Darkening the voicing of the 50/50

[petejt]

Hi, I have a Mesa/Boogie 50/50 poweramp.


I'm aiming for a really dark, low-growly type of sound. Grinding, roaring, really demonic low growl.

I have tried lowering the presence and using external parametric EQ, but they have not worked. In fact using parametric EQ just makes it worse.

The current valves are Mesa/Boogie str420s.

Would JJ KT77 valves darken the sound to what I want? What other poweramp valves could I use?

 

[TOOLGUY]

I thought JJ KT77 were type el34's?
Don't think you can use them in a 50/50.
A 6l6 type JJ will help a bit.
I have them in my 2:90 and they added fat to the bottom over the stock Mesa power tubes.

 

[elvis]

I doubt it's the tubes. The 6L6 has plenty of low frequency gain. You may want to alter the capacitors on the preamp tube bias to get more low frequency gain. I don't know why the EQ didn't help, unless you just boosted the lows across a wide band and made it all mushy.

My experience with heavy low end (via my 7-string) is that boosting upper mids and highs, and cutting lows with an EQ actually makes it sound more growly and tight in the low frequencies. I have my studio pre set for pretty low bass and mid, with the EQ set for a slight boost at 80Hz (super-low frequency), cut at low and mid, and boost at high and super-high.

 

[elvis]

Oh - and speaker and cabinet make a huge difference. If you have a speaker that is super upper-midrangey (like a V30) and stick it in a tiny cabinet, you will get no low end. Using a ported cab, or a nice big 4x12 will totally change the sound.

 

[Old BF Shred]

Mesa offered a 'deep mod' for this amp. Similar to a standard feature in the 2:90.
If you call them, they can send you the instructions and parts. (I don't recall the price, offhand, but not too much).

Also, they offer a power supply choke mod that gives you a bit more output overall (which certainly won't hurt the low end).
I have tried both.....the choke is great, but the deep mod came out...it really cut the highs too much, IMO.
But this may be what you want. You won't find either of these on their website...you have to call them, and, unfortunately, they are closed on Fridays.
You might find these to be the answer in your case..... 8)

And I find the 50/50 shares a trait with the Stiletto.....the presence needs to be kept down very low.

Good luck with that!

 

[petejt]

Thanks very much guys! Your advice has served me well, cheers 8) .


For starters I have now a quartet of JJ 6L6 poweramp valves in the 50/50. I first tested them in the MarkIV and they brought that slight darkness and thud that I wanted.

Secondly, as suggested, I've put both presence controls to 0.

The 50/50 is connected to a modified 4x12 cab, that has a pair of 12" ElectroVoice 200watt speakers. They have a broad frequency range rather than a spiky one like the V30.



And Elvis- indeed you are right. What I have done as an alternative, is to actually use a different preamp for the sound going into the 50/50, and believe it or not it's a little toy Marshall MS2 Mini-Stack! It naturally sounds quite pronounced in the high mids and lacking in the bass, as Marshalls do especially when just running to a single speaker. But I have it cranked right up, and into the 50/50 with the JJ 6L6s the tone is actually very dark and growly, pretty much just what I am looking for.

And about my MarkIV, I set it similar to your Studio Pre- low rotary bass level (2), high rotary treble, 80Hz is cranked, 240Hz is scooped, 750Hz is dipped, and both 22kHz and 6.6kHz are boosted. But I crank up the Lead Mid knob to 10, for a fuller richer sound. It's pretty chunky, very tight and powerful on its own, with that wicked searing top end, but some of the thud was missing from the lower lower mids, but now that is brought in by means of the Marshall & 50/50 .

 

[elvis]

Man, that is thinking outside the box. Cool - I'm glad it worked.

I actually did some recording thru one of those mini-stacks in the mid 1990's for a video game soundtrack. Out of sheer boredom, the engineer miked one with an SM57 and that's what we used. I double-tracked it all, and it sounded huge!

 

[scott from _actual time_]

glad you got it sorted, but i will add a couple things in case anyone is interested.

i got a nicely dark tone from my 50/50, although smooth rather than grindy, using russian 5881s instead of 6L6s. they were less bright, so the mids and lows came through better.

the Deep Mod certainly helps with that. but that mod has been stock on all 50/50s since the Triaxis was introduced, around 1992, so your 50/50 very likely already has it. you can tell if a 50/50 has the Deep Mod by looking through the grille on the right-hand side of the amp. if it has the mounting screws sticking out of the grille holding a little transformer-looking thing inside, it has the Deep Mod.

 

[petejt]

^^ I'll have a look for those screws- thanks!

 

[Old BF Shred]

glad you got it sorted, but i will add a couple things in case anyone is interested.

i got a nicely dark tone from my 50/50, although smooth rather than grindy, using russian 5881s instead of 6L6s. they were less bright, so the mids and lows came through better.

the Deep Mod certainly helps with that. but that mod has been stock on all 50/50s since the Triaxis was introduced, around 1992, so your 50/50 very likely already has it. you can tell if a 50/50 has the Deep Mod by looking through the grille on the right-hand side of the amp. if it has the mounting screws sticking out of the grille holding a little transformer-looking thing inside, it has the Deep Mod.

Fyi...that is the power supply choke. The deep mod is different entirely.