EMG's with the Mark V (yay or nay?)/Other pickup suggestions

[BrownieD2W]

I'll try and keep this short. I have a Gibson Explorer with stock pup's that I have been thinking about swapping out, they sound really good in any channel/voicing but they sound a bit fizzy at times and not quite as tight on palm-muted chords as I'd like. I have an EMG 81 in my Epi, I find it sterile for the most part, was wondering if others felt the same.

So my questions are:

- Do you guys find EMG's to be sterile with the Mark V, particularly sterile and unresponsive in the IIC+ voicing? And if you do, do you do anything in particular to compensate for it?

- I play mostly Metal/Hard Rock, so what pickups would you guys recommend me to consider IF I were to swap out the pup's in my Explorer.

- (I am open to any suggestions really, Duncan '59's, Blackouts, JB's, Mustaine's; DiMarzio's; etc.) Main thing I am looking for is a very tight sound, crunchy, crisp but still heavy, sharp but not to trebly, while also not being to sterile or unresponsive throughout the channels/voicing's.

- I am willing to give the EMG's a shot, but I just want to find out if anyone has had similar experiences with them being fairly sterile and unresponsive in most of the channels/voicing's except for maybe Mark IV/Extreme. I like the stock pup's in my Gibson, but I am always looking to improve if I can and with the holiday's coming up, I might have a chance.

 

[BrownieD2W]

If this is to long, someone just say so and I will just crop the living **** out of it. Seems like most of you guys like posts pretty concise.

 

[Ploki]

i find mark V's fizzy on some voicings too. particularly MK IV and MK IIc+ mode on CH3.
i swapped the V3 tube for an ECC81 and like it much better now.

I also tried to play it on an V30 (which i HATE by the way) and it sounded less fizzy than the C90.

 

[BrownieD2W]

i find mark V's fizzy on some voicings too. particularly MK IV and MK IIc+ mode on CH3.
i swapped the V3 tube for an ECC81 and like it much better now.

I also tried to play it on an V30 (which i HATE by the way) and it sounded less fizzy than the C90.

Thanks a lot for the reply. I suppose the fizzy aspect could be from the amp's side of things, but I was referring to the Pickups in my Gibson sounding a bit fizzy at times.

With the EMG's I can dial in settings I really love on the Mark IV voicing in Channel 3, and I loose that fizzy sound, but I kind of sacrifice the option of moving through the channels and voicing's because the EMG's sound really sterile, unresponsive, and flat in other voicing's/channels, almost feels like a struggle, the sound just wont open up at all. With the Pickups in the Gibson though, they sound great in any channel or voicing, but they get a bit fizzy at times and they don't have that really clear stop and start crunch on Palm Muted chords.

 

[sevycat]

I have not owned emg pickups since the 80's, so I can't offer any advice. As was stated in a previous post. Changing the preamp tubes may help loose some of the unwanted issues your experiencing.

I have changed out the v1, v2, and pi preamp tubes which yeilded great tonal and overdiven response. I can now use the 2nd channel in mark 1 mode and like what I am getting out of the amp. In channel 3, all 3 modes work better then before. I don't have to use the fat mode only in channel 1, I can switch between all 3 and for the first time I like the tweed mode. I hope this helps.

 

[SteveO]

My personal preference is lower-output humbuckers, with a pedal for boost when you want that little extra oomph. Hotter pickups are great when you run them with high gain, but they tend to fall short on cleaner tones.

 

[Rkorn]

I have the EMG 81/85 and the guitar has schaller, i prefer the schaller in any amp I played than my EMG.
The EMG is a schecter hellraiser
the schaller is a custom built guitar, and maybe this is why it sounds so good...

 

[screamingdaisy]

If your Gibson is stock it probably has the 496R/500T pickups in them... they're a higher output ceramic pickup that was meant for driving the piss out of Marshalls with more crunch/clarity than you'd get out of alnico pickups. Into a high gain Boogie that extra clarity translates into extra fizz. Try dialling back your guitar's tone pot until the fizz goes away. Also, if they're hot to the point where they're mushing up your pick attack, try dialling the guitar's volume knob back a couple of notches until it takes on more of a clear edge to it.

I've used EMGs with my Mark V (friends guitar) and I thought they sounded fine (some sort of Dean super-strat with an 81b/85n setup), although we stuck to the clean (fat) and lead (MkIV) channels so I don't know how they performed elsewhere. Also, I don't know if it's the wood in that guitar or what, but I thought they sounded really nice and warm on the clean channel.... even the 81 in the bridge.

My personal taste is vintage output PAF and overwound PAF type humbuckers, which I find track tighter/clearer than higher output passive pickups. It's not like the Mark V needs help getting distorted, so I prefer to back off slamming the front end and let the amp itself do all the heavy lifting. My SG has a pair of Gibson '57s in it and I find them fine for everything from wimp rock to thrash. My LP has Lollar Imperials, which are similar in a way to the Gibson Burstbuckers and they're good too. I generally prefer the sound of Gibson pickups to Duncan; I feel Gibson's sound more raw and basic whereas Duncan's always seem to be wound to achieve some specific tonality... which probably originated from some Marshall user and would totally make sense for them but for me and my Boogies it hasn't worked out so good.

Anyway... that's a really long way of suggesting you go with Gibson Burstbuckers... probably a II in the neck and a III in the bridge.

 

[boogieman60]

+2 on the guitar controls...you can dramaticly change the responSe of the amp by the guitar volume control. when amps only had 1 volume control (like the 4,000 $ Vibro King ) you set up your amp to get your Crunch / dirty sound and then Backed off the Guitar volume control to get your clean sound. Simple Huh?

 

[LesPaul70]

I think EMG's are great for certain kinds of sounds. And I also think that pickups are a minor part of the equation - in general, you can't completely kill a great tone with the wrong pickups, although the right pickups should help you find the tone of your dreams more easily.

That said, I wouldn't use my EMG-loaded Jackson for cleans or jazz or blues. Too lifeless and sterile. But I wouldn't put the entire blame on the EMG's. The basswood body and the floating Floyd Rose bridge definitely contribute to the problem.

If you are into the EMG-style sound but not quite happy with the actual EMG's, you should definitely look into what Bare Knuckle Pickups (a British boutique pickup manufacturer) have to offer. At least three of their pickup models are designed to offer a somewhat similar sound - but in a more versatile and organic passive pickup format:
- Miracle Man: scooped, modern, ceramic pickup, very much like EMG 81.
- Warpig: more like EMG 85, very hot, and awesome bass response. The basic pickup is an Alnico V, organic and somewhat loose (but not muddy), but you can also get this with a ceramic magnet for extra tightness and bite.
- Aftermath: their newest pickup model. I haven't heard it yet. Supposed to be an EMG 81 killer. Reputedly a very tight pickup, maybe somewhat drier than the other tw.

They also have many other very high-quality pickups worth a look.

There was a recent "best humbuckers" thread, you could read it for some ideas:
http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=49805

 

[BrownieD2W]

Thanks a lot for all the responses, I really do like the sound of the EMG's if I dial in the Amp with the intention of using only the guitar with my EMG's in it. I just find it very odd that when using many of the settings I find to be the best with my Explorer, as soon as I plug-in the guitar with the EMG's the tone becomes very sterile and flat, where as the Explorer was very full and open sounding, highly responsive. With the EMG's, especially in the IIC+ voicing, the tone just falls flat and like I said before its almost like its a struggle for the sound to come through. Switching to the Mark IV voicing this problem is alleviated, and I can dial in a brilliant, massive sounding heavy crunch, that becomes very responsive.

I like the tonal qualities of both guitars and their respective pickups, and I really do like the EMG's when I dial them in properly, they are very tight and almost all excess noise is gone. But I like the feel of my Explorer, so my problem I suppose is that I would like to lower the contrast between the two guitars on the same settings, but as I am saying this that kind of defeats some of the purposes of having two guitars in a way.

I guess I just like the feeling of finding a sweet-spot on the Amp and kind of want to be able to use that tone with the tonal aspects of either guitar/pickups and yet I find that that doesn't really work out. Its just weird that I can make the Explorer work with the EMG's settings, but I can't make the EMG's work with the Explorer settings.

So I don't know, just something I have been stewing over, I am pretty curious about Duncan Blackouts as well, but I have never found a guitar equipped with them so that I could try them out.

Thanks again for all the comments and keep 'em coming, and I will look into the Bare Knuckles, those seem to come up a lot lately.

 

[Rkorn]

I believe that the tone is a 3 way factor.
pick-up, amp, wood of the guitar.
Great wood will work great with any pick-up and any amp.
Cheaper wood will not work as great.
Mark V I believe sounds great with anything i played (Schecter hellraiser/EMG, Custom guitar with schaller active pick-ups, and the cheapest of all PRS).
But still, a better guitar will work best.
My friends custom guitar works best on his f.100, my 6505, my previous marshall... anything. Mine has a lot of fizz, no body at all... is just isn't as great. Still, on gigs, everyone says the both sound great.

Just 2 weeks before i get my Mark V!!!!!

 

[ryjan]

I've played through my friend's V with his Ibanez with Duncan's and with my Explorer and Eclipse both with emg 81's. I prefered the EMG's for the heavy stuff for sure and it was a wash for the cleans to me.

 

[Hendog]

I have the EMG 81/85 and the guitar has schaller, i prefer the schaller in any amp I played than my EMG.
The EMG is a schecter hellraiser
the schaller is a custom built guitar, and maybe this is why it sounds so good...

I am looking at that same guitar but I am hesitant because of 2 things...

1. No arm contour. Does it have a sharp edge like a Les Paul??? That is a deal breaker for me.
2. Gloss neck. Does it bind up or play smooth?


Any other input on the guitar would be great!

 

[Rkorn]

Gloss will be as smooth as new if you treat it... mine are all glossy... and they are all very smooth and keep like this for years.
some polish will take care of it once it gets rougher

 

[HeadlessAxeman]

Own EMG 81/81 on all my axes...and this is my short take on it..

Mod the 81's to 18V and lower the pickups from the string to sound very passive/organic drive.

Made the sound a lot more glassier, but not as glassy as I have heard on other passive pickups..but then my playing style is shred metal..so I prefer EMG's because pinch harmonics to mush...sounds great....if you prefer a lot of leadys stuff..You might find yourself falling a tad short and dis-satisfied with actives - as I have at times.

 

[BrownieD2W]

Thanks for all the input guys, I really appreciate it.

I still haven't really decided but I did take a look at the Bare Knuckles site and was just wondering if it was same to assume "The Warpig" is their "metal" pickup, or their equivalent at least? I kind of wish all the companies would do the outlines of the features/frequencies/etc of their pickups like Duncan does, would make it a lot easier for people who can't really try them out in person, would at least give you some comparison lines.

Anyway I thought I would go ahead and post the best setting I have found for using with my EMG equipped guitar, in case anyone was curious or wanted to try them out and let me know if they like the settings that way. It's the best tone I have found using my EMG equipped guitar, and in a lot of ways I really love this tone because its just the Amp by itself, no added anything. I kind of just stumbled onto this tone one morning, but it works great for Metallica's cover of "Sabbra Cadabra/A National Acrobat" tone.

Sorry had to draw it, camera is broken lol. Sorry for the shitty handwriting as well, it just says : Mark IV voicing, Triodes, 45w+ :

To kind of thicken it up a bit more you could add a little more bass around 125 Hz with another EQ, but it doesn't really need it. Let me know if you like it at all.

Thanks again for the responses guys.

 

[Hendog]

Gloss will be as smooth as new if you treat it... mine are all glossy... and they are all very smooth and keep like this for years.
some polish will take care of it once it gets rougher

I think you misunderstand why people DON'T like gloss necks. Satin and unfinished necks are much smoother to play and they dont bind up like gloss necks.

I am one of the guys who DON'T like gloss necks. So I was wondering if the gloss they use is smooth like a satin neck.

 

[magh8]

My main guitar has an emg 89 in the bridge and i love it with the mkv but tbh i haven't found a pickup that makes the amp sound terrible.i was playing around with my nephews pos small scale squire strat and still got a decent lead tone...lol

 

[LesPaul70]

I still haven't really decided but I did take a look at the Bare Knuckles site and was just wondering if it was same to assume "The Warpig" is their "metal" pickup, or their equivalent at least?

More like their downtuned extreme death metal pickup :twisted: although it is a lot more versatile than that, especially the Alnico V version. I can get great clean tones from it, never mind the 21.5k DC resistance.

I would say that all of their "Contemporary" humbuckers are metal pickups (or at least hard rock) of some sort or another. Just different pickups for different styles of metal/hard rock - classic, modern, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s, mid-grainy, scooped, tight, loose, Alnico, ceramic, etc. But if you are really interested in their products, definitely send an email to [email protected] and describe your gear and your needs, i.e., what you expect of your pickups. They will give you great advice - follow it and you really can't go wrong.

I kind of wish all the companies would do the outlines of the features/frequencies/etc of their pickups like Duncan does, would make it a lot easier for people who can't really try them out in person, would at least give you some comparison lines.

Have a look at this thread:
http://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=fd10b8bac839945da688d73c43349900&topic=21341.0