Best pedals to improve the Mark series overdrive tone

[invaluement]

I am a lifelong fan of the Mesa mark series starting from when I was in my early teens in the mid eighties and my guitar teacher had a mark-IIC+, it was amazing. Then, for several years I owned a Mesa Quad-4 preamp, and that was awesome too.

So now I'm seriously considering buying the new mark 7, but as much as I love Mesa Boogies, I have to admit that the overdrive tones I hear on things like the Friedman amps (SSv2, BE deluxe) and the Victory Kraken... sound a little better. I don't want/need death metal, just a wide range of classic/hard rock and blues, as well as 80s hair metal (Van Halen, Ratt, Night Ranger, etc). Those other amps I mentioned seem to have a more personality in their overdrive tones, but without the muddy/artificial sounds you hear in things like a line6 solid state amp (at least their older ones).

I would add 5150 to this list of amazing O.D. tones, but those sounds just a LITTLE too processed/artificial to me. Bogner was also close, but their tones are too dark/woody for me. Their Atma didn't have this problem, but it's too inflexible for many applications. (No midi, limited control from the footswitch)

But I'm convinced that these better overdrive tones were achieved via circuitry that's really more like having a light overdrive (like a morning glory) built in the amp, and if I'm right about that, then that's sort of "cheating" and in a sense, the amp is making decisions for you! I think perhaps the key here is that Mesa is more purist and trying to not try too hard!

Meanwhile, the flexibility and range of tones from a Mesa mark is amazing, the midi and built in load box, and IR cabs - all that is amazing. I really want the Mesa Mark 7, just with a little bit more personally in the overdrive.

It's possible that this is already solved with the new Mark 7 tones? Very few reviews/vids have covered that well yet. I'm curious about that.

So, does anyone have any suggestions for pedals that achieve this same tone goal? ...either where (1) the pedals is doing all the O.D. on the clean channel, or (2) where it's adding just a little bit of extra personally to the Mark amp's overdrive tones, but without being death metal - please specify that in your suggestions.

 

[strattex14]

I have a MKIIB and I run a TS9 or a VHT VDrive on the clean channel for a little more snap. It gives me the option of pushing it up, if so desired. All my modulation pedals are in the effects loop.

 

[invaluement]

Actually, this vid of the new VII setting is very close to what I've after! In particular, listen to the chord held out at 3:30 - except I wish I could reach through the screen and dial back the gain just a little bit. But I'm still wondering if there is a good gain-stacking idea that combines an overdrive pedal with the amp's built-in overdrive?

 

[woodbutcher65]

The amps that you mention are all from the Marshall lineage, all having their ancestry rooted in the model 1959 Superlead, which is a fundamentally, conceptually different amp than the Mark series Mesa concept.

The Marshall is a low gain preamp and to get it to grind, you turn it up and saturate the power stage. This gives a different set of harmonics than those you get by overdriving preamp stages, particularly cascaded preamp stages. While most Marshall derivatives today do have master volume controls, they're still built to emulate that sound only usually with some added preamp stage overdrive as well.
The base idea of the Mark series is preamp gains and tons of it, with an effective master volume control that lets you get a screaming tone without necessarily having to make the more sensitive ears in the audience run for the exits. Mesas are not known for their power amp stage saturation, not like Marshalls are.

In my opinion, you need both. Marshall tone is awesome. Boogie tone is awesome. Get both. Neither can fully replace the other.

 

[Acey Boy]

Actually, this vid of the new VII setting is very close to what I've after! In particular, listen to the chord held out at 3:30 - except I wish I could reach through the screen and dial back the gain just a little bit. But I'm still wondering if there is a good gain-stacking idea that combines an overdrive pedal with the amp's built-in overdrive?

Have you tried a Klon in front of a Mark series amp? Until I did I never really got the Klon hype honestly. The Klon on gain settings varying between 9 o’clock to around 3 o’clock on the lead channel of my Studio Pre/ 50-50 setup sounds phenomenal. It takes everything great about the amp and makes it better by an order of magnitude, string articulation, sensitivity and feel are so present. Also had a chance to demo the Klon into a Mark III and it was equally stunning. I’m not sure if you could get a Mark VII tone but I think you’ll like it.

 

[invaluement]

Have you tried a Klon in front of a Mark series amp? Until I did I never really got the Klon hype honestly. The Klon on gain settings varying between 9 o’clock to around 3 o’clock on the lead channel of my Studio Pre/ 50-50 setup sounds phenomenal. It takes everything great about the amp and makes it better by an order of magnitude, string articulation, sensitivity and feel are so present. Also had a chance to demo the Klon into a Mark III and it was equally stunning. I’m not sure if you could get a Mark VII tone but I think you’ll like it.

I will try that. Thanks! BTW - after watching a few vids about the Klon at the JHS Petals YouTube channel (highly recommended) - I've figured out that the actual original specs for the Klon are now in the public domain - so the arguments about paying $5K for a used/rare original Klon are a bit silly - there are clones of the Klon that are easily close enough - some possibly even a little better than the original. Thanks again for the suggestion.

 

[Acey Boy]

I will try that. Thanks! BTW - after watching a few vids about the Klon at the JHS Petals YouTube channel (highly recommended) - I've figured out that the actual original specs for the Klon are now in the public domain - so the arguments about paying $5K for a used/rare original Klon are a bit silly - there are clones of the Klon that are easily close enough - some possibly even a little better than the original. Thanks again for the suggestion.

Good point...mine is a Klone actually...BYOC Silver Pony 2 which adds some cool switchable options to the original circuit...there are other really good ones I'm sure.

 

[pjdude]

I very much like the grid slammer. Also acts as a 4th channel when run thru the clean channel.

 

[smunger4]

QUESTION...

I understand a boost needs to be in front and not in the loop. I am currently running a wah in front. Should the boost go before or after the wah?

 

[smunger4]

I am a lifelong fan of the Mesa mark series starting from when I was in my early teens in the mid eighties and my guitar teacher had a mark-IIC+, it was amazing. Then, for several years I owned a Mesa Quad-4 preamp, and that was awesome too.

So now I'm seriously considering buying the new mark 7, but as much as I love Mesa Boogies, I have to admit that the overdrive tones I hear on things like the Friedman amps (SSv2, BE deluxe) and the Victory Kraken... sound a little better. I don't want/need death metal, just a wide range of classic/hard rock and blues, as well as 80s hair metal (Van Halen, Ratt, Night Ranger, etc). Those other amps I mentioned seem to have a more personality in their overdrive tones, but without the muddy/artificial sounds you hear in things like a line6 solid state amp (at least their older ones).

I would add 5150 to this list of amazing O.D. tones, but those sounds just a LITTLE too processed/artificial to me. Bogner was also close, but their tones are too dark/woody for me. Their Atma didn't have this problem, but it's too inflexible for many applications. (No midi, limited control from the footswitch)

But I'm convinced that these better overdrive tones were achieved via circuitry that's really more like having a light overdrive (like a morning glory) built in the amp, and if I'm right about that, then that's sort of "cheating" and in a sense, the amp is making decisions for you! I think perhaps the key here is that Mesa is more purist and trying to not try too hard!

Meanwhile, the flexibility and range of tones from a Mesa mark is amazing, the midi and built in load box, and IR cabs - all that is amazing. I really want the Mesa Mark 7, just with a little bit more personally in the overdrive.

It's possible that this is already solved with the new Mark 7 tones? Very few reviews/vids have covered that well yet. I'm curious about that.

So, does anyone have any suggestions for pedals that achieve this same tone goal? ...either where (1) the pedals is doing all the O.D. on the clean channel, or (2) where it's adding just a little bit of extra personally to the Mark amp's overdrive tones, but without being death metal - please specify that in your suggestions.

I just picked up the beloved Boss SD-1 for my Mark V and have been very impressed. In addition to allowing for the "4th" channel through Ch1, it is really great in front of Ch2. I keep the drive setting fairly low (about 9:00). I Really resisted an OD pedal figuring I had more than enough gain, but it really seems to "tighten" up the overall sound.