The Stiletto combo I didn't care for the the new Deuce head was too bright. The ED I love. And the same with the Express.
I bought an Express 5:50 instead of an ED 2X12 mostly due to size and weight. I found their tone very comparable (in the store at least). But I think the Express is a little more versatile.
Last Thursday I took my Express to band practice and the thing simply smoked. I do not use distortion or overdrive pedals. I never have. What I like the both the ED and the Express is that neither sound like a Recto. The gain never gets super fuzzy and brittle. And I also locked in great tone in about 2 minutes. For a Mesa amp, that's amazing. Given the small number of knobs, I am sure the ED is the same way.
Mesa amps are superior engineered. But sometimes, I think there's too **** much. I am all for versatility, but these days I want simplicity. Look at old Marshalls and Fenders. How many knobs? 5? 6?
As to the original question: is the Express a stripped Mark V? I don't know. But I do know, the Express will get a lot of the same tones a Mark V will with much less work. The Mark V may have more gain in channel 3, but I never dime the gain anyway, so it's gain I would never use. For my money, however, I don't think the price difference between a Mark V combo and an Express combo is worth it....but based on my needs though. YMMV.
I may end up buying a 5:25 too, or I may buy an ED 1X12.
Or even a Transatlantic. :lol:
A
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Nice post, Marcus. I have a very similar feeling about the Express--some nice Boogie tones which are easily accessible, in a nice sized package. I also love 5 watt mode, as I use it as my "practice" amp, too.
Is it a stripped Mark V? Don't think so, I've always heard it was more similar to the Lonstar than anything else. But Boogie's designs all have some similarities, and this is where I think they've excelled over the years. The don't just use the same circuits over and over (a la Fender) with ever-cheapening parts and assembly (a la Fender), they refine their circuits and tone over time, perhaps simplifying them here and there for some amps like the Express.
I've been considering a Transatlantic, too. Could sit that puppy right on top of the 5:50 for when I'd like some classic Vox tones. Tasty.
Is it a stripped Mark V? Don't think so, I've always heard it was more similar to the Lonstar than anything else. But Boogie's designs all have some similarities, and this is where I think they've excelled over the years. The don't just use the same circuits over and over (a la Fender) with ever-cheapening parts and assembly (a la Fender), they refine their circuits and tone over time, perhaps simplifying them here and there for some amps like the Express.
I've been considering a Transatlantic, too. Could sit that puppy right on top of the 5:50 for when I'd like some classic Vox tones. Tasty.
I just tried a Mark V yesterday. Iv'e had my 5:25 for 11 months and know it pretty well now. After playing the Mk V for an hour i'd have to say I don't think the Express is a cut down version. The Express has a distinct voice to my ears. No matter what setting on what Channel it sounds like the express. The Mark V on the other hand seems to have unlimited shapping and it's voice can be shifted pretty much anywhere you'd want to go.
Mk V tone controls all seemed better balanced. I found most of the tones I wanted with the tone controls just about flat. No need to turn the bass down and trebble up. Sound clarity and definition are both at a higher level.
6L6 vs El84 probably makes a big difference, though I have played a 5:50 and I find there is much more difference between the MKV and the Express amps than there is between the 5:50 and 5:25.
The express is still by far the best amp I have ever owned, but the MKV takes it to another level. If only Mesa amps were a reasonable price im my country.
Mk V tone controls all seemed better balanced. I found most of the tones I wanted with the tone controls just about flat. No need to turn the bass down and trebble up. Sound clarity and definition are both at a higher level.
6L6 vs El84 probably makes a big difference, though I have played a 5:50 and I find there is much more difference between the MKV and the Express amps than there is between the 5:50 and 5:25.
The express is still by far the best amp I have ever owned, but the MKV takes it to another level. If only Mesa amps were a reasonable price im my country.
Scooterjohn
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I don't know how the Mark V sounds...never tried it, but I sure hope the Express 5:50 sounds more like a Lonestar than a Mark IV...because I don't like that amp at all. I've heard great sounds out of the Early Recto via Dave Meniketti (when he had his solo band) but some pretty ugly sounds out of the new ones (and I'm more of a rock guy than a full-on blues purist).
I loved the Lonestar cleans, when I demoed one, but it was a touch short of gain for my taste. Can a 5:50 get anything like a Mark II lead sound? I've heard (by some) that the 5:50's crunch channel can get a touch Marshall'y if you want it too...and that's not a bad thing.
I play classic rock, some jazz and blues and some modern rock. I'd rather have an amp that gets a passable modern sound (with a pedal, if necessary), but really good clean and classic tones, than an amp that gets scary molten metal sounds....but sounds like %#^ on everything else. There plenty of high gain amps out there like that already.
The RoadKing would probably fit that bill, but it's way too much amp (not to mention the weight) for what I need right now. I'm trying to scale down a bit for Maui playing. I already have a hundred watt three channel amp in storage as it is.
There's no Mesa dealer on this Island, but I have a friend that has the 5:50. He does a lot of Solo gigs as well as shows with his band, and when I've heard him use the Mesa, he had it dialed in to sound somewhat like the Roland amp he uses for his solo gigs. It's the kind of rhythm sound (with a Tele) he's used to using, I guess. I'm hoping to demo his within the next couple of days, where I can explore some of it's other sounds...I go for a wide range, myself.
Sorry if I'm rambling a bit, but I'm really hoping that amp will fit the bill for me.
I loved the Lonestar cleans, when I demoed one, but it was a touch short of gain for my taste. Can a 5:50 get anything like a Mark II lead sound? I've heard (by some) that the 5:50's crunch channel can get a touch Marshall'y if you want it too...and that's not a bad thing.
I play classic rock, some jazz and blues and some modern rock. I'd rather have an amp that gets a passable modern sound (with a pedal, if necessary), but really good clean and classic tones, than an amp that gets scary molten metal sounds....but sounds like %#^ on everything else. There plenty of high gain amps out there like that already.
The RoadKing would probably fit that bill, but it's way too much amp (not to mention the weight) for what I need right now. I'm trying to scale down a bit for Maui playing. I already have a hundred watt three channel amp in storage as it is.
There's no Mesa dealer on this Island, but I have a friend that has the 5:50. He does a lot of Solo gigs as well as shows with his band, and when I've heard him use the Mesa, he had it dialed in to sound somewhat like the Roland amp he uses for his solo gigs. It's the kind of rhythm sound (with a Tele) he's used to using, I guess. I'm hoping to demo his within the next couple of days, where I can explore some of it's other sounds...I go for a wide range, myself.
Sorry if I'm rambling a bit, but I'm really hoping that amp will fit the bill for me.
