Finally found the tone in the Stiletto

[Guitarz_18]

Ok, thanks to SGTthump, I've been experimenting with
the crunch setting on channel one. That is the low end I've
been ranting about. It doesn't have enough gain but
that setting really is the best sounding and closest
to a Marshall tone that I can come up with.

Now, the manual says that the crunch settings are duplicated
from channel one to channel two but the crunch setting sounds
totally different on the second channel. Its the low end that
changes and no matter what setting I use in channel two there
is a certain mid freq that I just can't get out of there. The same
tone is not on channel one at all, in any setting.

Has anyone else experienced the tonal differences in the crunch
setting from channel one to channel two?

I'm excited about the tone again but it sucks that it is on the
channel one because I need to be able to switch from clean
to dirty, now I can't because both tones that I need are on
the same channel.

As a side note, my band is going into the studio this weekend.
I can't wait to experiment with the tones. My main tone is
my duel recto and then I'm gonna double everything with the
Stiletto. I'm thinking now that I'll use two tracks of duel recto,
one track of channel one crunch from the Stiletto and then
another track of tite from channel two of the Stiletto.
I think that would be a wall of tone! I'll post how it goes.

 

[redmax61]

Very cool!

I had a chance to noodle with a Stiletto Trident last week when I band I was engineering was in the studio. I was running the guitar player's Stiletto into one of my Marshall Vintage 30/Greenback cabinets. They were a really heavy Modernish band and they made the setup sound freaking amazing.

I was curious though, if someone were looking for more of a vintage Marshall feel, what the Stiletto would sound like going through a cabinet full of Greenbacks alone.

 

[Nomad100]

I've been playing around with my new Stiletto Trident, and agree that the best sound I've found so far is the crunch mode on channel one. (And it actually sounds even better with a slight boost in front of it).

That mid voice on all the channel 2 modes is tough to get rid of. I've put a small eq pedal in the loop, and this helped quite a bit.

 

[Silverwulf]

If I recall correctly, the Hollywood Mod also makes the Channel 2 "Crunch" mode identical to the Channel 1 "Crunch" mode. So, maybe that's what you need, especially if it pumps a little gain into it.

 

[Guitarz_18]

If I recall correctly, the Hollywood Mod also makes the Channel 2 "Crunch" mode identical to the Channel 1 "Crunch" mode. So, maybe that's what you need, especially if it pumps a little gain into it.

Man, if your right, then the Hollywood mod is exactly what I need.
That would take my love/hate for this amp and make it a real
contender. I love the clean tones and now the crunch mode tones,
but of course I need them on different channels. Man, why didn't Mesa
do some research and testing before they released this amp?

 

[CudBucket]

G18, what settings were you using?

Dave

 

[Guitarz_18]

G18, what settings were you using?

Dave

Presence at noon, bass full on, mid full off, treble at 11:30, gain
anywhere from noon to full on, volume as loud as I can stand it
and with a MXR ZW44 in front of it. Its mainly the bass response
which is so great in that mode, better than any other mode and
it doesn't have that mid tone that I get all over channel two.
The knobs may seem extreme, but to my ears, that's how it sounds
great and closest to my Marshalls. You may not get the same results,
I've tried other settings that others have suggested but it doesn't sound
the same, I guess the tone really is in your hands and technique,
or in my case lack of technique :wink:

But I am happy with what's coming out of the speakers, I mean really
happy, finally!

 

[SgtThump]

Man, why didn't Mesa
do some research and testing before they released this amp?

Glad to hear you're digging the crunch mode on the blue channel. I love that mode myself. What do you mean "why didn't mesa do research and testing?" I've seen a few people around the web say the amp was released too early, simply because it didn't fit their exact needs.

I love this amp in it's stock form, so I don't think for a second that they released it too early. I think it sounds fantastic.

Seems like the Mesa heads don't like it, but guys like me that haven't really been too into the Mesa tone love it. It just doesn't have the typical Mesa tone.

Chris

 

[Guitarz_18]

Man, why didn't Mesa
do some research and testing before they released this amp?

Glad to hear you're digging the crunch mode on the blue channel. I love that mode myself. What do you mean "why didn't mesa do research and testing?" I've seen a few people around the web say the amp was released too early, simply because it didn't fit their exact needs.

I love this amp in it's stock form, so I don't think for a second that they released it too early. I think it sounds fantastic.

Seems like the Mesa heads don't like it, but guys like me that haven't really been too into the Mesa tone love it. It just doesn't have the typical Mesa tone.Chris

Ok, the reason I say that is because the "crunch" mode on channel
one does not sound like "crunch" mode on channel two. But, the
manual says they're the same, but they're not. If they had
done more testing, then they would have fixed that, and the
mids that you can't dial out of the channel two and the totally
flubby bass on the "fluid drive" on channel two.
There wouldn't be a Hollywood Mod if there didn't need to be.
That's what I mean. The amp in stock form is good, but not as great
as it could be.

 

[SgtThump]

Ok, the reason I say that is because the "crunch" mode on channel
one does not sound like "crunch" mode on channel two. But, the
manual says they're the same, but they're not. If they had
done more testing, then they would have fixed that, and the
mids that you can't dial out of the channel two and the totally
flubby bass on the "fluid drive" on channel two.
There wouldn't be a Hollywood Mod if there didn't need to be.
That's what I mean. The amp in stock form is good, but not as great
as it could be.

I hear ya, but what it boils down to is that they designed the amp the way they wanted and you don't like it. It's not that it was released too early or without testing. You just don't dig it.

About the crunch mode, I believe the manual says the controls on the red and blue channels act differently, so if you set the controls the same, the "crunch" mode will not sound the same on both channels. You'll have to dial it in using your ears. I haven't tried this, so I'm still not sure how alike they are.

Are you setting the controls the same or are you dialing them it to sound the same?

 

[Bobbypols]

I think, maybe your both right...i think they find a comprimise between releasing it early and satisfying thier benchmarks for sound. Obviously if they had all the time in the world, the amp would sound better, if they release it earlier then when they did it would worse...

There are a few objective marks thougth ... flabby bass should of been dialed out. Piercing treble should have been adjusted. After that tone is subjective and probably what mesa wanted from the amp roughly before it was shipped.

Funny thing with music merchandise is that if you steer to far from tradition your laughed at, if you steer to near your thought of as a copy...so at the end of the day its hard to find a line between both...

 

[SgtThump]

I think someone at Mesa thought the Stiletto 1 sounded awesome, so they released it. It gets out there on the market and die hard Boogie players can't stand it (because it's not a typical Mesa tone). Word spread like wildfire on the web about how horrible the Stiletto 1's sound and as far as I know, the amp lost all respect.

My guess is that they decided to make a Stiletto 2 to save their reputation or whatever and give the die hard Boogie guys what they wanted. I can't wait to hear a Stiletto 2, but I bet it has much more of that "typical" Mesa tone and isn't as unique as the Stiletto 1.

Then again, I'm talking out of my *** and probably have no clue. lol...

Chris

 

[Bobbypols]

I think someone at Mesa thought the Stiletto 1 sounded awesome, so they released it. It gets out there on the market and die hard Boogie players can't stand it (because it's not a typical Mesa tone). Word spread like wildfire on the web about how horrible the Stiletto 1's sound and as far as I know, the amp lost all respect.

My guess is that they decided to make a Stiletto 2 to save their reputation or whatever and give the die hard Boogie guys what they wanted. I can't wait to hear a Stiletto 2, but I bet it has much more of that "typical" Mesa tone and isn't as unique as the Stiletto 1.

Then again, I'm talking out of my *** and probably have no clue. lol...

Chris

I agree with you...you are talking out of your ***. HAHA just kidden, no your 100% right about boogie fans wanted recto gain...it didnt help that mesa said it can stand along side a recto. I personally dont think the next stiletto willsound more like a recto...i think it willsound more like a marhsall...more grind and fast tight resonse...im thinking jcm 800 plus a distortion pedal type sound ... and always with a bit of that boogie furryness that is trademark. Only time will tell, but i think it will be awesome...with all the feed back they have been getting.

 

[Silverwulf]

The Stiletto was far from being released early. In fact, they pulled it at the last minute and delayed it's original release date in order to add a couple more modes and do a few more tweaks. Thety made it sound the way it was intended to sound. I have no doubts about that. Almost everyone on Mesa's team was in agreeance over how great it sounded, and apparently lots of folks agree as evidenced by it winning editors choice awards in virtually every magazine it was reviewed in, as well as many reviewers claiming it would still be a great value if it only had the first channe! 8)

Now granted, the only "flaw" I would personally fix with it would be the bass response on the Fluid Drive mode. But as said, it's not truly a "flaw." It's just my personal taste. I'd like a little more gain on the "Tite Gain" mode, but it's not necessary. And for JCM 800 type tones, the "Crunch" mode already does it's job.

Everyone talks about how piercing the treble is...just turn the knob down. It's as easy as that. Like I said before, dial in a sound with your ears, not your eyes. I keep the treble in the 10 - 11 o'clock range the majority of the time, and that's no different than what I set it at on my JCM 800. This amp is everything as promised, and it can most certainly hang with a Recto in stock form. In fact, my buddy and I were using it alongside a Recto while jamming a week ago, using the "Crunch" mode on Channel 2 and no pedals in front (for metal). It has every bit as much gain as a JCM 800 does. It's not that there's anything "wrong" with the amp. Some people just expected different tonal results with it.

 

[musicbox]

Dead on Silverwulf. I've owned many marshalls, and I frankly can't see how much more marshall this amp can get. Those claiming that the stiletto 2 should sound more like a jcm800 with a boost...have you heard one? It's dead on the stiletto, right down to the amount of gain. Any more, and you're going to start loosing note definition. The stiletto 2 will probably be more compressed, more smooth, and a little darker, with a tighter bottom end. After jamming today with the band, all I can say is wow. This amp pegs the JMP marshall tone dead on, and sounds brilliant in a mix. My buddies rectoverb just gets lost, and he has to compensate by using rediculous volumes. For the music I play, which is in the veins of the mars volta, pretty girls make graves, minus the bear, this amp is perfect. If you don't like it, then fine. Don't go spreading this bullshit about it be released to early, or it having flaws. It has character.

large edit:

A couple reasons why the stiletto kicks marshalls ***

1. marshalls sound TERRIBLE at anything bellow cranked. the jcm800/jmp have very little preamp gain without a pedal, and to sound good, you need a big room with a big cab. the stiletto on the other hand, has wayyyy more gain, and sounds decent enough at low volums. its not a grainy flat thing, it has some harmonic complexity and some fluidity to it, even quiet.

2. marshalls do not have the option of tube rectifiers vs. ss or the variac. these change the way the amp plays not just sounds. there are very few companies that have bothered with this, and its a big selling point to me.

3. variable output! this was what made me buy the stiletto in the 1st place. in a 100 watt plexi, you have huge headroom, but not as much crunch as a 50 watt. the 50 watt when cranked, has no clean. the stiletto lets you have the best of both worlds. again, something marshall has never bothered with, per chanel.

4. a usable clean chanel with chanel switching. the jtm45 has a beautiful clean sound, and even the plexi, but they are single chanel heads. the chanel switching 800,900, and 2000's clean is flat and uninspired. the stiletto isnt lonestar/blue angel quality, but its more than usuable and has a few options for tone shaping. its better than marshall clean at any rate

5. why people keep asking for a boosted jcm800 sound is beyond me. you cant replicate the sound of a pair of transistors smashing the input stage of a guitar amp, with a preamp circuit, short of building one in. then everyone would complain its not all tube. if you want that sound, you have to get it the same way. use a boost. 12ax7's can only muster so much magic on their own!

6. a tone shaping eq! marshall eq's are useless for tone shaping. yes, you can add bass, like a graphic eq. you can even add some treble, but in terms of getting different tones, its useless. the stiletto's eq on the other hand changes the shape of the sound. adding harmonics here, taking them away here. you can get different tones out of the same amp, whereass the jcm800 has one sound.

thats my rant. if you've ever owned a jcm800, you know how useless they are at home, especially without a pedal.

 

[Guitarz_18]

Quick update, my band went into the studio this past weekend, I ended
up using the Stiletto for 50% of all the rhythem tracks and almost
all the solos. The combo of the duel recto and the stiletto is just
a monstrous tone. I prefer the stiletto for solo sounds. The funny
thing is, at the volumes I was playing, I really didn't get ANY bad tones
out of the stiletto, don't get me wrong, I've played it pretty dang loud
before, but I had it nearly full open in the studio and it really delivered
the goods.

 

[3wattamp]

No problem here..

 

[Silverwulf]

Quick update, my band went into the studio this past weekend, I ended
up using the Stiletto for 50% of all the rhythem tracks and almost
all the solos. The combo of the duel recto and the stiletto is just
a monstrous tone. I prefer the stiletto for solo sounds. The funny
thing is, at the volumes I was playing, I really didn't get ANY bad tones
out of the stiletto, don't get me wrong, I've played it pretty dang loud
before, but I had it nearly full open in the studio and it really delivered
the goods.

Great! Be sure to post some clips for us... 8)

 

[Guitarz_18]

Quick update, my band went into the studio this past weekend, I ended
up using the Stiletto for 50% of all the rhythem tracks and almost
all the solos. The combo of the duel recto and the stiletto is just
a monstrous tone. I prefer the stiletto for solo sounds. The funny
thing is, at the volumes I was playing, I really didn't get ANY bad tones
out of the stiletto, don't get me wrong, I've played it pretty dang loud
before, but I had it nearly full open in the studio and it really delivered
the goods.

Great! Be sure to post some clips for us... 8)

See this thread for one song featuring my recto and stiletto

http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?p=23800#23800

 

[MesaMc-G]

I just had to say...since no one else did, to the obvious

If you own Marshall's...why are you tryin to get a Boogie to sound like a Marshall? Just play the Marshall? Marshall made ONE great amp...the Jubillee...period.

If you want marshall tone...play a Marshall! Not bein a jerk...but...the idea seems WAY obvious. You want boogie...play boogie and let it sound like a boogie.......want Marshall tone...play Marshall

Hell...you want an amp that'l smoke just about anything..AND it's EL-34
Play a Bogner Uberschall...the "MANS"amp!hahaha Evan though I LOVE Boogie....the uberschall is just too sick.
peace