Anyone know why Mesa discontinued the old Rect 4x12?

[screamingdaisy]

You know, the slant baffle/straight cab? Why'd the discontinue it?

 

[94Tremoverb]

No idea, but I always thought they looked really cool. One of the only designs out there that isn't just another boring Marshall copy.

It's the right way to do it as well, if you think about it - it's actually the *bottom* cab in a stack that's more in need of the top speakers angled upwards so you can hear them, but you can't easily stack another cab on top of a normal angled one.

(Yes, I have seen the famous Van Halen pic with the stacked cabs all upside down and whatever, but I wouldn't like to stand anywhere near it! I looks like it would all fall over in a stiff breeze.)

 

[fluff191]

It is a very good design. I had to get rid of mine (sans speakers) because it was just too heavy to move down my stairs by myself. One of the heaviest cabs I have ever owned for sure.

 

[58boogie]

In terms of sales, I would bet 4x12's are not that practical anymore. Too big for most venues and practice. Unless your are touring and playing outdoor festivals, and even then they are mostly there for "looks." I think most people have gone to smaller 2x12 or 1x12 cabinets.

 

[screamingdaisy]

In terms of sales, I would bet 4x12's are not that practical anymore. Too big for most venues and practice. Unless your are touring and playing outdoor festivals, and even then they are mostly there for "looks." I think most people have gone to smaller 2x12 or 1x12 cabinets.

Around here 4x12s are common. The only time I see a 2x12 is when it's a combo. Aside from the Mesa dealer the other stores don't even stock smaller cabs, and he says he doesn't sell all that many compared to the 4x12s.

The problem with the smaller cabs in small venues is that they're too trebly. Usually your rig provides the majority of the sound in those places, and once you turn up to match volume with the drummer a 4x12 is generally smoother and with better mids. The real problem (for me) is that I traded my old Recto 4x12 for an Orange 4x12 years ago, and the straight baffle makes it hard to hear the cab correctly on a small stage.

 

[94Tremoverb]

I do like combos and 2x12"s, but only because I'm a less-is-more kind of guy, and I've always thought 4x12"s looked too 'rock' whereas I prefer to be more 'alt' .

But the problem with a 2x12" is that you must have it raised up a long way or you can't hear it properly, and you end up dialing in a sound that's way too loud and bright for anyone unfortunate enough to be directly in front of it, especially on a fairly raised stage. The great thing about an angled 4x12" is that the top two speakers point up at the perfect angle for you to hear them - not too steep, like a tilted back amp stand usually does - and you don't lose the projection out into the room because the bottom speakers handle that. So it's like a cab with its own stand and sub built in.

In fact, I think that the overall result is the exact opposite of what you'd expect - you get a sound that you can hear better and that fills the room better at a *lower* volume than you do with a smaller cabinet, despite the greater efficiency. And as you said, smaller cabinets tend to be too trebly/upper-middy when they're cranked to drummer volume. I've tried all the combinations and I honestly think that the prevailing 'wisdom' that a cranked-up smaller amp is better than a turned-down large one is plain wrong. I've found that I get better tone and a better placement in the mix across the whole room with bigger amps than smaller ones. I've compromised at a 100W 2x12" combo because it's a single package that does everything I need, but I have to say honestly that the best *single* (not versatile) tone I've ever had at a gig was a 50W amp and a 4x12". But the 4x12" was a real bear to move, much worse than the Tremoverb.

 

[screamingdaisy]

I've tried all the combinations and I honestly think that the prevailing 'wisdom' that a cranked-up smaller amp is better than a turned-down large one is plain wrong.

First thing I noticed when I started using a fullstack was how much it reduced my volume. Not only did it thicken my sound but having a set of speakers aimed straight at my head had me laying way back on the treble. With a 4x12 I'd get a ringing in my ears all the time. Now it never happens (my last medical said my hearing has actually improved over the last 5 years).

Now I always dial in my amp with the speakers aimed right at my head and deal with the off axis sound. However, I'd really like to get another slant cab.

 

[R_ADKINS80]

For playing out I actually like using angled cabs laid on their sides with the angletowards the ends of the stage. Gives the people off axis something to hear besides muffled br00tulZ t0neZ lol.

 

[vitor gracie]

Somebody needs to tell me what IDIOT at Mesa Engineering decided to stop making THESE! (j/k)

I had one for a year. Coolest cabinet I have ever owned. I think this design is the most functional for stage application for sure. My writer has a recto 4X12 but I gotta tell you, if I could get these or find a used one again I would kill to have these on stage. There are better sounding cabs out there for sure, but functionally this beats all the boutique-ness of the others. I really miss my Mesa 2X12 Recto Wedge. JP, your a genius!

(*now if only Orange made a wedge like this...hmmmm...)

 

[Resonant Alien]

In terms of sales, I would bet 4x12's are not that practical anymore. Too big for most venues and practice. Unless your are touring and playing outdoor festivals, and even then they are mostly there for "looks." I think most people have gone to smaller 2x12 or 1x12 cabinets.

Around here 4x12s are common. The only time I see a 2x12 is when it's a combo. Aside from the Mesa dealer the other stores don't even stock smaller cabs, and he says he doesn't sell all that many compared to the 4x12s.

The problem with the smaller cabs in small venues is that they're too trebly. Usually your rig provides the majority of the sound in those places, and once you turn up to match volume with the drummer a 4x12 is generally smoother and with better mids. The real problem (for me) is that I traded my old Recto 4x12 for an Orange 4x12 years ago, and the straight baffle makes it hard to hear the cab correctly on a small stage.

+1. I tried and tried to live with a 2x12, mainly because of weight and size....but the sound I wanted just wasn't there. I even tried stacking 2 2x12s, trying to get the tone but maintain portability, but no dice. 4x12s aren't just about being bigger with more speakers - they actually sound quite a bit different than 2x12s.

The irony is that most 4x12s actually aren't that much bigger than 2x12s - unless you are going with the low-boy horizontal 2x12s. Both 2x12s I used to have had exactly the same footprint as my Stiletto 4x12, and were only about 8 inches shorter, so in terms of stage space, the 4x12 doesn't really take up anymore.

 

[MBMusicMan]

I have a 212 and a 412. I bought the 212 to take to people's houses for Jams etc, every time I go for a proper practise/gig, I feel like I should take the 212 but I know the 412 sounds that much better. It always comes with me, it's not my sound unless the 412's with me. Best cab ever. Screw that Orange crap, lol.

 

[screamingdaisy]

I read somewhere that the slant/straight cab was the original Recto 4x12 design and that the straight baffle came later.

Can anyone comment on that?

 

[YellowJacket]

4 x 12s are definitely not the same as 2 x 12s. I found traditional close back 2 x 12 designs to be very midrangey, trebly, and boxy. Nothing sounds as huge and phat as a halfstack. Moving more air definitely makes for a HUGE tone!!
Personally, I have absolutely no use for a 4 x 12 at this point in time so I looked around at different designs before settling on the theile. While the theile is good for lower volume stuff, I also have a mills style 2 x 12. The Mills style oversized 2 x 12 definitely gets into 4 x 12 territory, but the overall projection and pant flapping thump isn't there even if the loudness is. Generally, the necessary setup depends on the needs of the player. If one is playing in a volume sensitive situation with a good PA, it is best to go low power and smaller with a 2 x 12 or 1 x 12. This allows for tube breakup and a more cranked tone. For working with 'drummer' volume in small venues with underpowered sound systems, 4 x 12 is best.
In my current situation, I doubt I'll even be playing guitar much =-( School is 60hours a week of work and in our current situation, the Cello disturbs people far less so I play that more. Hopefully I'll find some guys to jam with!

 

[droptrd]

Somebody needs to tell me what IDIOT at Mesa Engineering decided to stop making THESE! (j/k)

I had one for a year. Coolest cabinet I have ever owned. I think this design is the most functional for stage application for sure. My writer has a recto 4X12 but I gotta tell you, if I could get these or find a used one again I would kill to have these on stage. There are better sounding cabs out there for sure, but functionally this beats all the boutique-ness of the others. I really miss my Mesa 2X12 Recto Wedge. JP, your a genius!

(*now if only Orange made a wedge like this...hmmmm...)

Yeah they do sound good and are very prcaticle. I got to play on stage with one once. It was the best ive ever heard my self without setting my amp to arcweld. Go figure...its a wedge

 

[mikey383]

I read somewhere that the slant/straight cab was the original Recto 4x12 design and that the straight baffle came later.

Can anyone comment on that?

I remember hearing that somewhere too.

 

[konstantine RK]

so no comparison to the straight straight Mesa 4x12's? I got two of the cabs in question here!!

 

[JCDenton6]

Phew! :shock: I'm glad the guy I bought my recto from had one to go with the head.

 

[94Tremoverb]

I read somewhere that the slant/straight cab was the original Recto 4x12 design and that the straight baffle came later.

Can anyone comment on that?

No, the original Recto 4x12" was an oversized angle cab with deckplate on the sides. METAL!!!!!!

 

[YellowJacket]

I used to have one of those. AWESOME!!!! It just wasn't the sound I was after.

 

[konstantine RK]

so what happened with Mesa's straight angled cab?