Distortion.

[Kill Em All 102]

Everyone knows that Mesa's are known for their great distortion. Am I the only person who's Dual Rect. seems to lack distortion? If anyone has any tips to improve on my Recto's dist. please let me know.

 

[mastora]

You are going to have to be a little more specific. Are you talking about tone? gain? volume? What type of style of distortion. and what are your current settings and guitars, pick ups etc.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

My apologies......I meant the lack of gain, I can barely get enough for even a Hetfield tone.

As for my Guitars/pickups.

I use a Gibson SG and an Esp Ltd V and M series.

 

[YellowJacket]

what are your current settings and guitars, pick ups etc.

^What he said.

Tube amps require input to distort well. Crappy guitar and crappy pickups = crappy tone. Write down your front panel settings and back panel settings since they ALL have an effect on tone. I have a Gibson Les Paul Standard and in my experience, the gain saturates well before 3 O'clock. With the lack of information we were given, it could be anything causing your problem from your guitar right through to the speaker cab.

 

[Heritage Softail]

Any effects in the effects loop, or front end of the amp? A weak battery of poor effects loop mix with hurt gain. Should be hair raising gain. I have a single rec, it gets plenty of gain/distortion. Was this a new amp or used amp? Sure your tubes are good? Should be able to get good gain with everything working/turned up.

 

[twothemax]

what type of preamp tubes are you using??

 

[ToneRanger]

I had the same problem with my roadster i found taking the gain to 2 oclock brought out the gain but i thought that was ridiculous taking gain that high on a high gain head,what i found was i took my master volumes to 1 oclock and used my output volume and brought my gain to 1 oclock and it worked and brought lots of saturation.

 

[Heritage Softail]

I heard others comment on cranking the gain seeming odd. I usually have the gain on my Single Rec cranked to 2 or higher. Past 4 it gets a bit fizzy but replacing the stock Mesa tubes with Tung Sols 12AX7s and SED winged C 6L6's it seems to have given a litte more usable gain. Just my opinion. I use the REC to go along with my MKV to add width and depth, so it is only there to be nasty/gain cranked. Crank it to where you like and ride.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

Well here are my exact settings and tubes.

Channel 3 Spongy 50% Dry/Wet
Presence: 10:00
Master: 9:00
Gain: 3:00
Bass: 11:00
Mid: 9:00
Treble: 3:00


I have the stock 6L6 tubes as well as the 5U4G Rectifier Tubes.

My Crate Blue Voodoo has so much more gain than my Dual Rectifier.

 

[YellowJacket]

What sort of guitar / pups are you running?

I've also heard it said that with Mesas,

Gain = gain
treble = more gain
mids = more gain
bass = anti flub, turn left to activete
presence = more gain

Turn the variac from spongy to bold.

If you are running a guitar with a weak pickup, turning the mids up will give you a lot more aggression and saturation in your sound. You have to list your guitars, pickups, and cab you are running so people can have an idea of what the problem might be. Also, how old is the amp? Is it new? Maybe it does need a retube? Can't know that until we know what sort of guitar and pickups you are putting through your rig.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

What sort of guitar / pups are you running?

I've also heard it said that with Mesas,

Gain = gain
treble = more gain
mids = more gain
bass = anti flub, turn left to activete
presence = more gain

Turn the variac from spongy to bold.

If you are running a guitar with a weak pickup, turning the mids up will give you a lot more aggression and saturation in your sound. You have to list your guitars, pickups, and cab you are running so people can have an idea of what the problem might be. Also, how old is the amp? Is it new? Maybe it does need a retube? Can't know that until we know what sort of guitar and pickups you are putting through your rig.

I'm currently running a Gibson SG Standard with a 490R and 498T. I've used an Esp Ltd V with active 81's in it but it only did so much to increase the Gain. I bought my Recto brand new 2 years ago. All the Tubes still burn great.

 

[YellowJacket]

I'm currently running a Gibson SG Standard with a 490R and 498T. I've used an Esp Ltd V with active 81's in it but it only did so much to increase the Gain. I bought my Recto brand new 2 years ago. All the Tubes still burn great.

Ok, now we're starting to get somewhere.

What cab are you running? What sort of a sound do you want?

I have a Les Paul Standard and in my experience, the stock pickups don't do great metal. Like it does a thick ballsy rock, especially when cranked, but it is just lacking in the super saturated tones. The SG will have less low end than the Les Paul so you won't need to back off of the bass quite so much to control the flub.

With the information you have given so far you might either want to a) run a boost to take your tone into Metal territory or b) swap the pickups out for something much more active.

One final question: Does your amp sound different than when you bought it. If you've been pounding on your amp for the better of two years, there is a distinct possibility that a tube or two might be wearing out. I've had tubes dead almost right out of the box, which is an experience many others have had as well.

Also, you might want to try a custom tube kit. Many of the guys here pick which preamp tubes they want to run in each preamp socket. That can apparently greatly reduce the much and tub of the tone. You can also try EL-34s for power tubes, since they are much more aggressive. The downside is that they wear out faster.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

I'm currently running a Gibson SG Standard with a 490R and 498T. I've used an Esp Ltd V with active 81's in it but it only did so much to increase the Gain. I bought my Recto brand new 2 years ago. All the Tubes still burn great.

Ok, now we're starting to get somewhere.

What cab are you running? What sort of a sound do you want?

I have a Les Paul Standard and in my experience, the stock pickups don't do great metal. Like it does a thick ballsy rock, especially when cranked, but it is just lacking in the super saturated tones. The SG will have less low end than the Les Paul so you won't need to back off of the bass quite so much to control the flub.

With the information you have given so far you might either want to a) run a boost to take your tone into Metal territory or b) swap the pickups out for something much more active.

One final question: Does your amp sound different than when you bought it. If you've been pounding on your amp for the better of two years, there is a distinct possibility that a tube or two might be wearing out. I've had tubes dead almost right out of the box, which is an experience many others have had as well.

Also, you might want to try a custom tube kit. Many of the guys here pick which preamp tubes they want to run in each preamp socket. That can apparently greatly reduce the much and tub of the tone. You can also try EL-34s for power tubes, since they are much more aggressive. The downside is that they wear out faster.

I Run my Recto through a Marshall 1960 Lead cab.As for what I aiming for, I'm trying to at least get a James Hetfield tone. Hetfield is a strong believer in running an Amplifier stock without any Overdrives and his tone is amazing. I've seen video's of him using the Dual rectifier live and his tone was very thick and had a lot of "chug".

Perhaps I will try some different tubes as you suggested. Does anyone recommend any tubes to start on?

 

[Spewnz]

i would say start with switching to bold power and turn the mids up a little mids are where the angry lives and if you after new tubes i suggest the mesa tube kit at http://www.dougstubes.com/tonekits.html

 

[ryjan]

Hetfield is also a tremendously talented guitar player. He can play Marks, Rectos, Diezels, Blackhearts, etc and he will always have the "Hetfield" sound. 75% of his sound is in his fingers.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

Hetfield is also a tremendously talented guitar player. He can play Marks, Rectos, Diezels, Blackhearts, etc and he will always have the "Hetfield" sound. 75% of his sound is in his fingers.

Indeed he is and I've been playing for almost 8 years so I'm not so bad myself. But his tone has so much more Gain even though he goes straight guitar to amp.

 

[ryjan]

Do you ever crank the volume up to band levels? Thats when a DR starts to breathe. Maybe you need to check out a mark series. I have a Mark IV and can get perfect MOP, AJFA, and Black album tones with nothing but the amp and at bedroom volumes.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

Do you ever crank the volume up to band levels? Thats when a DR starts to breathe. Maybe you need to check out a mark series. I have a Mark IV and can get perfect MOP, AJFA, and Black album tones with nothing but the amp and at bedroom volumes.

Most definitely, It definitely shines when cranked but it still feels like its missing something. Perhaps I will check out a Mark IV.

 

[ryjan]

Do you ever crank the volume up to band levels? Thats when a DR starts to breathe. Maybe you need to check out a mark series. I have a Mark IV and can get perfect MOP, AJFA, and Black album tones with nothing but the amp and at bedroom volumes.

Most definitely, It definitely shines when cranked but it still feels like its missing something. Perhaps I will check out a Mark IV.

Thats why I never bought a recto. They sound great for what they are meant for but thats all. The MarkIV just has my tone, although it took the better part of a year to dial it in. Let me know if you get one or if you need some killer settings to try if you demo one.

 

[Kill Em All 102]

Do you ever crank the volume up to band levels? Thats when a DR starts to breathe. Maybe you need to check out a mark series. I have a Mark IV and can get perfect MOP, AJFA, and Black album tones with nothing but the amp and at bedroom volumes.

Most definitely, It definitely shines when cranked but it still feels like its missing something. Perhaps I will check out a Mark IV.

Thats why I never bought a recto. They sound great for what they are meant for but thats all. The MarkIV just has my tone, although it took the better part of a year to dial it in. Let me know if you get one or if you need some killer settings to try if you demo one.

Thanks for your help. I will definitely get back to you if I decide to get a Mark IV.