Cab Impressions-4x12 Recto Stndrd./Trdnl.(stiletto) & 2x

[mightywarlock]

I have too many cabs.

I started with a Marshall 1960a years ago and still have that one.

when i bought my Triple Rectifier, i bought it as a Full stack with 2 Recto Standard Straight Slants. Then earlier this year i bought a Recto 2x12. Sold my Triple, bought a Dual, sold the Dual bought a Stiletto Deuce II.
Bought another Standard, then decided to buy a traditional, so sold the new standard, and one of my straight slants.
Got the Traditional/Stiletto Straight last night.
first impressions at lower volumes was that it was very clear. Definitely not as much low end as a Recto Standard or the 2x12. Not as scooped. you seem to hear just MORE of the guitar and amp without the added boom.

i tried it with 3 guitars so far, and while i used to really like the sound of the 2x12, now i think i really like the Traditional better.

i need to do some recording soon to really make up my mind, but i think i will be playing out with the Traditional this weekend instead of my 2x12.

 

[Elpelotero]

keep in mind that the new Mesa cabs have DIFFERENT speakers than the old ones. The old speakers were 70watts and rated for more low end. Current speakers are 60watts and produce more midrange.

 

[mightywarlock]

i have the older ones.

it is rated at 280, not 240.

i couldnt imagine LESS low end from the traditional.

i feel it could use MORE. not as much as the standard, but just a bit more Umph would make it over the top!

as is though, it is ok.

it is really amazing when you a/b the different cabs though...you really hear the "scooped" nature of the 2x12 and the standard as compared to the traditional.

 

[siggy14]

The 2x12 should have alot more mid's and not be scooped. Less internal volume means more mids. My vertical 2x12 cab is very middy, to middy for me with the V30's. I am gonna experiment and put in 75's to see how they handle the 2x12.

Where the 2x12's lack is in the bass department.

i have the older ones.

it is rated at 280, not 240.

i couldnt imagine LESS low end from the traditional.

i feel it could use MORE. not as much as the standard, but just a bit more Umph would make it over the top!

as is though, it is ok.

it is really amazing when you a/b the different cabs though...you really hear the "scooped" nature of the 2x12 and the standard as compared to the traditional.

 

[AdmiralB]

Less internal volume means more mids.

Not necessarily, but even then you should be looking at internal volume per speaker. The vertical 212 has more internal volume per speaker than any other 212 I know of, with the possible exception of the Marshall 1936, 1966/2061CX, and Bogner OS 212.

 

[siggy14]

True, but they have less, and less speakers then a 4x12. Trust me I have a traditional straight here and a vertical 2x12 sitting right here in my room. THe 2x12 has way to much mid, to the point I can even dial them out there is so much and it is not pleasing to me.

Both cabs have the 70 watt celestion V30 speakers, the 2x12 is probaly from the Mid 90's, it has the grey tolex to match the DC series so I am assuming the first year they were produced.

The Traditional is from early 2000's before they switched over to the 60 watt V30's.

Less internal volume means more mids.

Not necessarily, but even then you should be looking at internal volume per speaker. The vertical 212 has more internal volume per speaker than any other 212 I know of, with the possible exception of the Marshall 1936, 1966/2061CX, and Bogner OS 212.

 

[AdmiralB]

The difference in baffles is significant. Uniplanar versus split sound different.

The speakers are the same, BTW. A Vintage 30 is a Vintage 30, regardless of 60W/70W. It's a matter of the way Celestion chooses to market them (warranty issues). Marshall "G12 Vintage" speakers are still rated 70W, but they're no different beyond the label and frame finish.

 

[siggy14]

Not true, i talked to a mesa tech, cant remember his name, but he said they had celestion design them with lower bottem end a little less mid's on the original 70 watters. But recently mesa switched back to normal 60 watt v30's due to that is where musicians where heading.

For awhile the orange cabs as well as marshall cabs were being used with Rec's because of the more midrange.

By the way, Avatar speakers have also confirmed this when speaking to them on the phone. They were selling the speakers for awhile, i think they labled them as 60L's.

The difference in baffles is significant. Uniplanar versus split sound different.

The speakers are the same, BTW. A Vintage 30 is a Vintage 30, regardless of 60W/70W. It's a matter of the way Celestion chooses to market them (warranty issues). Marshall "G12 Vintage" speakers are still rated 70W, but they're no different beyond the label and frame finish.

 

[Silverwulf]

Not true, i talked to a mesa tech, cant remember his name, but he said they had celestion design them with lower bottem end a little less mid's on the original 70 watters. But recently mesa switched back to normal 60 watt v30's due to that is where musicians where heading.

+1

BTW Sig, any clue if the newer cabs with 60W are made in England or China? I've never asked about the where the newer ones were made before.

 

[siggy14]

I beleive Mesa is getting from England, true way to tell is crack it open. There will be a little sticker on the side of the speaker, both from China and england, however the speakers from england, say england on that sticker, where the ones from China do not say either.

By the way, did you try the rackmount yet?

Not true, i talked to a mesa tech, cant remember his name, but he said they had celestion design them with lower bottem end a little less mid's on the original 70 watters. But recently mesa switched back to normal 60 watt v30's due to that is where musicians where heading.

+1

BTW Sig, any clue if the newer cabs with 60W are made in England or China? I've never asked about the where the newer ones were made before.

 

[AdmiralB]

Not true, i talked to a mesa tech, cant remember his name, but he said they had celestion design them with lower bottem end a little less mid's on the original 70 watters. But recently mesa switched back to normal 60 watt v30's due to that is where musicians where heading.

Can someone give me a T-number from an 'old' one? The TXXXX number that's stamped on the frame (on older ones) or on the paper build tag?

 

[fireonhigh]

The difference in baffles is significant. Uniplanar versus split sound different.

The speakers are the same, BTW. A Vintage 30 is a Vintage 30, regardless of 60W/70W. It's a matter of the way Celestion chooses to market them (warranty issues). Marshall "G12 Vintage" speakers are still rated 70W, but they're no different beyond the label and frame finish.

I think you may be right, i have a stilletto 412 on order and i called mesa 3weeks ago and talked with marcus, he tells me "we still get them from Eng. and that the 70watt rateing was a mis labeling they are all 60watts"... is there any way to check a speaker with a meter to find out the wattage? i know its not a big deal but it would be nice to see the truth! :wink:

 

[Elpelotero]

The difference in baffles is significant. Uniplanar versus split sound different.

The speakers are the same, BTW. A Vintage 30 is a Vintage 30, regardless of 60W/70W. It's a matter of the way Celestion chooses to market them (warranty issues). Marshall "G12 Vintage" speakers are still rated 70W, but they're no different beyond the label and frame finish.

I think you may be right, i have a stilletto 412 on order and i called mesa 3weeks ago and talked with marcus, he tells me "we still get them from Eng. and that the 70watt rateing was a mis labeling they are all 60watts"... is there any way to check a speaker with a meter to find out the wattage? i know its not a big deal but it would be nice to see the truth! :wink:

sounds like Mesa trying to pull a blanket over customers again...

 

[fireonhigh]

The difference in baffles is significant. Uniplanar versus split sound different.

The speakers are the same, BTW. A Vintage 30 is a Vintage 30, regardless of 60W/70W. It's a matter of the way Celestion chooses to market them (warranty issues). Marshall "G12 Vintage" speakers are still rated 70W, but they're no different beyond the label and frame finish.

I think you may be right, i have a stilletto 412 on order and i called mesa 3weeks ago and talked with marcus, he tells me "we still get them from Eng. and that the 70watt rateing was a mis labeling they are all 60watts"... is there any way to check a speaker with a meter to find out the wattage? i know its not a big deal but it would be nice to see the truth! :wink:

sounds like Mesa trying to pull a blanket over customers again...

yep.thats what i was thinking to, the dude is from customer service!!, any how i might load 2 75's in the cab for a little more lowend

 

[ibanez4life SZ!]

I'm a huge supporter of the traditional cabs....love them over the standard by miles!

 

[Silverwulf]

sounds like Mesa trying to pull a blanket over customers again...

+1

@ Sig, the rackmount sounds good so far. Need to mess with it more though. Didn't get a chance to tweak it at practice, but we've got it sounding about 90% there to how my other sounded so far.

 

[JAZZGEAR]

keep in mind that the new Mesa cabs have DIFFERENT speakers than the old ones. The old speakers were 70watts and rated for more low end. Current speakers are 60watts and produce more midrange.

Hmmm..that's not what I heard or read about the V30s.... What could have happened is that they made the V30 more efficient....so that you would get the same S/N ratio (db) with less power. In Lehman' terms, the new 60 watt V30 is more efficient than the 70 watter.

Otherwise, they sound the same. Also the mis-labeling theory could be in fact true.

 

[JAZZGEAR]

i have the older ones.

it is rated at 280, not 240.

i couldnt imagine LESS low end from the traditional.

i feel it could use MORE. not as much as the standard, but just a bit more Umph would make it over the top!

as is though, it is ok.

it is really amazing when you a/b the different cabs though...you really hear the "scooped" nature of the 2x12 and the standard as compared to the traditional.

You must have the Celestion 90s which are rated @ 90 watts, vs the old V30s which were 70 watts.

 

[JAZZGEAR]

Not true, i talked to a mesa tech, cant remember his name, but he said they had celestion design them with lower bottem end a little less mid's on the original 70 watters. But recently mesa switched back to normal 60 watt v30's due to that is where musicians where heading.

+1

BTW Sig, any clue if the newer cabs with 60W are made in England or China? I've never asked about the where the newer ones were made before.

The ones made for Boogie are made in England, according to Marcus @ Mesa.

 

[Silverwulf]

i have the older ones.

it is rated at 280, not 240.

You must have the Celestion 90s which are rated @ 90 watts, vs the old V30s which were 70 watts.

4 V30 @ 70W = 280... 8)