Has the release of the JP-2C affected original mkiic+ value?

[sharkinabus]

Hi all,

Wondering if the release of the JP-2C has impacted the going price or demand for original MKiic+ amps?

Cheers,

 

[dlpasco]

Hi all,

Wondering if the release of the JP-2C has impacted the going price or demand for original MKiic+ amps?

Cheers,

Well, I for one, don't want an original IIC+ anymore. All that I see when I look at them now is a single tone stack and limitations.

 

[drinkingdeath01]

I imagine it will come down to its reputation. If the JP holds its own next to the original then I would say yes, it will drop the value on them. I doubt it will be much because purists like myself will enjoy having an original. I have both but I only had my JP for about twenty minutes before something let loose in it and I had to send it in for warranty work. Should be back home this week. I am looking forward to doing a side by side with my iic+ coli.

 

[Markedman]

If anything I expect the price to increase. The originals are extremely flexible and have a tone that is uncomparable to any other amp. Mark IIC+ amps really can't be cloned like Dumble, Marshall or Trainwreck amps, the JP2C is the closest, but it is not really the same at all, it actually has more in common with the Mark V and the Mark V25 than it does with an original Mark IIC+. The C+ amps are the king of the hill when it comes to all amplifiers, any amplifier, not just Mesa, therefore I expect the price to go through the roof in the next decade. With all the new offerings from Mesa Boogie and the boutique market becoming oversaturated, the amplifier market will become similar to the high end art collector market where people want the original not a copy. I would put my particular Mark IIC++ up against any amp out there in a tone challenge, my amp is the meanest most aggressive and passionate organic amplifier I have ever heard. The graphic EQ is what really sets these amps apart and once you master that the amp becomes an extension of your soul.

 

[kc_ksom]

Why cant a Mark IIC+ be cloned like other amps noted ??

Just curious is all

Regards

Casey

 

[Boogiebabies]

Hi all,

Wondering if the release of the JP-2C has impacted the going price or demand for original MKiic+ amps?

Cheers,

Well, I for one, don't want an original IIC+ anymore. All that I see when I look at them now is a single tone stack and limitations.

Until the 37 relays and complicated circuit go down. I have owned 11 C+'s and the JP sounds nothing like any of them.

The reissue will only make the originals go up in value as this is a meager attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
Sounds like a massaged MK IV to me.

 

[DaveP]

I have owned plenty of C+s of every variety.
I had sold them all at one point and decided to try the JP-2C instead of looking for another C+

I ended up selling it and buying another C+ DRG.
The JP-2C is NOT the same as a real C+.
I could go on to describe the differences in feel and tone but it would have to something you experienced for yourself to come to that conclusion.

 

[Buster Leggs]

I have owned plenty of C+s of every variety.
I had sold them all at one point and decided to try the JP-2C instead of looking for another C+

I ended up selling it and buying another C+ DRG.
The JP-2C is NOT the same as a real C+.
I could go on to describe the differences in feel and tone but it would have to something you experienced for yourself to come to that conclusion.

+1 ,I love the JP features but whole heartedly agree with Dave P and others that are experienced with the originals . For some or maybe many the JP is the perfect amp. Fortunately my expectations were realistic so I wasn't let down . The original C+ inspires me to be a better player .But then I'm sure there are those that feel that same way about the JP 2C. Its a matter of individual preference. Yesterday after practice I was putting it up for sale. But I think I'll spend a little more time working with what I have instead of frustrating myself by trying to get it to sound like something its not. No disrespect intended for all who love the JP. Also I'm not a metal guitarist and I feel that's probably its strong point.

 

[SamuelJ86]

this is a meager attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
Sounds like a massaged MK IV to me.

I would've thought that most of us boogie players out there would have a little more respect for the guys at mesa, and John Petrucci. Now everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I cannot get close to calling the JP2C a "meager" attempt at anything.

Mesa is a business, and they are trying to make money. But their history speaks for itself. Great sounding, built like a tank, versatile amps. Not meager attempts at making some easy money.

I guess you can call me naive, but I belive most of what Petrucci says when he talks about his new amp. I think he speaks from the heart and obviously he doesn't back anything he doesn't play. And the guys at mesa who made the originals are still there. They've helped build a great company and I don't think they're going to start letting meager attempts go out the door now.

Sorry Boogiebabies, but I gotta check you here.

 

[LesterPaul1]

Plenty to search on this forum about other marks and resale value...
I'm not in any hurry to move these "limited" dinosaurs I own
( talk about limited, that SLO of mine must be a pos, too! :! 8) )
... Btw, I personally think Ed has plenty of respect for Mesa/ hell, he has owned em all and taught most of us everything we know

Different horses for different courses( isn't that how the saying goes?)

 

[Markedman]

I guess the truth hurts! I bought my JP2C knowing that it wouldn't sound, act, feel or be a C+. If I wanted another C+ for the money I spent I could've got another C+. So far I've only demo'd the new amp at a guitar store so that's all my experience has been but I have played a mark five extensively and that is why I am buying the new amp. You would have to be naïve to believe the hype coming out of any company about their new product not just Mesa Boogie. The latest and greatest often times does not live up to what it's built to be. Just take a look at golf clubs for example. Is there anyone who's being honest that says a mark five sounds like a C+ in real life, not fantasy? Just as Mesa Boogie said, there will be some purists out there that will resist the new offering. I'm sure a boutique amplifier maker could come closer to nailing the original C+ tone than this amp ever will and that's fine by me.

 

[gts]

this is a meager attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
Sounds like a massaged MK IV to me.

I would've thought that most of us boogie players out there would have a little more respect for the guys at mesa

Those of us who have been around on the boogie board for years respect the guys at Mesa immensely.
But respect doesn't mean taking any and everything to be the truth. We know when they are blowing smoke/ when there is marketing hype.
Like you say below "Mesa is a business". Sometimes marketing hype is what businesses do.

Now everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I cannot get close to calling the JP2C a "meager" attempt at anything.

Then don't!
But until your knowledge and experience is up to par with BB's (Ed's) you don't have the slightest clue about what he's saying/ talking about.

Mesa is a business, and they are trying to make money.

Like stated above sometimes 'marketing hype' is part of trying to make money.

But their history speaks for itself. Great sounding, built like a tank, versatile amps.

You're preaching to the choir here Samuel. Nobody here is in doubt. WE ALL know this!
And for those of us here who have direct experience with a C+, we know the amazing sounding, responsive, and versatile amp that it is!
And we know it does these things in ways that no other Mesa amp has done since it's creation.
That's why there are all these "C+ modes (or whatever they are called) on newer Mesa amps. All trying to catch the magic of this very special and unique amp!

Not meager attempts at making some easy money.

This is your naivety exposing itself. No one is claiming the design and production of the JP2C is or was easy.
But we know an attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
We are referring to the many references made regarding the C+ with many amps Mesa has available for sale these days. The hype started with the Mk-V.
Their "C+" channels, modes, (whatever you or they want to call them) on all these amps has never come close to making these amps sound or behave like what a real C+ does and can do.

I guess you can call me naive

Sorry Sam but you are naive.

but I belive most of what Petrucci says when he talks about his new amp. I think he speaks from the heart and obviously he doesn't back anything he doesn't play.

Great, good for you, believe what you want.
Heartfelt or not, do know how much Petrucci gets paid for his endorsement of the JP-2C?

And the guys at mesa who made the originals are still there.

Yeah and many of us here know this as well. What's your point?

They've helped build a great company and I don't think they're going to start letting meager attempts go out the door now.

You could really benefit from some research and reading of the 100's of posts and threads here on the board..... as well as some direct knowledge and experience.

Sorry Boogiebabies, but I gotta check you here.

Gotta check BB? You'd be better off checking the 100's of insightful posts Ed has made here over many years which have benefited all of us!
He's one of the most knowledgeable individuals when it comes to Mesa Mark series amps. In particular the C+!!

... Btw, I personally think Ed has plenty of respect for Mesa/ hell, he has owned em all and taught most of us everything we know

+100

 

[DaveP]

SamuelJ86 wrote:
And the guys at mesa who made the originals are still there.

GTS wrote:
Yeah and many of us here know this as well. What's your point?

I find it interesting that Mike B was a major contributor to the original C+. He is the one who designed the effects loop circuit. (correct me if i'm wrong)
From what what I understand Mike B didn't have too much (if any) input on the JP-2C. Why?
So Mesa releases the JP-2C and what do you know. It has an effects loop issue.

Point is, if you're going to release a new version of the C+ at least include all the original people involved. Maybe Mike didn't want to. Would be interesting to know why he wasn't.

 

[SamuelJ86]

Let me be a little more clear before I get anymore responses like the one gts gave. :shock: First, I have nothing but respect for Boogiebabies. Second, I am naive. I was defending the amp. It's a great amp. I read Boogiebabies post as a dis at the amp. It's not a meager amp and it's not a meager attempt at marketing. It's a great amp and its a great attempt at marketing. It sounds more like a mark V after a shiatsu anyway. :lol:

 

[gts]

Let me be a little more clear before I get anymore responses like the one gts gave. :shock: First, I have nothing but respect for Boogiebabies. Second, I am naive. I was defending the amp. It's a great amp. I read Boogiebabies post as a dis at the amp. It's not a meager amp and it's not a meager attempt at marketing. It's a great amp and its a great attempt at marketing. It sounds more like a mark V after a shiatsu anyway. :lol:

Nothing personal Samuel.
But like you said to BB I was simply offering up the same to you; aka "Sorry SamuelJ86, but I gotta check you here"
What I wrote was a bit more expansive than that simple comment but was done with the intent to help get you up to speed.
Read all the other posts in this thread. Many have a similar perception about the hype (and comparisons to a real C+) regarding the JP-2C.

If the JP-2C is working for you (along with your Mk-V) that's great! All the more power to you!
Someday it is hoped you'll get the chance to own a real C+ so you can get some direct experience.
Then and only then will you be able to truly understand what DaveP stated so well and succinctly - quoted here:

The JP-2C is NOT the same as a real C+.
I could go on to describe the differences in feel and tone but it would have to something you experienced for yourself to come to that conclusion.

Until then rock on and enjoy!

 

[MrSmitty]

Every once in a while I'll scan the internet for a IIC+ for sale. I saw one recently for around $5000! I don't recall if it was original or not. But holy crap, not in my budget. Someday hopefully I'll get a true C+, in the meantime my III+ will have to suffice for my needs.

Not to stir the pot regarding the marketing hype. But yeah, I have to agree towards the hype. There is a video or two of Mr. JP demonstrating and stating the Mark V (IIC+ mode) is equal or better than an actual C+. So, if that's the case, then why look any further?....and why now make a JP2C amp?

 

[SamuelJ86]

Every once in a while I'll scan the internet for a IIC+ for sale. I saw one recently for around $5000! I don't recall if it was original or not. But holy crap, not in my budget. Someday hopefully I'll get a true C+, in the meantime my III+ will have to suffice for my needs.

Yea, there's one on reverb for 5 grand or something. That might be the one you're talking about. Then a few days ago ponytrekker put up a post trying to give board members the first shot at one of his. It's also (like the 5 grand one) a DRG, but it's a combo with the imbuya. And it looked nice!! Sold for $3200 I think. And sold within an hour or two. A very good deal indeed. Sometimes you can get lucky and find a reasonable deal. But you gotta jump on it when you got the chance.

 

[Boogiebabies]

this is a meager attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
Sounds like a massaged MK IV to me.

I would've thought that most of us boogie players out there would have a little more respect for the guys at mesa, and John Petrucci. Now everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I cannot get close to calling the JP2C a "meager" attempt at anything.

Mesa is a business, and they are trying to make money. But their history speaks for itself. Great sounding, built like a tank, versatile amps. Not meager attempts at making some easy money.

I guess you can call me naive, but I belive most of what Petrucci says when he talks about his new amp. I think he speaks from the heart and obviously he doesn't back anything he doesn't play. And the guys at mesa who made the originals are still there. They've helped build a great company and I don't think they're going to start letting meager attempts go out the door now.

Sorry Boogiebabies, but I gotta check you here.

Oh boy, you drank the Kool-Aid.

 

[Boogiebabies]

Every once in a while I'll scan the internet for a IIC+ for sale. I saw one recently for around $5000! I don't recall if it was original or not. But holy crap, not in my budget. Someday hopefully I'll get a true C+, in the meantime my III+ will have to suffice for my needs.

Not to stir the pot regarding the marketing hype. But yeah, I have to agree towards the hype. There is a video or two of Mr. JP demonstrating and stating the Mark V (IIC+ mode) is equal or better than an actual C+. So, if that's the case, then why look any further?....and why now make a JP2C amp?

Exactly. Why make it ?

 

[JOEY B.]

this is a meager attempt to cash in on marketing hype.
Sounds like a massaged MK IV to me.

I would've thought that most of us boogie players out there would have a little more respect for the guys at mesa, and John Petrucci. Now everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I cannot get close to calling the JP2C a "meager" attempt at anything.

Mesa is a business, and they are trying to make money. But their history speaks for itself. Great sounding, built like a tank, versatile amps. Not meager attempts at making some easy money.

I guess you can call me naive, but I belive most of what Petrucci says when he talks about his new amp. I think he speaks from the heart and obviously he doesn't back anything he doesn't play. And the guys at mesa who made the originals are still there. They've helped build a great company and I don't think they're going to start letting meager attempts go out the door now.

Sorry Boogiebabies, but I gotta check you here.

Oh boy, you drank the Kool-Aid.

Lemon-lime or Black Cherry, that is the real question here.



Nothing against a new MESA amp, as I just bought a Prodigy 4:88 from Sweetwater. I'll keep my old guitar amps, though.